pwam2006 Posted August 26, 2010 Share Posted August 26, 2010 Hi All, tjolliffe and I have been re jigging his challenge truck recently. One of the mods has been moving the britpart winch form teh front and putting it in the middle (behind centre bulkhead) my question is, this winch is expected to pull back, and ''up''. To do this we have a fairlead at the top, and at the back, the problem comes when moving the wicnh from back to top. The line would foul on one of the bars that hole the two sides of the winch together. We are therefore thinking, remove bar.... However we are worried about the winch simply pulling itself apart without this bar in. Has anyone had any experience with this? Will it be ok? or is extra bracing neccessary? Sorry, I thought I had a good picture to show what I mean, but I... don't, but hopefully I've been clearish. Many thanks Ryan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
treebloke Posted August 26, 2010 Share Posted August 26, 2010 Your winch will self destruct. Start again and leave the winch intact, find another way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retroanaconda Posted August 26, 2010 Share Posted August 26, 2010 Put a circular fairlead in the top of the cage, and a normal (but slightly widened) one at the back of the car. Add a vertical drop-in pin somewhere in line with this rear fairlead (mental strong like).Then take the rope back from the winch, round a snatch block (retained by the pin) and back to the centre of the truck (probably through another snatch block here) then up to the top fairlead and then terminate in a hook as normal. If you want to winch backwards, remove the pin and extract the snatch block, which will unwind the winch, then take the snatch block out to your anchor point. To winch 'up' or sideways, leave the pin in and just extract the rope from the top as normal. Bob's you're uncle. Obvious drawbacks, pulling in reverse would be double-line and therefore slower, and your rope won't go as far. Plus the rope would have to be within some kind of conduit probably, to protect it under the tub floor. Or just have two winches and keep it simple, I dunno! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redrodant Posted August 27, 2010 Share Posted August 27, 2010 Put a circular fairlead in the top of the cage, and a normal (but slightly widened) one at the back of the car. Add a vertical drop-in pin somewhere in line with this rear fairlead (mental strong like).Then take the rope back from the winch, round a snatch block (retained by the pin) and back to the centre of the truck (probably through another snatch block here) then up to the top fairlead and then terminate in a hook as normal. If you want to winch backwards, remove the pin and extract the snatch block, which will unwind the winch, then take the snatch block out to your anchor point. To winch 'up' or sideways, leave the pin in and just extract the rope from the top as normal. Bob's you're uncle. Obvious drawbacks, pulling in reverse would be double-line and therefore slower, and your rope won't go as far. Plus the rope would have to be within some kind of conduit probably, to protect it under the tub floor. Or just have two winches and keep it simple, I dunno! How about rotating the winch slightly , or putting a rollerfairlead / guid on the front ot it, and running the cable through this first Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pwam2006 Posted August 27, 2010 Author Share Posted August 27, 2010 Your winch will self destruct. Start again and leave the winch intact, find another way. This is the sort of reply i was ''hoping'' for. Nice to know before we try! We were thinking of bracing the winch in the same place, but from the outside. Such that in stead of a bar between the two sides of the winch, supports holding it together from the outside...? Thoughts on this solution? I like the idea of the roller fairlead, such that when its pulling back it goes straight through the fairlead, and pulling ''up'' it goes through the fairlead at ~ 90 degrees. The main thought about avoiding this extra fairlead was that essentially the rope would go through a tightish (albeit rotating) 90 degree bend immediately after the winch. Wondering whether this will just lead to rope death. Though I'm all in favour for the rope having a bit of a shorter life over having the winch explode! Many thanks for the replies, some excellent ideas (though couldn't quite get my head round Retroanaconda's idea while at work away from the truck!) , and almost certainly saved us destroying the winch! Ryan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Posted August 27, 2010 Share Posted August 27, 2010 To get the rop to spool onto the drum, you want as much room as possibly between the fairlead and the drum - Having it come off the drum, and then through 90 degrees round the fairlead would lead to issues with the rop bunching or fouling on the drum. If you are insistent on only using 1 winch, then I would go for a it pointing upward with a very small (possibly circular) hawse halfway up the back of the truck. This needs to be really well braced, as you will be putting some quite severe strain on it whilst wincing backwards. You can then make rope guides, like small fairleads at all the points you want to take the rope out - ie at the top corners of the rear hoop, and in the centre of the rear bed. Make them big enough to be able to pass the hook through! we did something similar for our centre winch - albeit without the rear component, and it works very well. As I say you would need to make sure the centre hawse is very well braced, as when pulling backwards, you will be putting a lot of strain in all the wrong directions! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pwam2006 Posted August 27, 2010 Author Share Posted August 27, 2010 Thanks Mark, Shall look into this option too, I found some pictures (not great) of what we've got so far. Our idea, (because its what we had and are runnign short on funds to buy more things) is leaving the fairlead on the rope, and moving the fairlead. So we ahve the rear arrangemnent as shown, and then on teh top of the rear roll cage hoop, some 10mm plate and 20 mm round bar. Such that we unclip teh fairlead from the back, and then clip it on teh top. The only problem being this issue of making teh rope go past the top bar of the winch. As ingenious and resourceful as we thought we were being, it seems this idea is taking a bit of a battering... What about takign that bar out of the winch, but putting extra bracing on the ''front'' and ''top'' of it? i.e. using two bars either side of the corner where the bar used to be? Cheers again, Ryan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Posted August 27, 2010 Share Posted August 27, 2010 I have no idea what sort of wall thinkness your box section holding the fairlead is, but I would be looking at bracing it back to something, possibly the legs of the cage, even if only using it as a rear winch. If you do brace it, then you could just think about adding some loops made of 20mm bar to the top corners of your cage (and possibly moving your hook keep) so you can just run the rope from it's current position up to the top of the cage, and out as a centre winch? faffing around moving fairleads souds like more hassle than it's worth tbh... The tie rods accross the top of the winch keep the drum square in the bearings, and aligned in the gearbox, along with the foot mounts. Any opportunity for the winch chassis to flex will cause binding in the winch, which believe me, you don't want! Bracing the winch leaving that area open seems to open up the oportunity for flex tbh... just a few thoughts Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pwam2006 Posted August 27, 2010 Author Share Posted August 27, 2010 Thanks Mark, Will spend the weekend staring at it and scratching our heads going on the replies here. Initial plan was to ''try it and see'' this weekend, glad we are now avoiding that. Will post the solution we go with when it has been applied! Cheers again Ryan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Posted August 27, 2010 Share Posted August 27, 2010 OK, really simple thought... how smooth are you welds at the top of your cage? Looking at your picture, you could just pass the hook up from it's current position, over the rear stay, under the x-brace, and then out over the top of the side roof bars.... take a die ginder, and a flap wheel, and smooth out the joints at the top there, and you have a built in fairlead.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sutty_32 Posted August 28, 2010 Share Posted August 28, 2010 How about using an 8274 style mount and bolting the winch to that, so the winch is effectively laid on its back. Then cut out the centre of the mount and brace either side. When pulling backwards your effectively pulling down as far as the winch is concerned, then when using as a centre winch it is pulling normally. I don't think you would be catching on any part of the winch then...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pwam2006 Posted August 31, 2010 Author Share Posted August 31, 2010 OK, So it came to the weekend of completing the centre winch.....then this happened.. Anyway, all fixed in one day and now runs fine again (phew) Here's what we settled on for the winch set up. A roller behind the winch that then goes up to the top fairlead. Tested it by rolling the truck onto it's side (as one would to get closer to a punch on a tree or whatever) and nothing broke or bent (well, at least not after we added mroe weld and metal to stop the 10mm plate bending :S) Cheers for the advice and ensuring we didn't blow up the winch! Ry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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