o_teunico Posted February 8, 2014 Author Share Posted February 8, 2014 Marc, the idea was exactly that: wide axles with hi steer, enabling better stabiity and flat steering bar with the SOA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
o_teunico Posted February 9, 2014 Author Share Posted February 9, 2014 According to the Heystee (former TI Console) web page, Defender stub axles and CVs can be used with their disc brake conversion cukles. Additionally, with the use of Defender stub axles and CV joints + special shortened Defender half shafts, you can run the full time 4x4 gearbox set-up (Defender or Range Rover). If you going this route please specify this with your order. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 I just tried a RRC CV joint inside a regular series 3 swivel ball, but it doesn't articulate for steering without a fair bit of clearancing with a die grinder. The more rounded profile of Toyota CV's however will work. Does Heystee give instuctions on clearancing the swivel balls to allow fitment of Defender Cv's ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pollywog Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Heystee sell replacement stage one type swivel balls for the conversion. http://www.heystee-automotive.com/onlineshop/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=41_50_51&products_id=126 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
o_teunico Posted February 9, 2014 Author Share Posted February 9, 2014 If "early Defender CV" means AEU2522, this kit, used with wide axle casing and stock coiler axles, is what I'm looking for. Unfortunatelly "cheap" and "homemade" will no longer be part of the deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
o_teunico Posted February 9, 2014 Author Share Posted February 9, 2014 Series III balls compared to coiler balls. Standard series III balls grinded for AEU2622 (is this correct or it wanted to say AEU2522?). They are going to be fitted to a Stage I V8. Taken from http://www.stage1v8.org.uk/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1693&sid=4d01c25a8ec14f35343bf8e46825b2c5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
o_teunico Posted February 9, 2014 Author Share Posted February 9, 2014 Just another crazy idea: fit the coiler swivel housing upside down! Unlike series ones, coiler swivels have the same pins top and bottom, so in theory this could be possible. Only problem is that caliper will be lower and more exposed and the steering rod will not be raised as much as with the series arm relocation. Later Defender units, wich are universal for LHD/RHD, and fitted at the opposite side of the axle, will do the trick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_grieve Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 May be mistaken but the throat of the swivel ball appears a bit smaller than on regular series balls. May be to improve steering lock ? probably has disc brakes too. Well spotted, I just measured the Santana throat outside diameter at 64mm the same as LR coil sprung ones. I don't have a picture of inside the swivel ball to see the throat there but from memory it's similar in appearance to the early coil ones and uses the same kind of CV joint as the early one tens and has a ten spline half shaft. You can see the bronze bush exactly as you suggested they would. The stub has the wider bearing separation too like the early coilers for added reliability. The steering components are much heavier on the PS 10 than the series (or coil sprung) LR's as the bottom photo shows. For your high steer you could just bolt your Santana swivels onto your (early six bolt) coiler axle if high steering a coiler or alternatively swap the king pis top to bottom if you wanted to high steer a leafer with a spring over axle conversion possibly using the PS10's bent steering arms for added clearance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Well spotted, I just measured the Santana throat outside diameter at 64mm the same as LR coil sprung ones. I don't have a picture of inside the swivel ball to see the throat there but from memory it's similar in appearance to the early coil ones and uses the same kind of CV joint as the early one tens and has a ten spline half shaft. You can see the bronze bush exactly as you suggested they would. The stub has the wider bearing separation too like the early coilers for added reliability. The steering components are much heavier on the PS 10 than the series (or coil sprung) LR's as the bottom photo shows. For your high steer you could just bolt your Santana swivels onto your (early six bolt) coiler axle if high steering a coiler or alternatively swap the king pis top to bottom if you wanted to high steer a leafer with a spring over axle conversion possibly using the PS10's bent steering arms for added clearance. Thanks for all that Jaime, that is extremely interesting information. Now I really want to travel to Spain to Buy one of those Series V Santana LandRovers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Yep, series V axle is nearly 200mm wider and has discs at front. I really never realized that about the throat...will measure it next day. How the hell is a Toyota CV matched to LR shafts/flange? Due to LandRovers well known production tolerances, a Toyota 30 spline CV joint stub shaft will fit through some coiler Stub axles (spindles), and others may require boring out. 10 spline drive flanges can be brooched out to suit the Toy 30 spline shaft. The Star inside the Toyoata CV joint can be swapped for a LandRover Star, so the RRC,110, Stage One inner halfshaft can be retained. Just a different bronze bush in the Stub axle/spindle is require to suit the Toyota stub shaft. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_grieve Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 I think it'll be the PS 10 you'd be interested in, not sure. The series V has the same chassis as a Land Rover? but the same axles as a PS 10? The PS 10 has a very different and much stronger chassis. Wider than a series which is why the axles don't bolt straight on to a series Landy and isn't so good for articulation but of much heavier construction. The engine mounts for example are 8mm plate. The rails are 3mm and good steel. It's a lot heavier to shift around and do anything with and properly undersealed too. All the body mounts are in the vertical plane like most normal things so you could give a PS10 a nasty American bodylift. All the hardware associated with it is much heavier too like the U bolts and spring plates. Sorry being off topic for the high steer but many folks may not be as familiar with the Santana stuff so hope it's of interest. Check out the bent steering arms to clear the springs. Note the very substantial tow bar not relying on the rear crossmember for strength Chassis centre section is a nice lump of box section with a front bit and back bit nicely welded on. Similar but different to a series chassis. It doesn't look as obvious in the photo but the Santana parts really are much heavier and stronger and are made from better steel. The U bolts are springy not soft like the Land Rover ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 There is far too much leverage and off centre loading acting upon the steering arm bolts for that to work for more than 10 minutes on or off road. Even with standard steering arms my bolts/studs would work loose, snap or strip threads with the loads required to turn 36" tyres on portals, and I had to substantially reinforce the swivel assembly by bolting a piece of 50mm x 25mm steel up from the flattish surface (where the filler plug is on your photo) at front of the swivel housing, that captured the steering arm about 40mm behind the tie rod end socket.The other thing I would do with your idea is to have a double length swivel pin made to give the arm extra support. I only know how to post photos from my mobile phone to individuals or groups on facebook, so if you O'teunico have a FB account I could post a pic of the reinforcement to your page. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
o_teunico Posted February 9, 2014 Author Share Posted February 9, 2014 Santana basically used the same tachnique as in the Suzuki Vitara chassis they used to build. Series V chassis is 100% series III chassis. Take a series chassis, fit 5 speed box, parabolics and wide axles with front discs and you will have a series V Bill, you can find my FB at https://www.facebook.com/rodrigo.aresllamazares Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 If I have done it correctly O'teunico you should have received the photos. That PS10 is certainly a great piece of work Jaime. Hang your heads in shame LandRover UK ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie_grieve Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Now you mention it, it is exactly a huge Suzuki chassis!! On the last page looking at your front suspension you have vertical links on the front axle. Do they go to a chassis mounted anti roll bar like the old British Ambulances? I don't think you want your vapour build high steer arm higher than the top of the swivel to allow for chassis clearance when the axle is on full bump. The upside down coiler swivel idea has some merit if you used a link suspension system that cleared the track rod but would also reduce bump travel as it would be close to the chassis. Simply bolting on the Santana swivels to coiler axles might give the best all round result as long as the Panhard rod is happy with everything which I think it would be. I do like your idea for noticing how it goes together but looking at your swivel there, you could maybe use a couple of old a frames with the ball joints at the swivel pin locations and make an independent front suspension and a small car steering rack or centre mounted relay to go with your high steer on a lightweight buggy rather than a heavy off roader. This setup would have almost no bump steer with the rod ends located in line with the king pins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 You may notice on the photos O'teunico the extra long bottom swivel pin to which the rose jointed extra kingpin bearing is attached. That is what I would do to your upper steering arm.I would also scrap the Railko bushes and fit taper roller bearing to the top like most coiler swivels have.Railko's would have been ok if they were made tapered for adjustment, but parallel pin and bush is dumb and yet another maintenance liability. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
o_teunico Posted February 10, 2014 Author Share Posted February 10, 2014 Bill´s reinforced steering arm: Jamie, yes, those vertical rods are anti roll bars. I still have not built anything real enough to see if it clears everything at chassis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zim Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?showtopic=75414 Pictures don't work now. I'll post some here : Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zim Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 Hope that wasn't too many pics. It's for sale if anybody wants it. No shafts, just axle housing and modified hubs. You won't find stronger LR swivels. G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedLineMike Posted February 24, 2014 Share Posted February 24, 2014 did this for highsteer/full hydro on a d2 axle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
o_teunico Posted February 24, 2014 Author Share Posted February 24, 2014 Wow! Both works look great! Pictures are never too many... After measuring I´ve seen that fitting upside down, left to right swivel housing will do nothing, because drag bar is very near to the centre. Maybe something like this...(see pics in post #3). http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?showtopic=78971 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 It's for sale if anybody wants it. No shafts, just axle housing and modified hubs. You won't find stronger LR swivels. G "You won't find stronger LR swivels " Until someone fits Brit Part Blue Box cast chocolate swivel balls Nice work Zim and Discomike,for strictly offroad vehicles. How weldable is the SG iron of the swivel housings? If anyone tried to modify swivels in that way in Aus for a road going vehicle, they would get Life without Parole ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zim Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 The swivel housings are not easy to weld to. Took a bit of prep work and preheating with Ni rods. G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Noisy Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 Trying not to digress too much, but does this mean anything to you Zim? Happened to me twice now, Bill is well involved in the discussion already, just wondering if you have any experiences to share, please? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zim Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 Is Mr HFH to blame for this, you break something and assume i've done likewise :p :p We've not broken swivels like that before. Anyway, i'm really gentle with my drivetrain..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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