jackbw28

Vehicle age is '89. As a whole it's been changed quite a bit and now as a def spec 200tdi, R380 G/box and a rear axle off a puma. Front axle however is standard with the exception of later vented discs, callipers and diff. And today I'm very happy, just found time to swap the LHS stub axle and wheel bearings. Put the vehicle on the ground and the play is gone!! So the play I was feeling in the RHS after changing the stub axle that side must have been me feeling play from the left. very chuffed and another warning for pattern parts being more hassle than they are worth - they were machined to the wrong size as per my dimensions above! Thanks for the advice everybody and for the tip Dave.

Thanks for the advice. I've had another good look & feel including the rear - all good except for the existing play! Think I'll just wait until the weekend, change the other stub axle and bearings and see what happens. Thanks again all and I'll report back with what happens.

Thanks for the replies, I'm setting the preload using a common method (I think) that I've used successfully may times. With the drive flange off, road wheel lifted but still fitted to the hub I gently tighten the inner nut (with spacer fitted) whilst rotating the wheel. I tighten it a 'bit tight' then back off before re-tightening just enough to eliminate any play I can feel by rocking the wheel. I do this a couple of times for good measure and also tap the hubs with a soft mallet a few times to help ensure the bearings are well seated. Then fit the lock tab and other nut ensuring the inner nut does not move as the outer one is tightened... The thing is; the play does go away to what you can feel doing the above. All feels good and you can't get anything to move - but then put the car back on the ground and shake it side to side and there is a lot of play at the wheels!! I Think it's in the hubs but could be wrong... What typically causes a play felt at the wheels which can only be detected with the vehicle on the ground? No play when wheel is lifted. After checking all suspension fixings and bushing I still suspect hub/stub axle assembly over the swivels but it could be anything. Today I accurately measured the diameter of the bearing journals on my old and new stub axle as well as the inside diameter of the inner bearing race and think this could well be my problem and only shows up under load regardless of how tight I do up the nuts (I did test doing them up very tight!). Values below (mm): Old Stub: New Stub Bearing Outer Journal: Outer Journal 45.220 45.180 45.230 45.220 45.190 45.230 Inner Journal: Inner Journal 45.205 45.230 45.200 45.230 So, my bearings were indeed a loose fit on the old shaft - so much for pattern parts! My concern is now I still have some play on the side of the vehicle with the new stub fitted. I haven't got round to changing the other stub and there is still a lot of play that side. I'm just hoping the play I'm feeling on the new side is actually the play from the other side. I guess I wont know until I find time to change the other stub, but I've a feeling it's not the whole story...

Hi All, Just wondering if anybody has any pointers of where to look for a fault which is most noticeable as play felt in the front wheels when the vehicle is rocked laterally by the bumper with the wheels on the ground. I first noticed this back in Nov last year and assumed wheel bearings, however when the road wheels are jacked up off the road there is no play, even with a large pry-bar against a concrete floor. I've since replaced all bushes (inc panhard rod) and welded 'washers' over both panhard mounting holes as they were a little rounded. All suspension & steering fixings tight and all mountings in good condition. Only exception is lower front damper holes which need some welding to bring back to round. All ball joints are now slightly worn after only 25,000mi - I put this down to the play in the front wheels and will not replace until the play is sorted. Swivel joints fully rebuilt 25,000mi ago with new balls, bearings, bushes and pins. Preload set correctly with no seal etc. However, I did remove a shim recently as I started to get a steering shimmy occasionally and they seemed to have got a bit loose (tested after disconnecting all rods) after after initially doing the work. Pre-load not measured properly this time. Under the vehicle whilst it is being rocked laterally no play can be detected anywhere - none at all between the swivel ball and housing either at the top or bottom. None at any panhard rod mounting or the bracket that is bolted to the chassis via the steering box. Only place play can be felt is the the discs, rim or wheel. So, back to wheel bearings - I replaced them with SKF bearings and ensured the outer races were fully tapped in. Made no difference and the old Timken bearings were in good condition. However I did notice the bearing inner race felt a little loose on the pattern part stub axle journal, but didn't measure the clearance. Finally I ordered a pair of genuine stubs from the UK and managed to fit just one today (too much rain here atm!). The bearing is certainly a tighter fit on the journal. Whilst at it I replaced the bearings again (SKF) and inspected the hub itself for any damage - none to be found and the outer race is still a good interference fit, though again nothing measured. However I can still feel play on the wheel with the new stub, although it has reduced. The play on the other side is still of-course present and just as bad as it was before - which is quite bad. Only symptom's when driving is a slightly unpredictable brake pedal (again suggesting discs moving in relation to callipers pushing the pots in a bit), a light steering shimmy/vagueness if one wheel hits a hole or bump hard and some vibration at hwy speeds. Sorry for the long post, but any ideas folks?! sure I'm missing something trivial... Due to the above I'm convinced it's a problem in the hub/stub axle and not the swivels or a floating axle casing, but after today I'm a bit lost! Thanks.

I have done the same and it is a very easy task! Can provide more info if required but any auto electrician should be able to do it in a couple of hours. Otherwise its pretty simple to do yourself - the circuit diagram is available on-line.

Also, I have now done approx 10,000km since the instal and rebuild - and i can say that it really does work! I've just pulled a couple of hoses and found the hose from the standard cyclone filter a bit oily. It probably shouldn't be with only 10,000Km on a rebuilt engine but thats the way it is! The output hose from the ProVent is completely dry. Which is fantastic its working as intended. On a different note I did notice some oil leaking out of the turbo output pipe... Not very impressed and its definitely not coming from the crankcase! A quick twiddle of the compressor revealed considerable radial play in the turbo shaft! This was rebuilt with the engine... oh dear!

Ok Folks, here are some photos of my ProVent 200 install. I think I found a pretty neat place for it as it's nicely out of the way. Only downside is the long pipe across the engine bay. There are a couple of extra little brackets I made to hold the pipes and stop them flexing to much or rubbing against anything. It's close but all fits with no touching. The pipes are made from off the shelf items ( a few 90 degree bends, a couple of 45 degree bends a reducer and a few joiners). It is a bit fiddly setting up but the results are good. The drainpipe tee's into the drainpipe from the original cyclone filter then goes to the sum. I installed a check-valve to stop any oil going up the pipe, but this probably isn't really needed. Sorry the photos are so huge, I did 'downsize' them considerably...

I must say, that is a damn clean engine bay! bloody good job. As for the oil in the air intake system... I think the only way to do it properly is fit an extra oil catch thing. I finally settled for the Provent 200. It really is superb and drains the oil back into the sump so is maintenance free which is nice. But I understand after all that work you don't want more pipes! Perhaps the K&N thing might work... If it's cheap try it! I'll upload some photos of my installation when I can compress the image file size a bit!

Ok, a bit late I know, but I have finally got round to doing some tweaking. Sadly however I'm not too happy with the way its gone and would appreciate some advice! First I retarded the timing a little and left the pump alone. The engine was certainly quieter and revved up quicker - however no reduction in smoke or EGT (as expected). also a slight decrease in power. I did try retarding the injection timing further but just got white smoke so backed off. I then decided to go the other way and advanced the timing a tad. This had better results with smoke slightly down and EGT slightly down. But only very slightly. I then got a bit carried away and advanced it further! Now I thought I could notice more power on the highway but noise levels were up. Smoke still excessive (across the whole RPM range) and EGT high on hills. None of the above really cured my lack of mid-range power 1500-200 RPM. I then turned the base-line fuelling down (anticlockwise) by 3/4 a turn (in increments). Smoke and EGT now acceptable but power down! When I first drove the car like this I thought it was pretty good - seemed so on the highway. However on 'A' roads the power is certainly worse than before. I'm thinking this is to do with timing as I still get light black smoke throughout the RPM range so don't think fuel is being restricted. I didn't play with the diaphragm as I get plenty of smoke in the mid-range and simply adjusted the base-line fuelling such that I had a light mist of black smoke on full throttle. I still get black smoke throughout with this setting. Any ideas? I plan on putting the timing back to the stock setting and observing what happens.. Finally ... injector sealing. This could be the issue. I did change the washers after the obvious leaking photographed above. I did this before doing anything else - and though still smokey I had plenty of power. However I can now see the familiar trail of oil from No. 3 injector yet again! I'm just not 100% convinced its the injector or oil leaking from the rocker cover gasket... My old disco 200 never had issues with the injectors not sealing properly.. I will probably fit new washers yet again this week. Thanks, Jack

Thanks for taking the time to demonstrate the shortcomings of poor clutches Nige. Much appreciated and very interesting. Also, thanks to everybody else whose input has made me decide to import a LUK clutch. I'll be glad to know I'm going through all this effort for a part that should last some time! Unfortunately I still haven't had enough time to do much with the car as of late, fingers crossed she keeps running with the BB clutch fitted atm!

Not going too badly Paul, got a BritPart clutch in at the moment which is actually working for the time being, so at least I have a working vehicle which gives me time to sort out a proper solution. Thanks Ralph for the bearing number, that is the one. I had it filed somewhere... Oh wow, thanks Hybrid from hell - that will be very interesting, I look forward to seeing them. Also did you manage to confirm if your release bearing carrier/holder will work with the bearing part number above kindly supplied by Ralph? No rush really though, it'll be a couple of weeks before I order. On another slightly related note, I noticed dot 4 leaking down my brake pedal last night when I got home... I'm pretty sure this is a new development as I did watch the level and opened the cover on the pedal-box a few times during the clutch episode and found no leak. I'm going away this wkend but fortunately managed to source a TRW cylinder locally and fitted this evening. I'm of the mind TRW are still good, it cost 5* a birtpart equivalent! Changed the slave during my rebuild but left the master as it was only 3 years old... Jack

Thanks for the recommendations folks, Hybrid from hell; I'll get you that part number a bit later this eve so you can check to see if the skinny release bearing will fit your ss holder. Still a bit undecided about paddle/LUK clutch but either way I'll need to cobble together a parts order from the UK. Will update.

Thanks guys, Sorry for the late reply, haven't had much time this week. That is indeed a very good guide thanks very much for the link. I think I will do as snagger says and retard the timing slightly first before moving onto the pump. If/when it gets to the pump I will probably adjust the off-boost fuelling to start and go from there. The guide does mention the baseline fuelling adjustment on the rear face, albeit briefly at the end of the article. I need to double-check but the article suggests it's pretty easy to adjust off-boost fuelling, so much so I am tempted to just try that before the timing adjustment as it is quicker... I'll let you all know how it goes when I get about to making the changes.

Indeed Hybrid from Hell, Since this incident I did read that somewhere... When I bought it I did think I was getting a proper bit of kit. I do know the importance of it and try hard to source OEM spec parts. But, thought B&B were safe. Quite a shame to here about more and more of this, and sadly that is probably the problem. Just only 5000Km is ridiculous and I'd like to be sure i didn't f'up the fitting somehow! Well, I intend to replace the B&B pressure plate and britpart driven plate thats currently in there soon, don't ever want to be stranded like that again! I have managed to find a Valeo branded unit locally, but need to import the 'special' release bearing anyway so will probably import the whole lot. Another issue is with illegal fakes, especially where I am - even worse than the brand name being sold! So, yes, I'm interested in yours! Just had a look at your website - very good Buut, despite what your website says is a paddle clutch really that road friendly? I don't do any challenge stuff myself... One thing I would really like is a steel release bearing holder. Do you know if it will hold the 'skinny' release bearing I need? I can dig out the part number if required. Jack

Come to think of it actually; The driven plate would have got a hell of a lot of shock loading when it wouldn't release properly - starting in 1st etc. Also when changing gear with no clutch, I still depressed the pedal in some vain hope it would work... And sometimes it did (a bit) and it didn't re-engage smoothly at all upon releasing the pedal. At other times it just wouldn't work at all. I reckon that explains the final failure, to some degree at least. However, what caused it to intermittently not to release is a mystery. I imagine that is more controlled by the pressure plate, which upon inspection is fine. I am still using it on the vehicle now as it looked better than the new britpart pressure plate I pre-ordered.

Interesting. I would like to send it back to see what they think but its just not worth the cost from here. Bronze bush recently replaced is indeed still intact - fortunately. It was also wetted with oil as per the manual. It certainly wasn't slipping when driving, however I wouldn't really have known about it if it was dragging very slightly - but indeed after removing it there are no sighns of slipping. In-fact I am now worried my new clutch is dragging slightly... I suppose I do use low revs a bit, though not frequently or excessively low. I have been driving LRs for a good few years and never had this before so don't think its down to driving style (and hope not) . One rivet on the driven-plate centre has popped - not sure if that happened first or not though. I did consider too much pedal travel at one point, to the extent the clutch fingers came into contact with the driven plate and damaged it. Though, if this were the case I expect I would have heard it when I first depressed the pedal after installation. Certainly spring falling out is an idea, but again why?? Ive seen broken springs before, but usually they remain within the plate.

Hi all, another question. On my last trip in my rebuilt 200tdi powered 110, I needed a tow for the 1st time ever! I have a short bell-housing R380 fitted. The clutch is a standard tdi item with a slim release bearing. The vehicle drove fine for the 1st 5000km with the new gearbox and clutch; then... 1st symptoms were a very tight gear change after pulling off a highway going out of town at the start of a 2wk 4000km trip, vehicle was fully laden. I wasn't in a position/place to do much and forced her through 2 hours stop-start traffic before finding somewhere to pull over and check there was oil in the box, it was full of MTF-94 as expected. I then checked the clutch wasn't dragging, as best I could and it seemed fine - so I drove off and the gear-change went back to normal. I suspect now the clutch was dragging badly but stopped when I stopped. This tight gearshift came back every now and then for the next few days but was usually cured by a 5 minute stop with the engine off. Although it slowly developed a rattle in idle with the clutch up; then an intermittent grinding noise started when the clutch pedal was fully depressed. All the while I was working my way further and further away for civilisation... My 2wks leave is precious and didn't want to turn back! Eventually the tight gearshift got worse to the point where I couldn't select any gear at all... Problem, as I was a good few miles from the nearest tar road. I tried bleeding the clutch etc but in the end I drove the quickest route back to the nearest tar road with no clutch at all, starting the vehicle in 1st and matching road speed to revs as best I could. I then decided to drive to the nearest large town where I could find a half-decent garage, spare parts and a hotel. I hated it having no clutch, but managed 200km mostly in 4th. Then, finally it lost all drive - no noise or bang or anything dramatic, just no drive. This resulted in a getting towed another 140km the next day (which took 6 hours!!). But I had made it to somewhere where I could drop the box, and had a spare britpart clutch waiting (all I could get). I was relieved when the box came out and I saw the state of the clutch (was dreading mainshaft failure). The photos of the clutch are below and even though this happened a few weeks ago, I'm still at a loss as to the cause. It was a new Borg & beck clutch, had done no more than 5000Km at the time and was fitted the correct way round. I was driving very gently the whole time etc... So what do you think? Personally I can only suspect component failure, but have never seen a clutch fail like that before, esp on a standard car.

Thanks for your advice Snagger. Driving to and from work today and she is definitely going better with the injectors not leaking! Smoke is not too bad under high RPM with the turbo up and running. Its still pretty bad at the bottom end though. So, you reckon play with the pump first and leave the timing alone? I will try the smoke screw, but also wondering if there is a way to reduce fuelling only before the turbo kicks in and not across the board. Perhaps something around the boost diaphragm? I will try to get and read a bosch VE manual to fully understand this. I still don't want to loose power, I need as much as I can get. As much as I love this engine I do wonder if I should have attempted to fit a Td5 when I rebuilt the vehicle. Haha, the head is clean, as its all basically new/reconditioned - I'm trying to keep it that way, not an easy task - rocker cover gasket now leaking... Thanks Steve, All the pipework and air-filter was new 6000km ago, I even put a new air-filter in last week as the previous 'new' one was already all clogged up from 2000Km of dirt roads. The intake is still in an awful position and just sucks dust, yet to fit a snorkel. Jack

Thank you for the description of the diaphragm operation. And, judging by that, I don't only have an altitude issue as my pump should compensate for altitude until the boost picks up. My smoke is worst off boost/low rpm. Today I managed to prove to my-self two injectors were leaking, this issue was solved by replacing the copper washers. My head was pretty dirty so I cleaned it up and went for a 10 minute drive and found oily black deposits leaking from injector 1 and 3. No. 2 was also leaking but not as obvious, only no. 4 was clean. Despite fixing this I still have the smoke issue. Engine runs a little better, but not as much of an improvement as I was hoping for! I do hope oil is not the cause! I am now considering 'playing with the pump' to tackle the smoke issue, but ideally I'd like to know exactly what is happening... I do get high EGTs (even in the UK just after the work was done). I let it go to 800 C then back off on the throttle if it wants to go higher, and it will if I keep the power down on a long hill. I understand this is a bit high for this engine and the result of over-fuelling. Snagger, I'm very interested in your idea of retarding the timing a tad and think it preferable to altering pump settings but can you please give more info on why this would help? Come to think of it, I could have set it slightly out initially. I simply used a 9mm (i think) rod in the pump cog hole and then tightened it all up - however there was some play around the 9mm bar, I didnt think too much of it. Does anybody have any good links to the procedure of retarding the timing? Thanks again.

Thanks guys, Injection pump has been reconditioned by a bosch agent in the UK - should be to standard settings/calibration. I suppose it could be altitude, but I just think there is a bit more to it, due to the sheer volume of black smoke before the turbo kicks in. She is also pretty gutless until the turbo kicks in around 2000 RPM. I'm not 100% sure if this is normal or not though, can't clearly remember how she went before the engine rebuild but I don't 'remember' this issue. For example, going up a reasonably steep hill on the way home from work I HAVE to maintain an RPM greater than 2000 or the engine grumbles as if its overloaded and going to stall. This means I must down-shift and keep the revs quite high before up-shifting again, otherwise when I up-shift the revs will be under 2K and it wont go. Generally I have to drop down to 3rd when I reckon 4th should be suitable to maintain a half decent speed and allowing up-shift again. I need to get up to about 45mph in 3rd with the engine screaming before changing to 4th. Vehicle is a 110 and this happens un-laden. When laden its worse. I'm beginning to think injectors... I had a good look this morning and found some soot/oil around the recess where the injectors fit into the head. So they may not be sealing properly, though I cannot detect any gas escaping. The much could just be due to other leaks and carp falling in there though. Also, when I initially fitted these (recon) injectors cyl. 2 'injector' did leak and spray a load of oily muck over the bonnet. I simply tightened the clamp nut and it stopped but I had torqued the nut to the specified 25Nm initially. What do you reckon? Thanks for the description of how the pump alters fuelling with regards to the boost - interesting. Now retarding injection timing is interesting, that is where you rotate the pump body slightly? I can't remember how I set this initially tbh, I'll do a bit of research into it. Thanks.

Hi all, I know there is lots of info on this there but this is a little different and wondering if anybody has a bright idea to this one... I have relatively recently moved back to Kenya with my 200tdi Defender... I now live at 6500ft and my 200tdi has started to chuck out a considerable amount of black smoke. The engine is a recon unit, as is the pump, injectors and turbo - all done in UK and set/calibrated to standard settings. I set the timing and pretty sure got it bang on. I have the usual puff on startup, but then I get a hell of a lot at low RPM on load (pulling away etc). Once the turbo spools up the smoke is less, but still more than I think it should be. I did think it was altitude; less oxygen and the same quantity of fuel thus a higher ratio of fuel and incomplete combustion. However I think there is more at play given the amount of smoke. The fuel filter is new (though 'sedimenter' not checked in years) no fuel line leaks visible. I assume this to be a fuelling issue given the colour of the smoke and no/little oil consumption/contamination and only having 6000km or so on the engine. Engine seems to run well otherwise, though 'could' be low on power at the bottom end (before turbo kicks in) but this could just be how it is. I do also get relatively high EGT - 800 degress (before turbo) on a long hill under load. At low altitude (just been down to the coast at 0ft) the amount of smoke does decrease, though not to what it was just after the re-build. Fuel quality pretty good these days out here if you use the right petrol station as I do. So, any ideas as to what could be causing this? Finally, regarding the bosch pump - does it compensate for atmospheric pressure? It can detect the pressure from the turbo when it spools up and alter fuelling accordingly so I'd expect it to detect the change in atmospheric pressure that may occur at altitude... Or does it simply detect the change in pressure relative to atmospheric?? Thank very much to any ideas anybody may have, Jack

Thats what I did when I first installed a cooler. If you used an adapter plate with a thermostat you will need to run it up to temperature (apprx. 73-75 degrees) before stopping to top up.

Interesting. You could always check skin of the door you already have with a magnet. My '06' doors are annoyingly of the older welded type. When I got them I wanted very good doors and these were advertised as 06 - just ebay though. They were in great nick when I looked at them with no rust visible. After getting the card off for initial spraying I noticed a bit of rust (internal lower section) - I just coated it in oily grease sludge as didn't have time for a proper job then. 4 years down the line to today, and after a colour change I had them apart again for a 2nd re-spray and found the rust worse with a couple of small holes! Again Ive left it for now resigning myself it will have to be done again eventually - very expensive doors! From the above though, it seems as if my doors are not 06, but probably a couple of years older. I had no proof at time of sale - they just looked pretty good, and the guy seemed decent so I took it at face value. At the time I didn't even know there was a pressed type! If I were doing it again I'd make sure to get the pressed type with steel skins - clean the inside properly and coat in dintrol. Then I reckon you'll have a pretty good and long lasting door. A friend has an early puma with the later style doors and although I'm sure they can rust, even without any coating or treatment they seem to last better. The drain holes are better designed and more effective and obviously no electrolytic corrosion. And if the pressed rear door is anything to go by, its excellent. As for when they switched, I'm not sure. What year is your door as it sounds like they may have introduced the pressed frame first then swapped to a steel skin?

Not 100% sure when they were fitted from but reckon with the introduction of the puma. They are a pressed steel frame as opposed to the older welded type and use a steel skin as opposed to ally.

Excellent info, cleared that up for me, thanks. I'll leave mine as is for now, see how it goes (when its eventually back on the road) and possibly swap later.