Chriso Posted January 1, 2008 Share Posted January 1, 2008 Happy new year! I am attempting to help my mate who has a problem with his 300 tdi disco. He is up in the west highlands of Scotland so is a long way from home which is in Bala. Recently he suffered broken input gear splies and repalaced the main box with a second hand unit of unknown origin. At the same time he had the garage replace the clutch, including new fork, pressure plate and friction disc. Since then there have been; Occassional vibrations on the motorway, An increasing difficulty to select gears, although the box functions in all gears. The diff lock is not stuck in. Could be a clutch slave cylinder I guess, or is it possible that the garage damaged the R380 first motion shaft when mating it to the engine? Has anyone else experienced similar symptoms? Thanks Chris. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comical Engineer Posted January 1, 2008 Share Posted January 1, 2008 Since then there have been;Occassional vibrations on the motorway, An increasing difficulty to select gears, although the box functions in all gears. The diff lock is not stuck in. Could be a clutch slave cylinder I guess, or is it possible that the garage damaged the R380 first motion shaft when mating it to the engine? Increasing difficulty in selecting gears would sound like clutch hydraulic problems. Could I suggest pumping the clutch when changing gear? If gear can be changed easily when the clutch is pumped a couple of times then it's probably the clutch hydraulics. Could try bleeding the clutch as a first try or replacing the slave cylinder and / or master cylinder. The other possibility is that the clutch is sticking on the splines in which case it's out with the box again! IMHO it would be difficult to really damage the splines mating the box to the engine. You'd really have to try! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Night Train Posted January 1, 2008 Share Posted January 1, 2008 The input shaft may not be 'damaged' as such but if the box had been sitting for a while they could be rusty or just dirty causing the clutch plate to stick on the shaft. Maybe the replacement box is naff. It is also worth considering damage to the bush in the centre of the flywheel as that stablises the end of the input shaft. If the vibration occurs when he is driving he could try declutching momentarily to see is that makes a difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriso Posted January 7, 2008 Author Share Posted January 7, 2008 Hi again! Tim took his Disco to Lixtoll Land Rover and they confirmed that the clutch had burned out. They replaced the friction disc and pressure plate and slave cylinder. However, further tales of woe! Tim phoned on the way back south reporting vibrations and a difficulty in enaging gears. He describes a "tension in the box" windup perhaps? I guess that the root cause of premature clutch failure must lie in the R380. The tyres are all the same size, diff lock is out and I guess that front and rear diffs are of the same ratio. The Disco is now at my house and I wonder does anyone have any advice or experience to share before I pull the transmission apart? Thanks Chris. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paintman Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 Are you absolutely certain the transmission is not locked up? You could give http://www.ashcroft-transmissions.co.uk a ring & pick their brain. If it is going through clutches at that rate & there is difficulty engaging gears it suggests the input shaft is running out of true which could be down to Excessive wear in the input shaft bearing, Bent input shaft (usually caused by poor removal/fitting allowing the weight of the box or engine to 'hang' on the shaft & one of the reasons why I always use long removable studs to align gearboxes & engines), Damaged spigot bush (at the rear of the engine that the nose of the input shaft is supported by). If the input shaft is running out of true it will affect its relationship with the layshaft gear and the front of the gearbox mainshaft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stageonesimmo Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 Fair points Paintdude, but surely there's be a very noticeable vibration at all times with a damaged spigot or bent main? I'm still not convinced that its NOT out of difflock - I cant think of anything else that would cause the symptoms (its mainly the 'tension' comment thats niggling me as all other stuff would just give a very shaky truck or very rough changes....) I'm off to ponder....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimAttrill Posted January 8, 2008 Share Posted January 8, 2008 Hi again!Tim took his Disco to Lixtoll Land Rover and they confirmed that the clutch had burned out. They replaced the friction disc and pressure plate and slave cylinder. And the release bearing? And the fork? And the spigot bush? If they didn't he should demand that they redo the job properly. Did they check whether the input shaft was bent? Those clutch and brake places normally bend the shafts as they are not used to the weight of the LR boxes. The answer is not to use them as they stuff up more than they fix. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paintman Posted January 8, 2008 Share Posted January 8, 2008 Had a Ford Escort with bent input shaft. That did have vibration - but not excessive and none in 4th which on that box was effectively straight through the gearbox. A Granada came in with major vibration in all gears apart from 4th. When dismantled the input shaft bearing had disintegrated. The shaft gear was in a right state, as was the laygear! The owner said that the box had been a little noisy for some time, but the vibration had only recently started. And the symptoms given in his post are vibration and difficulty in engaging gears. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriso Posted January 10, 2008 Author Share Posted January 10, 2008 Thank you guys, a great response as always. Taking into consideration the replies on this thread, I have just driven the vehicle. When in neutral, with the engine running there is a swooshing sound from the front end of the gearbox. I am guessing, as others on the forum have suggested, that this is a damaged input shaft bearing. When I put my foot on the clutch, the noise disapeares instanly (input shaft stationary - no noise). Also I figure that the spiggot bearing is OK as it is not dragging the input shaft around. Also I am guessing that the input shaft splines are OK as the clutch disengages successfully. If the input shaft is running out of true, there will be vibrations at speed in all gears, right? All this would fit with an incompetently installed transmission, perhaps left to hang while they struggled to engage the studs. All this fits together when considered in the context of experiences detailed on the thread. I replaced an input shaft gear on my old 11A gearbox and it was very straightforward. Are there any pitfals with the R380? Thanks once again Chris. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 Is there a possibility the box just has the wrong oil in it? That could cause stiffness and difficulty in shifting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriso Posted January 10, 2008 Author Share Posted January 10, 2008 Good thought Fridge Freezer, thanks. However the gearbox has been refilled with Difflock's evolution MTF. Sadly no longer available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chriso Posted January 30, 2008 Author Share Posted January 30, 2008 Dear All, Just thought that I would update and close the thread. We had intended tho remove the transmission by first removing the transfer box and then the R380 as the two pieces are more manageable. We ran into problems however when we encountered a fastner that had been rounded off Tim took the R380 to LEGS of Oswestry for an exchange item and while he was there chatted to the guys about the problems he had experienced. To cut a long story short, it would appear that a TD5 slave cylinder push rod had been installed in error by a previous owner/technician. LEGS supplied a 300TDi one which is significantly shorter (see side by side photo). The theory is that this push rod has caused the clutch to be partially held off constantly. This has broken the spigott bearing up and damaged the first motion input bearing. Fingers crossed that this is all OK now. Well spotted LEGS too! Best wishes Chris. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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