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Calling all Electronics experts 12v AND Gate?


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As the subject line really…Is anyone aware of a discrete, ready-built unit that would operate as an AND gate, but with 12v?

I have tried to google this, but 1) Google does boolean search-strings (kinda) and 2) search for 12v Gates produces gates of the common or garden-variety!

I know I could use a relay as described in the picture below, and probably will be what I end up doing, but I was just wondering if anyone had an off-the-shelf solution?

Matt

post-20525-0-96072300-1331655566_thumb.jpg

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Any CMOS chip will operate on 12v. AND gates are rarely used however. Instead you use NAND (Not AND) where the output is inverted. To implement an AND gate, use a second NAND gate with both inputs connected together - which will invert the output of the first gate giving you a logical AND function.

The relay is simpler though.

Si

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What's simpler or more off-the-shelf than the relay?!

Its exactly what i have done on my truck. Have 12V and 24V circuits,both with battery isolators, so to avoid damage to either altenator, this relay will not let me start the engine unless both 12v AND 24v isolators are in.

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Oh and a tip for googling would be to look for 'Logic Gates' instead of 'AND Gates', they tend to be in families anyway so once you find one of the right type the one you are after won't be far away :)

Facepalm! I knew that...honest

Any CMOS chip will operate on 12v. AND gates are rarely used however. Instead you use NAND (Not AND) where the output is inverted. To implement an AND gate, use a second NAND gate with both inputs connected together - which will invert the output of the first gate giving you a logical AND function.

The relay is simpler though.

Si

What's simpler or more off-the-shelf than the relay?!

Thanks guys, you are both correct of course...I just wanted to ask in case I'd missed a trick. But yes a relay will be much quicker than soldering CMOS chips onto breadboard and heatshrink-wrapping the resultant assembly. Fortunately all I'm driving off this circuit is an LED.

M

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What are you trying to achieve?

If you need an LED to light when two things BOTH happen, perhaps one of them could work on the ground side of the LED instead and hence no gate needed.

Also try googling "relay logic", "transistor logic" for how-to's on making gates with discrete components.

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As the subject line really…Is anyone aware of a discrete, ready-built unit that would operate as an AND gate, but with 12v?

Any CMOS chip will operate on 12v

When you say 12V, do you really mean "from a vehicle's supply"? There's quite a difference between an nice clean 12V regulated supply, and vehicle electrics. Expect to see lots of spikes due to changes in alternator loading, windscreen wiper motors, plus voltage depression during cranking, and so on. I wouldn't want to run a CMOS device directly from the vehicle without some protection.

As others have said, particularly if this is a vehicle application - use a relay!

Kev

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When you say 12V, do you really mean "from a vehicle's supply"?

More or less - at least in this case. If it's just as an indicator - one LED lighting when two inputs are high then the odd spike or noise are not going to make much difference - the LED might flash briefly occasionally. The point was more that CMOS will be happy at the 12v to 15v you are likely to see - and unlikely to spontaneously die as a result of transient spikes. It is however crazy not to de-couple the power supply to the chip - for sake of a couple of Capacitors.

If the circuit were being used as part of a finite state machine controlling something more critical - then yes, you would need to bomb proof the power supply. However, it's still often useful to have it operate on 12v rather than 5v.

Si

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