300tdi "P Gasket"

[Jason2]

Any way Hi!

Just changed a knackered but non leaking fibre "P gasket" (P shaped gasket behind the water pump)and now new joint is pishing out coolant!!!!!!!!!!!

P gasket had previosly been leaking as there were marks down the block,changed the gasket at the same time as waterpump,cambelt etc

I suspect that it's New metal joint from local dealer,mating surfaces were not good but not totaly trashed!!Any one any ideas to whether joint should be metal or fibre or both???????????

[BogMonster]

Welcome

I had a feeling there is a later type of gasket which seals better, some sort of composite thing, did you use the latest type? Early 300s had problems with leaks here and I think the gasket specification was changed to stop this problem.

[Jason2]

Welcome

I had a feeling there is a later type of gasket which seals better, some sort of composite thing, did you use the latest type? Early 300s had problems with leaks here and I think the gasket specification was changed to stop this problem.

Hi BogMonster

The old fibre gasket I think had been leaking so long (I have just bought vehicle) that it had corroded the leak up but there were still traces of coolant down the block.

Thought that I would kill 2 birds with one stone whilst changing the cam belt,waterpump....etc and my local LR dealer supplied a steel gasket.

Looks like it's going to be back in bits again but any other advice would be much appreciated !!

Cheers

Jason

[Les Henson]

The one I did that's in the tech archive, had the newer steel type, and it had started leaking, so the modification isn't all that brilliant either. I put RTV sealant on the gasket faces as well, just to be sure.

Les.

[lunepilot]

Any way Hi!

Just changed a knackered but non leaking fibre "P gasket" (P shaped gasket behind the water pump)and now new joint is pishing out coolant!!!!!!!!!!!

P gasket had previosly been leaking as there were marks down the block,changed the gasket at the same time as waterpump,cambelt etc

I suspect that it's New metal joint from local dealer,mating surfaces were not good but not totaly trashed!!Any one any ideas to whether joint should be metal or fibre or both???????????

Hello

Had same problem when i changed my "p" gasket and water pump. First the replacement pump(which was after market type) had a groove in the mating surface and i had to file flush before fitting. Then after fitting new gasket and pump it started leaking about a month later. I found the 3 bolts that go through the pump and gasket had come loose. Nipped them up and no problems since,touch wood.

Hope this helps

Steve

[Jason2]

Hello

Had same problem when i changed my "p" gasket and water pump. First the replacement pump(which was after market type) had a groove in the mating surface and i had to file flush before fitting. Then after fitting new gasket and pump it started leaking about a month later. I found the 3 bolts that go through the pump and gasket had come loose. Nipped them up and no problems since,touch wood.

Hope this helps

Steve

Hi Steve

Thanks for the info!

Mine started leaking about a week after it was back together so it might be that??????

I reckon I'm going to clean Intercooler,inlet manifold and blank EGR valve off at the same time as the old girls done 117k and know for a fact that it's well grundgy in there and that it has not been previosly done!!!

I will let you know how I get on.

Cheers once again.

Jason

[NickHodgson]

I was told by a LR Dealer Mechanic that there is a black coating on the new type gaskets (PET part number) that the black coating on the metal gasket is supposed to bond when it heats up and that using silicone on this gasket prevents this action. Also you should ensure that the mating faces of the block and the waterpump housing are flat - you can sand the waterpump housing on some glass with sandpaper. Additionally down by the alternator there is another bolt for the waterpump housing you may need a piece of gasket to go there as a spacer so the housing is mounted squarely.

[Les Henson]

The one I did was bought new by the owner, and it had the black coated steel type fitted from new. The coating was still intact on the steel, none had transferred to either the egine block or the alloy housing. If it was supposed to bond with heat, then it was taking it's own sweet time about it, and as it was factory fitted, I have to assume that it was done correctly. I've done 3 of these now - all using the same method. No leaks so far.

Les.

[Jason2]

The one I did was bought new by the owner, and it had the black coated steel type fitted from new. The coating was still intact on the steel, none had transferred to either the egine block or the alloy housing. If it was supposed to bond with heat, then it was taking it's own sweet time about it, and as it was factory fitted, I have to assume that it was done correctly. I've done 3 of these now - all using the same method. No leaks so far.

Les.

Well well!! Beats the carp out of me!!

Cheers For your comments Nick, I had thought about re-surfacing and re-packing.

Still have'nt got hold of new inlet manifold,water pump gasket & a "New P Gasket" to attack the job but will be doing soon as it's costing me a fortune in coolant (5l a week)!!! Dont worry I have an eye on it and wont let the old girl get Hot and flustered!!

Suppose that I could give it a whirl with the old "Engineers Blue" to see if we are mateing correctly and think that I will have to put sealant on as it obviosly is'nt working with out!!!!!

Thanks all the same, Will try and get it sorted next week-Keep you posted!

[LS26]

The one I did that's in the tech archive, had the newer steel type, and it had started leaking, so the modification isn't all that brilliant either. I put RTV sealant on the gasket faces as well, just to be sure.

Les.

Don't know this paticular fitment (V8 me ) so feel free to ignore me, but have done pumps in the past using RTV sealant and it's great! (being an ex 650 Bonneville owner I love the stuff! )

Two things I'd to mention here:

1. I always try to use the correct torque on the bolts of any mating surface - I found out years ago (in my Triumph days) that overtightenning can be as bad as going the other way.

2. Gasket thickness is important for waterpump efficiency - don't be tempted to replace the gasket with RTV or (as I have seen in my past life as a back-street abortio mechanic ) put TWO in

Rog

[Jason2]

Don't know this paticular fitment (V8 me ) so feel free to ignore me, but have done pumps in the past using RTV sealant and it's great! (being an ex 650 Bonneville owner I love the stuff! )

Two things I'd to mention here:

1. I always try to use the correct torque on the bolts of any mating surface - I found out years ago (in my Triumph days) that overtightenning can be as bad as going the other way.

2. Gasket thickness is important for waterpump efficiency - don't be tempted to replace the gasket with RTV or (as I have seen in my past life as a back-street abortio mechanic ) put TWO in

Rog

Had every thing in bits again today and was highly tempted to do many things but tried to keep things simple!!

Started by smearing some of that liquid aluminium stuff across both faces that take the "P gasket" to fill corrosion wear on both surfaces from previous leaking gasket.Once dry sanded up both surfaces with wet & dry wrapped around a very flat object,checked with straight edge,ran a 8mm tap down bolt holes to make sure that they were clear also ran a reamer through alloy casing which was well bunged up to be certain the bolts are tightening the gasket up and not bottoming etc..... all back together with a new gasket with RTV sealant on both sides.Not leaking any more but that doesn't mean anything as it started leaking a week after I changed it last time!!!

Also took the opportunity to put a blanking plate on the EGR valve,clean all the gunk out of the inlet manifold,pipes and even gave the intercooler a good rinse with petrol at the same time.

Anyone know how to quieten noisy auxiliary belts???????

Thought that I had a noisy auxiliary belt tensioner bearing as it would sing now and again so I got a cheap bearing replacement off e-bay (as appose to changing the whole tensioner unit) but it turns out that its the belt that's noisy!!Only on start up then it disappears!

Fingers crossed for the gasket and a defiantly wont be celebrating for a week or two.

Cheers for all your help.

Jason

[LS26]

Fingers crossed for the gasket and a defiantly wont be celebrating for a week or two.

I'll cross mine for you too..

AAARGH! THAT's gonna hurt come the cold weather !

Rog

[lunepilot]

Had every thing in bits again today and was highly tempted to do many things but tried to keep things simple!!

Started by smearing some of that liquid aluminium stuff across both faces that take the "P gasket" to fill corrosion wear on both surfaces from previous leaking gasket.Once dry sanded up both surfaces with wet & dry wrapped around a very flat object,checked with straight edge,ran a 8mm tap down bolt holes to make sure that they were clear also ran a reamer through alloy casing which was well bunged up to be certain the bolts are tightening the gasket up and not bottoming etc..... all back together with a new gasket with RTV sealant on both sides.Not leaking any more but that doesn't mean anything as it started leaking a week after I changed it last time!!!

Also took the opportunity to put a blanking plate on the EGR valve,clean all the gunk out of the inlet manifold,pipes and even gave the intercooler a good rinse with petrol at the same time.

Anyone know how to quieten noisy auxiliary belts???????

Thought that I had a noisy auxiliary belt tensioner bearing as it would sing now and again so I got a cheap bearing replacement off e-bay (as appose to changing the whole tensioner unit) but it turns out that its the belt that's noisy!!Only on start up then it disappears!

Fingers crossed for the gasket and a defiantly wont be celebrating for a week or two.

Cheers for all your help.

Jason

Hello Jason

One of the theories as to why the belt squeels,is that the tensioner wheel is out of line with the belt. This can be put right by placing a packer under the tensioner body were it sits on the aux bracket either at the 9 0 clock position or the 3 0 clock position (depending which way it is running out) as you look at the engine from front of vehicle. I used an old set of feeler gauges,and tried 0.1 mm and worked up till noise disappeared. Ive had 0.6 clamped at the 9 0 clock position for the last 12 months with not a squeel to be heard since, including damp weather when it tends to be worse,and mine squeeled all the time.

Hope this helps

Steve

[LS26]

Hello Jason

One of the theories as to why the belt squeels,is that the tensioner wheel is out of line with the belt. This can be put right by placing a packer under the tensioner body were it sits on the aux bracket either at the 9 0 clock position or the 3 0 clock position (depending which way it is running out) as you look at the engine from front of vehicle. I used an old set of feeler gauges,and tried 0.1 mm and worked up till noise disappeared. Ive had 0.6 clamped at the 9 0 clock position for the last 12 months with not a squeel to be heard since, including damp weather when it tends to be worse,and mine squeeled all the time.

Hope this helps

Steve

Hi Steve,

Good tip - definitely one to remember... A nice one for the Land Rover Technical Archive perhaps?

Rog

[Jason2]

Hello Jason

One of the theories as to why the belt squeels,is that the tensioner wheel is out of line with the belt. This can be put right by placing a packer under the tensioner body were it sits on the aux bracket either at the 9 0 clock position or the 3 0 clock position (depending which way it is running out) as you look at the engine from front of vehicle. I used an old set of feeler gauges,and tried 0.1 mm and worked up till noise disappeared. Ive had 0.6 clamped at the 9 0 clock position for the last 12 months with not a squeel to be heard since, including damp weather when it tends to be worse,and mine squeeled all the time.

Hope this helps

Steve

Hi Steve

Thanks a lot for that "Top Tip",thought for a moment that I might have put the tensioner wheel back on to the tensioner bracket the wrong way round as it was squeeling more than ever yesterday but started this morning after a night of rain with out a sound-Weird!!!

To be continued.....

Cheers

Jason

[Les Henson]

Normally if you put a 1p coin in the 9 o'clockposition behind the idler wheel body it cures the squeal.

Les.

[Warthog]

Just out of curiosity, do any of you do the bolts up in a specifc order?

What i did was use gasket sealant on the block, let it cure and stick gasket in place. Then locate Aux mount and locate the 3 bolts into block around P gasket. Then placed the 15mm nut (tensioner location) tighten by finger. Then located the other 2 down the bottom, tighten by finger.

Then at this point back to the 3 around the gasket. Going around each one in turn and torque up to 18lbs. Then tightened the other three. What i notice, was the "Aux mount" flexed a small amount as the Tensioner nut and 2 lower bolts were tightened.

My point is, if the tensioner nut or the others were done up first. There could be a possibility of leaving the mating surface around the P gasket not sitting flush?

Generally at work, we have sequences on tightening mating surfaces together that are complex in shape.

Hope this is of use?...........I could easily be back here in a week swearing about it leaking

[Jason2]

Just out of curiosity, do any of you do the bolts up in a specifc order?

What i did was use gasket sealant on the block, let it cure and stick gasket in place. Then locate Aux mount and locate the 3 bolts into block around P gasket. Then placed the 15mm nut (tensioner location) tighten by finger. Then located the other 2 down the bottom, tighten by finger.

Then at this point back to the 3 around the gasket. Going around each one in turn and torque up to 18lbs. Then tightened the other three. What i notice, was the "Aux mount" flexed a small amount as the Tensioner nut and 2 lower bolts were tightened.

My point is, if the tensioner nut or the others were done up first. There could be a possibility of leaving the mating surface around the P gasket not sitting flush?

Generally at work, we have sequences on tightening mating surfaces together that are complex in shape.

Hope this is of use?...........I could easily be back here in a week swearing about it leaking

Thats a fair comment warthog!

When I took "ye old p gasket" out it looked like it had'nt been compressed at the top which is where it was leaking from, so I took special care in tightening up the 4 bolts that hold the gasket (especialy the top one) before tightening any of the bottom ones which could warp the caseing with leaky results!!!!!

[Jason2]

Thats a fair comment warthog!

When I took "ye old p gasket" out it looked like it had'nt been compressed at the top which is where it was leaking from, so I took special care in tightening up the 4 bolts that hold the gasket (especialy the top one) before tightening any of the bottom ones which could warp the caseing with leaky results!!!!!

Still no sign of a leak on the p gasket so I think I'm going to crack a few bottles in celabration (any excuse) !!!!!

The secret seems to be make sure that your surfaces are good,put a smear of sealant on both sides of the gasket and most importantly to tighten the 3 bolts around the joint first!!!!!!!!

Thanks for all your help.

Ps.Cleaning the manifold etc.... and doing away with the EGR has certainly made a differance but dont know what it's going to do for consumption as the old girl now flys like a rocket