sheltie50 Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 Anyone have knowlege of this tool, can it speak to my p38 95DSE. clunker! INNOVA 3130 C.A.N. OBD ii Glabal Scan Tool. Price looks interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffbeaumont Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 No idea about that specific tool, but what do you want it to do? I'd be surprised if a generic scan tool is able to cope with all the land rover specific features like air suspension. That said, it may be able to tell you the codes but not what they mean. It's a lot cheaper than the Blackbox products, which is the cheapest option I'm aware of that will deal with a P38 properly, but then it's also a good deal more limited. On the other hand, it'll work with other manufacturers and models and won't be limited to working with a single vehicle as the cheapest Blackbox ones are. It has to be said that the above is based on what I've read, having only just acquired a P38 I've yet to attempt to talk to it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RangeyRover Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 this guy is interesting as he's uk based http://www.ecufix.com/shop/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheltie50 Posted June 9, 2009 Author Share Posted June 9, 2009 Thank you for the replies, most interesting and to try to answer both, I have had some nasty timing/injection pump/running problems with my P38, as we speak its in a garage being interrogated, I would like to be able to speak to it in it's own language as it doesn't appear to understand northern islands FOUL Most interesting product which could help lots, where I live it's not easy to access some more specialist equipment and I would us a multi vehicle com type tool from time to time. Ive been looking for a way to use a laptop but finding very little. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Sparkes Posted June 9, 2009 Share Posted June 9, 2009 If I wanted to keep this simple I'd say you have more chance winning the UK Lottery (irrespective of whether you buy a ticket or not) than finding a Generic OBD2 Tool that will perform with a '95 Diesel 38A. And I'll include the '96 in that as well, just so you don't feel left out! Oh, also ignore CAN references. I think it was in '99-on vehicles that LR introduced CAN for chatter betwwen the auto gearbox and the engine. I'm pretty sure it was petrol engined vehicles only, but anyone who cares can read it up for themselves in RAVE, now you have those clues. For every reader, NOT specific to any individual. Justify that damning first statement! Ok, RAVE has an interesting section all about the E-OBD (European On Board Diagnostics). After you have selected Range Rover, select Technical Documentation, then EOBD. Start at the Introduction and`read on. It seems quite dense, but remember this is written for Land Rover Mechanics. If you have ever questioned their competance or aptitude you clearly think you can do the job, so you should be able to follow the contents of the EOBD section. An early sentance is "The OBDII standards have now been adopted by the European community and developed for the European automotive sector for compulsory implementation in 2000MY." Note the year. Later on we read "It was recognised that OBD for diesel engined vehicles was at a less developed stage and could not be fitted to all diesel vehicles until 2005." On page 15 we get to "E-OBD requirements for vehicles with compression-ignition engines", followed by "E-OBD requirements for MIL activation" and "OBD requirements for fault code storage", etc, etc. Bottom Line, OBD and EOBD were created to meet Legislation, not because Manufacturers thought it was a fun thing to do. In 1995 the Diesel legislation did not apply, so the manufacturers weren't forced to pay much attention. Obviously it became cost effective to make vehicles similar across the range, and an OBD socket was a useful point by which to interrogate all the systems on the car, instead of separate leads for each system, which is what the Classic had. However, don't mix up the requirements of OBD, which seem to be exclusively Engine based, and whole vehicle diagnostics, which is really what most 38A owners are interested in. If any reader wants an 'across the board' view on different Code readers etc I suggest they spend sometime on the Car Mechanics Web Forum. That's the Car Mechanics magazine. There are a lot of small independent motor traders on there who between them have tried all sorts of Code Readers. By now you may even find some people who have tried them on 38A's, although mainly they work on more bread and butter vehicles. I should add the rider that it's been 12 months or more since I visited the site, so there may be more 38A experience than I give them credit for. HTH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheltie50 Posted June 9, 2009 Author Share Posted June 9, 2009 Thank you, Most interesting indeed and really does back up the thinking that the early P38 is really just a pile of poo in disguise. Must remember that lottery ticket I have read quite a lot tonight and can see some problems, I'll contact a few suppliers and see what they think too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Sparkes Posted June 10, 2009 Share Posted June 10, 2009 " ... the early P38 is really just a pile of poo in disguise." Yes, it's an old car, the electronics date from the early 1990s, so 15 / 20 years ago. Other sources of information. RangeRovers.net run a Diagnostic Systems forum. The boss of Blackbox Solutions posts in there, but it isn't his exclusive play pen. Of course, the main thrust is the American Market, so not Diesels, but there are posters from Mainland Europe, so it is valid to ask the question, just as you have here. Others have, so their threads might be worth skimming through before posting. OTOH, if 'your' tester hasn't been mentioned before you have a good excuse for asking the question again. It's a Bosch diesel system, so think Diesel Specialist rather than Land Rover. I can recommend two, one in Kings Lynn, the other in Loughborough, but while I don't know where you are, I suspect neither of those help you. Bosch do a 'green box' tester that plugs into the OBD2 socket. I've seen it used, but haven't been hands on. I don't know how available this is on the second hand market. Good Luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheltie50 Posted June 10, 2009 Author Share Posted June 10, 2009 The result of a code reading and reset showed the fault 144 using Bosch Equipment, the only referance I can find to 144 relates to the immobiliser so no further ahead, Starting to think the FIP is shot, could be the "start of injection valve" I have one from another BMW pump, anyone changed one with success, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Sparkes Posted June 10, 2009 Share Posted June 10, 2009 Are you sure you mean the start of injection sensor? Look at RAVE Workshop Manual section 19. The start of injection sensor is part of Injector 4, the one that cannot be overhauled. There is nothing 'start of injection' that I can see in the pump. I have put a more comprehensive response in your 'Fault Code 144' topic. HTH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheltie50 Posted June 10, 2009 Author Share Posted June 10, 2009 Thanks for that I need all the help I can get, Im on an island in the north sea, some distance from serious equipment but with quite a lot of experiance. The result from a bosch reader was 144 which to be honest makes no sense to me, I understand the fourth injector relates to start of injection but think there is a valve in the FIP which alters the timing, acording to the reader the timing is "all over the place" Thanks for you time on this one without which by now I would have thrashed it with a tree branch !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geoffbeaumont Posted June 10, 2009 Share Posted June 10, 2009 Thanks for that I need all the help I can get, Im on an island in the north sea, some distance from serious equipment but with quite a lot of experiance. I'm guessing from your user name that that would be one of the ones you get to if you start from Fraserburgh and swim about NNE for quite a long time? PS - it's helpful if you fill in your location in your profile. If other people know roughly where you are they can give more useful advice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Sparkes Posted June 10, 2009 Share Posted June 10, 2009 Thanks for that I need all the help I can get, Im on an island in the north sea, some distance from serious equipment but with quite a lot of experiance. The result from a bosch reader was 144 which to be honest makes no sense to me, I understand the fourth injector relates to start of injection but think there is a valve in the FIP which alters the timing, acording to the reader the timing is "all over the place" Thanks for you time on this one without which by now I would have thrashed it with a tree branch !! What might be the cause is the 'Injection Timing Device', RAVE Workshop Manual Section 19 page 8. This is a guess, just trying to marry up the fault description to the named parts and function. Does make me wonder whether running a good dose of Millers Diesel Clean through the system would help. I assume the fuel filter has been changed, and the water trap drained. Millers Diesel Clean might be called Power Plus nowadays. Good Luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheltie50 Posted June 10, 2009 Author Share Posted June 10, 2009 Di you know I didnt notice my location was missing, but if you get on a ferry and sail for 14Hrs you will arrive in the Shetland Islands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheltie50 Posted June 10, 2009 Author Share Posted June 10, 2009 I have run injector cleaner through it with absolutely no change, Filter good, water trap MMM I need to have a looksee but again it should be ok, The timing unit is my thought, I have one on a pump from a BMW 525d, there is a filter on it, I think I will pull it and have a look. over recent months I have tried all sorts of things with little success but some things are basically just guessing. The engine came from a BMW car and everything was changed over, the pump ran well on the old engine and was a good starter giving me 30 Mpg on a run hence my thinking that it's timing related I'm getting around 19-21 now ! My old Classic fitted with 200tdi still starts first turn without heat, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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