chassis identity... how do you get one?

[gelf]

ive just got a 110 chassis from someone who was gonna use it to replace their own 110 chassis, he bought as a new chassis, so isuppose it would be given his 110's identity.

ive bought it bought it build a 110 pick up using the mechanicals from my discovery which ive now mullered the body work with a large tree... , so im just wondering how i get an identity for the chassis?

can i some how use the disco's?

graham

[Guest diesel_jim]

Legally wise, you should get the vehicle SVA'd, which may or may not end up with a Q plate.

If you can prove where the chassis came from, they may give you an age related plate.

Illegally wise.... buy a V5 form someone for £50 and stamp the number in.

[gelf]

so because im using all the disco mechanicals i could swap the disco ident over then?

perhaps it would be easier to make a 100" defender using the disco chassis?

[Les Henson]

It depends on how much of the Disco you use - axles, engine, transmission, steering, suspension, and chassis are all worth so many points each. This isn't the original components - just same type as the originals. The chassis is worth 5-points, but there's a possibility that if you alter it, you will lose those 5-points. I think you can put your number on the 110 chassis, same as the engine or gearbox as long as it's not for criminal purposes. The total points value of a vehicle is 15 and as long as you have 8 or more, then you keep the original number plate. That's my take on it anyway - no doubt someone has been through the SVA maze and would be able to tell you better.

Les.

[gelf]

are discovery axles basicly the same as 110 axles?...... just wanna make sure my stuff will fit.

[LandyManLuke]

110 rear axle is a salisbury , disco is a rover axle. rover axles aren't up to the weight capabilities of a 110.

110 rear springs are larger diameter than 90/disco/rr.

[gelf]

its gonna be a trayback so wont so much weight hopefully, what the power stering off the disco, will that swap across ok?

im just try to draw up a list of what i need to get hold of.

[Guest diesel_jim]

Steering box will swap straight over, same fixings

[gelf]

thank you

[Corrode Finger]

I think, technically, you will need an SVA, unless you can prove where the chassis came from and get the original ID.

You may be better off throwing the disco body away and building up a 100" defender.

If you see my thread in the members vehicles section - Another shires 100" kingcab, i have effectively done this with a RRC. This has also been to the DVLA and been re-registered, without them refering me for SVA.

Reason they took this approach was, original uncut chassis, orig axles, orig eng and gbox, basically an RRC with a new body shell. They accepted that it was a body swap, and were pleased to see that the body panels had been modded to fit the chassis, and not the chassis 'cut n shut' to fit a SWB landy for arguments sake.

I also believe that the RRC/ disco rear axle is not suitable under a 110, even if its trayback etc, cos as far as the DVLA esque types are concerned, its a 110 and has to have the correct componenets as already highlighted, for the load carrying duties. Even if you dont ever use it as a 110, it needs the right bits, so i have been told. How do i know? I thought about using my RRC and its disc axle under a 110, and was told ...NO!

Hope that helps, or not as the case my be.

[gelf]

so basicly even if i cut off the rear cross member and reduce the over hang, i'll need an SVA?

[gelf]

just reading on the devon forum and they used a 90 rear axle on theirs................ oh well dont which way to go......lol

[Corrode Finger]

Ummm......... minefield!!!

Technically yes!!

However, i know of two other trucks on here, both from shires that have 'slimmer' rears that got through the same as me, one is the white Dlander, they commented but decided to re-register it, so i have been told.

Mine technically had a bob, it lost about 4 inches off the back due to a suspect rear crossmember, but it is not noticeable, as 'i have the tank in the same place still'.

However, if you do have to do SVA, put the truck through as a pickup, then you can do a commercial SVA, which i understand is 'easier'...... no doubt others may comment, i think that Les Brock did this with his.

Basically you need to read the regs, and build with them in mind, whichever way you go.

[gruntus]

Hi,

This may help (or not )

Link to DVLA Website.

Regards

G

[FridgeFreezer]

Without going deep into VIC/SVA arguments, it all depends on how meticulous you want to be about it and how you interpret the book. Some of that will also be down to your conscience / fear of prosecution in an accident - which is linked to how confident you are of the safety / suitability of design of your vehicle

Some maintain that if it's not SVA'd you'd be in trouble, however I personally doubt that having a bit of paper (or not) would make any difference if something you built failed and injured someone.

Most of the kit car guys SVA their cars and then bolt loads of good stuff on / remove all the annoying safety bits that the SVA insists on, so it makes a mockery of the thing in the first place as it will go through an MOT even if it would give an SVA man a heart attack. To give an idea, a factory-standard Series or early defender would not pass the car SVA.

If you do SVA it, when you start hacking it about technically you should re-SVA it in "battle" trim but I doubt anyone ever does, and I doubt many would succeed if they tried. Mr Wightman was making noises about road legality and SVA for the truck he's not building, so it will be interesting to see if he goes for SVA in full combat trim, and if he succeeds.

I think your best bet is to do as Corrode Finger has done - re-use the disco minus the body and get it VIC'd.

[Orgasmic Farmer]

When I tray-backed the Disco I sent off the V5 to be amended as I could not see myself getting away with calling it an Estate anymore. I asked to have it registered as a pickup. Anyway the DVLA sent me a questionaire asking for original engine and chassis numbers (unchanged) wheelbase (unchanged), whether it was a kit (Nope) and for a short description of any body mods done with photos if possible. My description was something along the lines of "removed rear panels to make a pick-up style back with 2 doors and 2 seats". I did not take up their offer to send photos A few days later a new V5 came through which states is for a land Rover Discovery. Pick-up.

BTW what is VIC (vehicle inspection centre?) and what does it entail as opposed to SVA?

[FridgeFreezer]

VIC is Vehicle Identity Check and, depending on how they feel, may be a quick inspection or just rubber stamping the V5. Corrode finger knows more than I do on this subject.

Basically it's the DVLA satisfying themselves that the vehicle is the one you say it is - low-end write-offs often need it before being put back on the road to stop people ringing them. They check chassis / engine numbers and any other numbers they can find to see that they all tally. The pattern seems to be that if you've built something using a rolling/running chassis and not chopped it about in a big way, you'll get a VIC and keep your plate. If you have done chassis mods or swapped major assemblies round, you'll need an SVA.

Interestingly, I have heard there is a limit (15%?) to the amount which you can alter a chassis before needing an SVA, although I can't find anything online about it - and no idea how they work out 15%

[stumpy2268]

Please excuse my ignorance regarding the above topic, but where does all this leave bobtail Range Rovers / Discos ?

As the owner of 2 bobtail Range Rovers, neither of which have been inspected by anyone other than the MOT man each year, should I assume the worst if involved in an RTA ?

[Corrode Finger]

The biggest headache for SVA is the element that relates to cars - ie 4 seats or more or something that is a 2 seat sportscar - aka Lotus 7 Replica's and Cobra's etc.

Having been through that one for a Lotus 7 Replica, several years ago, its tough if you do not know what to expect. I know, i had 2 retests.

However, having read the regulations, and spoken to others on here and in clubs, if you build a commercial landy (pickup seems safest) then that is relatively easy, especially if you are sensible, and build things with the rules in mind.

Regarding the 'battle trim' statement, i will always refer back to the DOT inspector who commented that 'Any car with any aftermarket accessory( think bad boy saxo bodykits) will fall foul of the SVA or in main manufacturers case type approval'. Basically in the same way that any car is only able too pass the MOT on the day its tested, the rest of the year it could have failed headlights etc!! Then you enter construction and use regs which are enforced by the Police and DOT officials.

Whole new debate that has been 'discussed' before elsewhere.

Also before going for SVA on a vehicle that may or may not need it, the local DVLA office request to inspect the vehicle so that they determine whether SVA is needed. However if you know that the chassis, engine, gearbox, axles etc (as the points system on DVLA site) are all from different sources, and declare that, then you go straight to SVA. Think that this is what landrover598 and a few others have done.

I believe that on the original question about the 110 chassis, that you can present the 110 at the DVLA and they will issue a chassis number, in the same manner that they do for Kitcars, but it will be an SVA again, as it comes under the Radically altered vehicles heading, or a car built from multiple sourced components.

Technically, i think that Fridges 109 falls foul on the regs, as it has multiple sourced components, and does not meet the VIC check on component points, unless fridge can advise otherwise that the DVLA have inspected the 109 and said that complies?

One other point, it did not cost me anything to take my hybrid to the DVLA, be inspected and have a new amended V5 and new MOT issued by them.

[Corrode Finger]

Please excuse my ignorance regarding the above topic, but where does all this leave bobtail Range Rovers / Discos ?

As the owner of 2 bobtail Range Rovers, neither of which have been inspected by anyone other than the MOT man each year, should I assume the worst if involved in an RTA ?

HFH posted on this a few weeks ago, its grey!!

The impression that i got( and this is only my experience with my truck) is that they dislike the 'cut n shut' 88" hybrids, thats the thing that the DVLA inspector was most concerned with.

Equally he admitted that land rovers are 'unique' cos everything can be unbolted.

The guy i had experience with, and the staff at the Portsmouth DVLA centre were very helpful, other places, i cant comment, i got the impression that they were pleased i had come to them voluntarily.

[stumpy2268]

HFH posted on this a few weeks ago, its grey!!

Thanks for the comment, I will have a scan through some of the earlier threads.

I guess that I should therefore continue to avoid those other road users who are unable to spot a 7 foot high bright yellow Range Rover coming at them as they turn out of side roads.

[FridgeFreezer]

Stumpy - it depends who you listen to and how seriously you take the whole thing, as I said in my post above. If you read the book to the letter and apply it strictly you'd be down the SVA station every time you did some spannering.

Corrode finger is right, technically mine and a lot of vehicles inc. all the bobtails & tax exempt coilers out there fall foul of SVA. But then if you want to be that sensitive about it, like I said almost no-one's truck would pass an SVA in the form they drive them around / use them off-road so where do you stop? On the flip side, there is a certain amount of modification / replacement allowed (as Nige found) so what counts and what doesn't? I suspect getting a solid answer from the DVLA / VOSA would be like talking to fog.

My personal opinion is that whether you have a ticket or not, if there's a problem you're going to be in just as much trouble either way. If someone from the government tells me to get an SVA, I will, until then I'm happy with my MOT cert and my insurance company are happy with all the mods.

The fact that so many trucks (and cars) are running round apparently in flagrant contravention of the C&U/SVA regs suggests to me that it's not a burning issue unless you're building something unrecognisable - for example bombing round in a Seven-style kit car which is still registered as a Sierra is likely to attract interest. Likewise tax exempt plates on a vehicle which is in suspiciously good nick. If technical breaches like bodykits, wheels & tyres, etc. were cause for concern / police interest then I would expect the Max Power lot to be getting a hard time over it as they tend to be the ones with very shakily executed mods (DIY spring chop anyone?) tearing round and crashing into things.

[stumpy2268]

Stumpy - it depends who you listen to and how seriously you take the whole thing, as I said in my post above. If you read the book to the letter and apply it strictly you'd be down the SVA station every time you did some spannering.

Corrode finger is right, technically mine and a lot of vehicles inc. all the bobtails & tax exempt coilers out there fall foul of SVA. But then if you want to be that sensitive about it, like I said almost no-one's truck would pass an SVA in the form they drive them around / use them off-road so where do you stop? On the flip side, there is a certain amount of modification / replacement allowed (as Nige found) so what counts and what doesn't? I suspect getting a solid answer from the DVLA / VOSA would be like talking to fog.

My personal opinion is that whether you have a ticket or not, if there's a problem you're going to be in just as much trouble either way. If someone from the government tells me to get an SVA, I will, until then I'm happy with my MOT cert and my insurance company are happy with all the mods.

The fact that so many trucks (and cars) are running round apparently in flagrant contravention of the C&U/SVA regs suggests to me that it's not a burning issue unless you're building something unrecognisable - for example bombing round in a Seven-style kit car which is still registered as a Sierra is likely to attract interest. Likewise tax exempt plates on a vehicle which is in suspiciously good nick. If technical breaches like bodykits, wheels & tyres, etc. were cause for concern / police interest then I would expect the Max Power lot to be getting a hard time over it as they tend to be the ones with very shakily executed mods (DIY spring chop anyone?) tearing round and crashing into things.

Fair comment Fridge.

Talking to fog :hysterical:

Thanks for the input.

[Corrode Finger]

Well, opinions and approaches to the whole registration and SVA thing is personal.

I however, decided to go and get my truck down to the clipboard boys, that way, if anything happened, i have done everything within my ability to comply with the rules, they decided whether i needed SVA etc and i complied with the procedures. If the worst happens and i am still up the creek, well, what more can i do?

All i can say is what i have experienced, they are worth a chat too, if you are so inclined.

The best advise passed to me was via sheeppimp, who was told by a custom biker:

"the more radical and more extreme the vehicle, the more legal it needs to be"

[Tonk]

Likewise tax exempt plates on a vehicle which is in suspiciously good nick.