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unimog axle question

steve b

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First of all hi to everyone on the forum I joined a while ago and have enjoyed reading all the techy threads and also events.

For anyone at santas last weekend i was a marshal in the 109 sw with rollcage.

Back to my question i have found a couple of old mogs which i understand are ex german army,found a plate on one date 1963

they have canvas cab tops 4 seat with drop side body , on 12(?)x20.

Are these suitable as the basis for a portal conversion ? to a defender/series hybrid.Am i right in thinking they will require

1 prop flange adaption

2 disc brakes - is there any that can be adapted ?

3 narrowing track width are all conv narrowed or can you run std & have mainly inset wheels?

Thanks in advance for any help guys n gals

also how do i get emoticons to appear in my posts?

better with welder/grinder/pressbrake chi than the finer points of pc's!

ta Steveb

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At 1963 they are 404's, thus the most suitable for use under a landrover sized vehicle.

They would need;

1, prop converting.

2, diff offset changing

Drum brakes are very good if they work and are complete, parts are quite expensive though.

Full width 404's aren't silly wide, but narrowing makes them a bit more manageable.

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cheers DD

do you know what ratio they might be? and which lt 230 ratio best matchs the axle with say 38" tyres?

poss more important what sort of price do you reckon I should be expecting the owner to ask for a whole vehicle - they have been in a field for at least 20 yrs!

so body etc is all tatty. Going back tommorrow in daylight for aproper look.



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Hi Steve, welcome. There are multiple portallers here [in various states of build :ph34r: ], so you've come to the right place.

Sounds like you come across some Mog 404s. You can verify this by going to the thread in the Member's Vehicles Section called 'Al's New Shopping Car' (about halfway down at the mo). If your trucks look like the stupid pink thing humping Andy's 7.5 tonner then yes, they are 404s.

[One small point - you say they are 4 seaters? If it's a 'doka' (double cab jobber), I might be interested in your cab if you don't need it? :) ].


Yes! They are suitable as a basis for a portal conversion. They are the smallest Unimog axle (don't worry - plenty strong). They all have lockers as standard. The overall axle ratio (diff ratio multiplied by portal reduction ratio) comes out at 7.56 (I think... memory fade... its around there), so you need to think about tyre sizes, engine revs and gearbox ratios if you plan on going at any speed.

Yes you need to run a diff flange / torque tube adapter to mate a regular propshaft on. I may have a spare set... ;)

There are numerous disc brake kits. Or people make their own. Depends on your time / inclination / handiness / tool ratio. The regular drums are designed to stop up to almost 6 tonnes GVW, so I wouldn't be overly concerned about them not doing the job. Maybe if you can't be bothered cleaning them out.

Disc kits tend to add a few inches to the overall width, so bear that in mind during the build / wheel choice.

You can run standard width. Moglite's are standard, but the vehicle hardly is and check out his mud guards... Narrowing is of course do-able. the axle tubes are double walled, so you need to think about how to weld it all back up again, then what to do about shafts blah blah blah...

If you can just run different offset wheels, do that. Check out DirtyDiesel's build too - though I can't remember if they are standard width or not...

If emoticons are the little smiley faces, they are just in a menu on the left of my screen while I'm typing a reply. Or there is a drop down menu just above the window I'm typing in.

>"better with welder/grinder/pressbrake chi than the finer points of pc's! "

Good man! B)


P.S. Edit to say - sorry - DD got in there while I was typing!

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Thanks Al

might be interested in the propshaft flanges

one was a doca one single there may be others in the undergrowth....will have a better look tomorrow.

do the props turn the other way to lrs?

with the drumbrakes can you run 16" rims ? good choice of lighter offroad tyres :):D watching moglites video of his 1st time out

the truck tyres looked really stiff :huh:

about 20yrs ago i had a well worn diesel mog that was tiny - size of a 109 was an old forestry truck unfortunately i sold it a while ago

but would have been good as track seemed similar to a 90 on offsets i think it may have been 401?

by the way Al what are your plans for your mog? if i do get one the cab will be available

cheers steve

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QUOTE(steve b @ Dec 14 2006, 08:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
with the drumbrakes can you run 16" rims ? good choice of lighter offroad tyres :):D watching moglites video of his 1st time out

the truck tyres looked really stiff :huh:

Yes, 101 rims have the same bolt pattern. Andy has a set of 7.50 x 16s for Moglite for moving it arround at home.

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16" rims don't quite fit over the brake drums.

They need a little bit of lathe work to trim them down. There is plenty of metal on the drums, so with a decent size lathe - its easy.

My tyres are really stiff. I was running 15psi in that video - if I remember correctly.

A dead Mog normally sells for about £500 on eBay - if that helps.

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Hi Steve.

Yes - sounds like your old Mog was a 401. Could have been a newer 406 or similar - those can be pretty short too. If it was narrow, it would have been a 401.

Regarding pricing - they sound dead, so I wouldn't go over a few hundred quid. Mine was 950, but it's in very good shape.

Plans are to just use it as a runabout for the UK (I live in France most of the time). Just local trips to collect parts/metal/gas etc and get me round the Sainsbury's car park. I found the 110 I was using a bit limited in terms of access to the rear load bay (teeny rear door, and the roof stops you craning stuff on easily), and also in terms of the raw dimensions I could fit in (lengths of steel for example).

Plans are to LPG it and run megasquirt with a higher compression head. That way I can forget about needing to do an engine swap. I'll clean up the drum brakes for now and stick some power steering on. Maybe some paint... ;)

Get some pics and we can help figure out a price.


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What a load of carp Al, you told us that you just bought it so you could eat yorkie bars and live out your trucker fetish - Ive never seen a long distance lorry driver in a bodice before but if it floats your boat than thats cool - just remember what I said about the cattle on our farm, I dont care what you do in france..... its just not hygenic :moglite:

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Aww - you always spoil my fun... :angry2:

How about if I load the cattle into the back and bring them back to Froggsville with me? That sort of thing is perfectly acceptible here, as long as the local mayor doesn't see it going on... I could deposit some smelly fromage and very quaffable 80-pence-per-bottle wine by the lab door as hush-money? [the French don't make nice biscuits... :( ].

Steve - pm me if you want to talk pinion conversions...


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Cheers for the replies guys

Just got back from a daylight look...they have definately been there a while theres trees growing out of the doca!! :lol::lol: the two i could get at have on board air (for towing? -trailer brakes) there is one or two more under the biggest bramble thicket i've ever seen :huh:

Will be talking to the owner later hopefully about a deal....

Jez ...panzer bits?? shirley not :D been browsing the toyshop for a while...when i had my 2 mog s back in mid 80's there wasn't anyone doing hybrids but now with work guys like you n dirty diesel n moglite are doing and maybe just as relevant there are events to do with said toys :rolleyes:

ok ok time to admit to it

i'm steve and i may have a small mud addiction .... i can stop anytime i just choose not to....


Is spectating feasible on any of the baltic events Jez ? vepsski Les n the Ladoga look like a real test of metal..

Al will pm you ref prop flange if im successful ta

cheers steveb

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jump in a car and do the grand tourist class of Ladoga (less combat than tourist class), get to see the stupid stuff, play in what the Russians class as "green laning" but actually come back without demolishing your car (for gods sake take a winch though - regardless of what Yuri and the organisers say!), a couple of friends from Holland are doing it in '07 so there will be friendly faces and you get to laugh at us trying to keep a fleet of sport class cars functioning :blink:

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Portals dont work Steve and they're not worth the trouble, you car will overturn and thousands of people could explode when you drive it

welcome to the toyshop - good luck with the build! :i-m_so_happy:

mumble Volvo...... mumble Mog...mumble panzer parts..... :)


You missed your other calling. You should have at least a radio show, or if we had a free and fair Land Rover press (I know, "and why should they be any different than the mainstream press) your own column in one of the rags!

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Well, I dunno - I guess we certainly have our share, but maybe that's cos it's the 'spiritual home' / rootz of the WBBSC?

We've got less than Pirate, I know that, and I don't tend to hang out anywhere else...???

I wonder how many portalled rigs there are in the UK? Do people come to this site for portal tech specifically, do you think?


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i think most people running portals aren't talking about it.

i've spoken to a few people recently who are building portalled trucks but who aren't talking about it!

there really isn't much tech on here either i don't think- perhaps we could add some to the tech section?

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i think most people running portals aren't talking about it.

ahh secret builders? I can dig that - more fun turning up with a finished something :) I thought this time round we would build one in public, our racing is so far removed from normality theres nothing left to be ripped off by bolt on shops

I dont know if theres a quiet corner we could hide a portal tech section - or would that be classed as hericy?

Pirate does my head in Al, too many exercisers pressing the flipoff button, I like to hide a little further affield where the board culture is positive and encourages new ideas - having said that there are some really talented guys on pirate though (gits gits gits)

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