Question for Dave @ Ashcroft

[daveturnbull]

Currently rebuilding a 90 for a customer - he has suppied a stubby R380 + oil cooler kit to all be bolted to his 200tdi.

Gearbox is in fine, but not the oil cooler kit. The blue ali box that goes on the side of the gearbox fouls the seatbox quite considerably. To make it fit we'd have to remove a fair sized chunk from the seatbox and tunnel.

Are you aware of this? Do you have a tried and tested workaround?

Cheers.

[32bravo]

I have the exact same issue with my 110 (1987 Ex Mod) here in Texas, just fitted the stumpy R380 but the oil cooler blue casting wont fit, what did you come up with? did Dave A provide a solution

[tacr2man]

hardly think a 200tdi would have the need for a oil cooler, full synthetic oil would be plenty JMHO

[CwazyWabbit]

hardly think a 200tdi would have the need for a oil cooler, full synthetic oil would be plenty JMHO

I would think it did actually need one in Texas

[pete3000]

I retrofitted a 300tdi/r380 to my 110 ex mod 1986, I had to modify the seatbox and replace the tunnel and plate that sits against the front bulkhead as well as the floor plates. The tunnel and plates are screw on/off job in 30 minutes or so. But modifying the seatbox required "more effort".

I used a scrap corroded 300tdi seatbox for the flange then gradually reduced my lt77 seatbox until it fitted the profile.

The r380 tunnel is quite a bit wider especially on the rhs as you are sitting in it. The area by the handbrake is the biggest lump.

Pete

[tacr2man]

I would think it did actually need one in Texas

Must have missed that in the OP , thought it was Bournemouth in Dorset , didnt know there was one in Texas , still debatable with synthetic eg Redline based on experience in Australia , which is fairly warm as well

[CwazyWabbit]

Must have missed that in the OP , thought it was Bournemouth in Dorset , didnt know there was one in Texas , still debatable with synthetic eg Redline based on experience in Australia , which is fairly warm as well

Fair enough, I was just going on the fact that Land Rover did fit gearbox coolers as standard on vehicles destined for hot places.

[32bravo]

Thanks for the info, my 110 is a 2.5 NA Diesel (Tithonus from Withams) its LHD and yes its b.Hot here, so my thought is anything I can do to help is worth it. It only had 1500 K on it from new but the original G.Box went bad pretty quickly once she started getting used for real, hence the change to the Stumpy R380

[tacr2man]

Thanks for the info, my 110 is a 2.5 NA Diesel (Tithonus from Withams) its LHD and yes its b.Hot here, so my thought is anything I can do to help is worth it. It only had 1500 K on it from new but the original G.Box went bad pretty quickly once she started getting used for real, hence the change to the Stumpy R380

, really do recommend the change to Redline Synthetic transmission oil , you shouldn't have any problems sourcing it seeing where you are

[32bravo]

As they say here I will "Git er dun" before the end of the week, many thanks for the advice, hopefull the "Daves" will have some re fitting or reworking the blue bit!!

[Jamie_grieve]

Thanks for the info, my 110 is a 2.5 NA Diesel (Tithonus from Withams) its LHD and yes its b.Hot here, so my thought is anything I can do to help is worth it. It only had 1500 K on it from new but the original G.Box went bad pretty quickly once she started getting used for real, hence the change to the Stumpy R380

Your gearbox shouldn't have gone bad that quickly, especially with a 2.5NA in front of it.

One common mistake made with new owners of Land Rovers with manual transmissions is that all of them with centre diffs in the transfer case don't take gear oil in the gearbox. That includes the LT77 variants of which the R380 is one.

We used ATF or hydraulic oil at a pinch in our fleets of 110's operating in Angola where it gets hot too. Out of around 120 mostly 300tdi but also a few N/A 110's we had maybe 4 gearbox changes over a three year period and the vehicles were used proper hard. Many were armoured and most had cracked chassis and bulkheads at some time in their lives to give some idea of the abuse they took. Most Land Rover gearbox faliures in my experience are due to improper maintenance and water ingress. The standard clutch will slip before anything breaks in the 'box unless it's worn or been run with gear oil.

Check the splines on the input gear on your transfer case if it's an early one to make sure it is the newer type of gear fitted or the splines will wear quite quickly.

Make sure you treat it to a heavy duty clutch fork when the box is out as the original is made of cheese and not fit for purpose. If you weren't made aware of this before hand and even if the box is back in I would take it back out and change the fork for a good one if you need it to work hard.

Good luck and have fun with it!

[32bravo]

Thanks Jamie, agree the original shoudnt have gone but it did!! and here in Texas theres not many (or any) who could rebuild it, even if parts were on hand, so an order from the UK was needed either way. Withams did try to help selling me another used unit with no warrantee hence the descision to by a stumpy r380 from Ashcroft which was the cleanest and fastest way to get her back up and running since she's my daily driver!

Cheers for the info, dont envy your time in Angloa - Ive worked in both Luanda and Soyo briefly and can imagine to some extent what you faced there!!

[Jamie_grieve]

Probably quite a sensible move to go with the Ashcroft box and being a stumpy R380 we expect to be reading about an engine conversion soon I suppose now it can handle a bit more power!!
I had the misfortune to receive a supposedly good replacement powershift gearbox for a Hydrema from a well known UK military surplus supplier just like Withams. They knew it would be 6 months in Angolan customs and any warranty well used up. When I eventually got it and drained the oil it was full of lumps of metal and a lovely golden colour of phosphor bronze floating on top. I think you saved yourself a lot of hassle getting that box.

[rick]

I'd fit the cooler, in my experience the things get bloody hot, regardless what engine is in front of them and regardless of what fluid you use, and again, just my experience, Redline MTL wasn't up to an Aussie summer, way too much bearing and gear rattle and the changes went to hell with any ambient close to or above about 33*C, which isn't that warm.

A mix of MTL/MT90 was better, but Castrol Syntrans 75W-90 shifted more cleanly on an up change.

All those fluids were toast by 20,000km with the beginnings of fluid shear. (Syntrans is good for 400,000km in large truck g/boxes)

Years ago I logged some temps on the bypass tube and it was up to 76*C in only about 5-6km of highway running from cold.

A cast iron case, a pump, gears and too small a fluid volume kills fluid quickly.

These days I'm running Motul Gear 300 75W-90 (I can hear the howls beginning now ) just to cope with the load/temps, an oil cooler is the proper fix.

[tacr2man]

Rick , maybe you were running the wrong Redline oil grade , I used and supplied and fitted redline in and with gearboxes in W.A. with ambients that quite often reached 40C+ and had no comebacks , including in R380 over many years . I still run redline in my 110 Lt85 that did 180,000 before rebuild , with no trans cooler. JMHE

[rick]

Naa, just found a couple of fluids that worked better for me

I've recommended Redline MTL to a few people, most like it, some didn't, and R380's can be idiosyncratic in their preference too.

I ran MT90 in the Patrol g/box for a short while and ended up using it in the LT230.

20,000km does seem to be the fluids life, a few of us on the AULRO board have noted shift performance has deteriorated and noise has increased regardless of the fluid used at that mileage. (kilometerage ??)

Tim Slako (the Aussie Redline importer ) and I had a few very long and in-depth phone chats on fluids quite a few years ago.

Did I mention I drive it like I stole it ?