dreadnought110 Posted March 20, 2007 Share Posted March 20, 2007 A few years ago i almost went to work for a firm that did steam injection to improve emission's and power they went bust(the boss was spending money the firm hadn't got!!) just wondered if anyone knows anyone who does it still, they used to run a 110 200tdi CSW and it used to go very well with no smoke and pretty good mpg it's a shame it never took off they had a couple of unit's fitted to london buses and taxis the emission where reduced by at least 50%... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted March 20, 2007 Share Posted March 20, 2007 Easy done, you can buy kits and parts from tuning companies. MegaSquirt can control it, quite a few people are running it on turbo'd cars. ISTR it was a factory thing on an older turbo Audi or possibly a Saab years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polly_x Posted March 20, 2007 Share Posted March 20, 2007 Hi, I run water injection on my 500 BHP Westfield Cosworth Controlled by the ECU, it injects a fine spray into the outlet area of the intercooler straight into the engine. Helps keep air charge temps down. Doubt you would see much (if any) performance increase on a Landy unless you were already producing very high air charge temps already? First step would be to fit a bigger intercooler really. Stu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted March 20, 2007 Share Posted March 20, 2007 Water injection is not just to cool the inlet charge - as the water burns in the cylinder it releases oxygen (water being H2O) which helps the combustion process. That's my understanding anyway, it's a little bit like NOS but not as bling On a petrol you can inject more fuel on over-run to cool the turbo (and make cool flames out of the back ) but I don't think a diesel would have the same effect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polly_x Posted March 21, 2007 Share Posted March 21, 2007 On a petrol you can inject more fuel on over-run to cool the turbo (and make cool flames out of the back ) but I don't think a diesel would have the same effect. Youve been reading too many MaxPower magazines!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted March 21, 2007 Share Posted March 21, 2007 Flames on over-run for turbo cooling is proper style, I'm not about to fit a flamer kit to the 109 although it could be funny with side-exit exhausts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polly_x Posted March 21, 2007 Share Posted March 21, 2007 Flames on over-run for turbo cooling is proper style, I'm not about to fit a flamer kit to the 109 although it could be funny with side-exit exhausts Flames generated by that method are cool. My Westy once warm trails huge yellow flames from the side exit exhaust which is about 2 feet from your head!!!! Flamer kits are lame, although could provide some serious fun fitted to to a Landy!!!! Sort of removes the boy racer aspect. Imagine this with a bit of wind and the flames licking up round the arch and your head! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris890098 Posted March 21, 2007 Share Posted March 21, 2007 Used to be standard fitment on large radial engines only back then it was a water/meth mixture, the power increases were huge and allowed higher boost pressures for a given operating temperature. Mind you the ones i worked with were 54 litre engines fitted with two stage superchargers and the boost kick from a wet take off was awesome (allowed something like an extra 6 " manifold pressure from the same air/fuel mix) without engine damage. Don't know how much you'd squeeze from a 200tdi but an interesting project. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dreadnought110 Posted March 22, 2007 Author Share Posted March 22, 2007 I keep trying to find the leaflet's i had on the subject but i seem to remember that on diesel's the steam injection ensure's you use more of the fuel thats injected and less waste cause lets be honest i don't now about you lot but my Land rover flies when it's slightly damp i'll keep digging through me archives... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dew110CSW Posted March 22, 2007 Share Posted March 22, 2007 but my Land rover flies when it's slightly damp Probobly Aquaplaining... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigSi110 Posted March 22, 2007 Share Posted March 22, 2007 I'd agree with Dreadnought; my 110 (indeed, any car I've driven) goes much better on cold, damp days. Cooler, denser air entering engine coupled with the same for intercoolers does make a difference. Brunel and Allard to a water injection system - would love to have the £ for the job to be done on my 110. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted March 22, 2007 Share Posted March 22, 2007 As I said the kits are cheap, there are a lot of DIY installs out there using scrapyard parts (windscreen washer pumps & bottles) the only important bit is stainless steel injectors for the water. A MS ECU can run water injection stood on its head, you could run water & NOS, water & methanol etc. as staged injection and control the % mixture across different loads/speeds etc. Might end up almost as fast as a V8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polly_x Posted March 22, 2007 Share Posted March 22, 2007 As I said the kits are cheap, there are a lot of DIY installs out there using scrapyard parts (windscreen washer pumps & bottles) the only important bit is stainless steel injectors for the water. A MS ECU can run water injection stood on its head, you could run water & NOS, water & methanol etc. as staged injection and control the % mixture across different loads/speeds etc.Might end up almost as fast as a V8 You could make a simple DIY kit. Ive done it before. You need: This would give you a setup that was triggered by 2 inputs.......Boost and Throttle. You could do just boost but it costs next to nothing to add throttle. 1. Boost pressure switch (about 15 quid) 2. Microswitch to detect full throttle 3. Pref 2 high pressure pumps in series to create the pressure 4. Some high pressure plastic 10mm tubing (steal from local pub) 5. Some 3mm high pressure plastic tubing 6. A water injector (about 10 quid from ERL stockists) 7. Couple of relays, a switch for dash and some wiring To be honest though, there some decent cheap ready to install kits around these days that probably dont cost much more than this lot. Wire all this lot up so that when the boost and throttle switched acttivate the relays, the pumps are switched on and hey presto. A bit simple but it works. The reason your landies feel faster on cold damp days is purely down to air temp and density. Creating that cold and damp air is exactly water water injection does. You could add methanol, but its main use is to lubricate pump parts than give anymore significant performance increase. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bean Posted March 22, 2007 Share Posted March 22, 2007 3. Pref 2 high pressure pumps in series to create the pressure My understanding was that two pumps in series offers no more output of pressure becausethe second is starved by the first and is always "waiting" for the product to arrive. I work in the process industry and the principles i would have thought are the same. But please correct me if i'm wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WALFY Posted March 22, 2007 Share Posted March 22, 2007 Thinking outside the box here. Why not have the source and 2 high pressure pumps feeding into a single pump to get the pressure. Or would that not work. Only an idea Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOA 93 Posted March 22, 2007 Share Posted March 22, 2007 I'd agree with Dreadnought; my 110 (indeed, any car I've driven) goes much better on cold, damp days.Cooler, denser air entering engine coupled with the same for intercoolers does make a difference. Brunel and Allard to a water injection system - would love to have the £ for the job to be done on my 110. I think a little confusion is setting in here you can get plent of tech here http://www.aquamist.co.uk/ they even have there own forum. Allard and Brunel make air to water intercoolers (charge coolers) not water injection. Alot of the WRC teams use the aqamist system, but regarding turbo diesels I'm not sure they are as effective as they are with petrol turbos, where they are brilliant at delaying the onset of detonation. Also Subaru use a water spray externally on the intercooler to good effect, think wind chill on a wet day for its effectiveness. I think with turbo diesels you need to run with a fair amount of methanol in the water to be worthwhile. Kits for sale here http://www.turbobits.co.uk/acatalog/erl_aq...ion_system.html I think most of the big hp claims are from engines that had no intercooling to start with, maybe intercoolers can get too big causing a little too much lag so H2O injection lets you wring the last few HP out of the engine without losing any at the bottom end. Andy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbocharger Posted March 22, 2007 Share Posted March 22, 2007 I tried water spray onto the intercooler - it was only experimental but gave 50degrees EGT drop at 90mph/700degrees C, but no extra speed or perceivable power so I took it off again. I think the standard LR intercooler is ok for heat capacity because it's reasonably heavy, but heat soaks quickly because it's not that large. I'd be tentatively interested in playing with water injection if I could find a cheap (read "free") water injector. I can make the rest of the kit up easily enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headdamage Posted March 23, 2007 Share Posted March 23, 2007 Water injection sounds like it might be a good idea for a 19J to keep it alive on hard pulls and big hills. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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