deep

Pretty much what I was going to say!

In that case, you would fully justify a nice, comfortable vehicle and something upmarket would be worth every cent! Though, being such a depressing lifestyle choice, you'd probably be too tired to care and would be a massive risk to other road users anyway. In this country, you'd actually be breaking the law.

And here we go again, trying to put a station wagon and a pick-up truck in the same market! I am interested in the original Grenadier precisely because it isn't a pickup truck and would be even more interested if it came as a van/hardtop version. I can't imagine that the majority of buyers were ever considering a pick up truck as an option. Yes, there is the Quartermaster (brilliant name) version but I don't think it was really intended to compete with the cheaper, mass-market pick-ups. However, I do see the case where someone wants something less easily destroyed than a Hi-Lux or Triton and, taking the long term view, would choose a Quartermaster - provided it actually is as tough and long-lasting as we assume it will be. When you look at the money being asked for older Land Rovers with 200-250,000 miles on the clock, I can see a Grenadier (with comparable appeal) still commanding a very high price when it's ten years old and done the work that would have killed two cheapies. The only real question mark is the BMW motor and they seem to be durable enough in most cases.

Read back through this thread...

A surprisingly objective review and far less pompous than his other ones I've seen. Even left himself a little vulnerable? And that '75 Range Rover! Lovely. The thing I got from his video that really stood out was the build quality. Having never seen one, I sort of assumed it was pretty good but you get a better feel from video. I still haven't seen one in the flesh (didn't accept the invitation to drive one because new house etc., ahem, wouldn't have been honest) but now I have a much better idea of how purpose built the Grenadier really is. Comparing it to a cheap pickup truck (which is strange enough anyway) completely misses the mark.

That doesn't sound right! There should be springs top and bottom and it's the adjusters that stop the shoes going back too far.

Minor disagreements of perspective aside, it's true that the bigger Land Rover products (the ones with north-south motors and transfer boxes) are more similar than different. If you take a new Defender, Discovery 5 or Range Rover for a drive, they will all be spacious, have great visibility, go quite well, handle decently and give you some sort of luxurious feeling (though nothing like an old school luxury car does). All of them have decent off-road potential, few will be used that way. You might say that one is geared more as a family car, another as a workhorse, another as a corporate or prestige car but they actually all fill all those roles. Of course they are different but those differences are deliberately created by stylists and are not major, intrinsic differences. Therefore, anyone paying the money is going to decide which to get less on which is more suitable for the task and more on either price, image or odd features that suit them better. The Disco 5 having such a forgettable design, it's no surprise if people choose a Defender (+D6, as most of us perceive it!) instead. If you are buying a Range Rover Sport because you can't afford the full deal model, well, get a Defender and you won't look like a cheapskate. And if you live out in the country and have a few acres, the new Defender really is the successor of the first Range Rovers anyway. Which is what really bugs people who didn't want that ...

Looks quite straight though. Depends on how long ago it was stripped down and if all the parts are really there (you can spend a lifetime tracking down nuts and bolts!).

Perfect! It will be interesting to see how well it fares in the long term, given their expectation of decades of service. My guess is that, some twenty years down the road, lack of availability of some plastic or electronic component, rather than any serious wear, tear or rust, will be the thing that scuppers it. God willing, I'll still be around to hear about it.

All good suggestions and not like I didn't think first! Because that particular lot needed careful stacking, it was easier to put the splitter right next to the pile and stack straight from it. It was also way easier to put the bucket by the rounds and drive them to the splitter than walking backwards and forwards. The next lot will be ground-stored, on the assumption I finish my shed this summer. In that case, it will be reverse order (splitter by the rounds, split right into the bucket). To be honest, the tractor is a bit big for enclosed spaces but we use what we have. Another great use for that splitter was as a 25 ton hydraulic press to straighten the bucket. It had quite the bow in it when I got it!

Ta. Got to say, using the bucket on the tractor like that is sooooo much easier on my poor old back!

I hope this uploads okay. Taken on Sunday and combining my tractor and my Land Rover, both still working for a living and sharing the task. The shiny, modern log splitter is a bit out of place but at least has a Briggs and Stratt engine!

Only a touch - the subject of this thread is largely put together by robots... (Sorry, couldn't help it!)

No, you didn't. My '80s vehicles fitted that description well.

There is always room for improvement in a vehicle design. In the weird world of trying to build something brilliant off road and amazing on road, manufacturers are always chasing new solutions. It's all very expensive and not unusual to see newer technology start in an expensive version, then trickle down to slightly cheaper versions. There is no actual cheap Land Rover any more, of course. Of course it's all highly irresponsible. All that waste and indulgence! It's how society works these days, as those who have the means and desire to indulge heavily also have the money/power to influence everything from manufacture to politics. Then the toys are seen by the less well-healed, who develop some sort of lust, which ends up fuelling the process. I really wish you could buy a basic new car and expect to get 30 years use out of it, like you could about 35 years ago...

I can empathise a little. When I turned 16, there was nobody else in the class under 17. There were always jokes about that in high school, including the nickname "Foetus". That nickname also referred to my enjoyment of playing the game "fives" with my feet as much as my hands (does anybody even remember that game?). Fortunately, though, I was very tall and the toughest bloke at school had my back, so there was very little bullying.

Mine is just a reference to my surname, which is a geological feature, combined with a reputation for being a deep thinker. Though most people are such shallow thinkers that they miss that about me...

Old tractors are just like Series Land Rovers! The charm is in the basics, then you want more comfort and convenience so end up with coil springs, disc brakes, wind up windows .... well, not so much but if you want the real charm, learn to use them as they are? I have two tractors here. A Massey Ferguson TEA 28 horse and a Fiat 880DT (88 horsepower, four wheel drive). The Fergie is a long term loan. I have driven them since I was 14 (so close to half a century now, ahem). I have mown garden lawns with them and used them to clear orchard prunings, driving right into the fire to unload them from the buckrake on the back. My favourite thing about them is they seem impossible to kill. Overload them and they will eventually stop, or not lift, but they are pretty hard to break. The biggest problem I have here is that the front is quite light. Put too much firewood in the back and I get quickly reminded that only the left steering brake works. Much less of an issue on the flat! I don't have much flat land. The "live drive" PTO isn't hard to live without. You learn to throw it into neutral when coming to a halt and how to synch the tractor and mower when starting off. It isn't hard but best learned with a lot of space around you! A bit more annoying is that the PTO has to be engaged to use the hydraulics, so you need to put it in neutral to lift anything. The little things are pretty stable and float nicely over the muck, due to their light weight. The Fiat is a completely different beast but still has electronic-free technology. It has so much grip and ground clearance that my Land Rovers can only dream of going the same places. Power, grip, stronger hydraulics and it's a dream to use. I use a front end loader, with either grader blade, mower or crane on the back. I have a very old, well worn but very heavy duty, 6 foot slasher and the combination is perfect. I unearth old logs, stumps and even concrete fence posts and the swing away blades stop any real damage. A sharp slasher cuts beautifully and needs less maintenance than a flail mower/mulcher but the latter is better if you are dealing with woody weeds. My one doesn't pile the grass into lines, it just chucks it all out the back in a fairly even fashion. A flail mower is more prone to taking the high points off your lawn and needs to spin quite quickly to do a nice job. My neighbour has killed three of them in his eternal fight against gorse! The best thing with old tractors is that they don't need to be stored in a shed. True story...

A completely reasonable protection "racket" though!

So much negativity! It looks like this is a real vehicle that will be for sale very soon (but maybe only in China for a while?). It's conceptually the way things are going in the world and, if the specs are true, actually overcomes some of the anxiety about electric cars. Yes, it's ugly but only because it looks like the new Defender, which is also ugly. Who cares? We are all getting used to the new Defender and, quite possibly, the Chinese market could find it gorgeous! Rather than mocking something like this, we should worry. The technological advantage is being taken away from Land Rover and the modern take on "luxury" is no longer the Range Rover domain. This thing could easily spawn a cheaper version which would comfortably outsell the new Defender. The Chinese aren't idiots and not everything they make is rubbish. Check out how well the GWM Tank does, for example. That float mode may seem like a gimmick but it hints at very high manufacturing tolerances. Not to be sneezed at.

Nice spec and colour on that "90". I can see it being as practical as a modern Land Rover can get. Glad it's giving a good run. We don't have those zones here and I haven't seen talk of them but we do have the problem of increasing numbers of freeloaders not paying their way in their electric cars, which REALLY has to stop soon! It's basically a case of the poor and the workers subsidising the wealthy as it stands.

You can easily check a thermostat by plonking it in a cup of very warm water with a thermometer in it. Then add boiling water and note the temperature(s) that the thermostat opens and shuts at. Check that against the specs and you will know if it is right. Likewise, if you buy a new one, you can check it before fitting it. Saves a lot of work and worry if it's not right!

Good point. The design should allow the enthusiast to do a few modifications and it could become a decent bush basher (though you'd really want a shorter version to be a proper hoon!). I'm no longer one of those but there's still a high chance I'd get one when they are older and scratch the paint a bit. If the price ever comes down - it might end up being like an old Land Rover because of supply and demand...

I went to a local hydraulic repair shop with the ram sizes and even photos and the quote range was huge. When I pinned the manager down, he said seals were $NZ150 each and labour $85 an hour but he couldn't really predict the amount of work involved without stripping them down. However, he did shrink the range and I believe it could end up in the same ball park as L19MUD paid. I do understand that too. How many times have we pulled various seals out of our Land Rovers and found the faces they seal on, or the bushes/bearings that locate them, are not in great condition and need attention too? Or found old components very hard to prise apart? I don't mind a bit of wear, or even if new seals weep a bit. I'm just outside doing tracks and firewood, after all. A business, though, has to be confident that won't happen. Their standards are higher and higher standards cost more...

Thanks for sharing that. Was wondering how best to make a tool like your first one and that design looks very strong and straightforward. The quote I got to replace two seals made me think it's worth having a go myself - but absolutely don't want to wreck anything!