300Tdi engine nos. and cambelt replacement

[Troll Hunter]

I've a 300Tdi in my 110 CSW, and I know that cambelt replacement time is approaching. I've just read BogMonster's excellent write up on whether an upgrade kit is required, and if so, which one (http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?showtopic=12788). My engine is a retrofit, and I do not know its provenance, but I cannot reconcile the engine no., which is 16L 25615A and is stamped in the right place, with any of the number ranges in BM's write up.

I'm wondering if some thieving Pikey has re-numbered the engine to sell it on, or if there is an innocent explanation. Perhaps LR issued engine number ranges not covered in BM's write up.

As far as yellow marking is concerned (see BM's 2nd. paragraph of Checking a vehicle), the only yellow paint I can find in the general area isn't quite where it should be!

Should I assume that my engine has already been modded? Any information will be very welcome, and many thanks in advance.

Mike

[CwazyWabbit]

The numbers in the post by BogMonster are all VIN numbers and have no link to engine numbers.

A 16L engine number indicates it is a 300TDI Defender engine. Have a look at this post http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?showtopic=69062 as it seems it also means it is a 1995 Defender engine, which may mean that you can now work out what kit you need ...... although to be honest I don't think the 'big kit' is available anymore if I remember correctly.

[Turbocharger]

If your engine hasn't been modded then you'll see asymmetric wear on the back edge of the timing belt - it rubs on the housing so the casing would be full of rubber shreds and the teeth start to overhang the back of the belt... until it wears too narrow and snaps.

The issue was that the injector pump vibrates and pulls the belt out of line. The kit was a bracket to brace the back end of the pump to the block to stop it all waving round.

If it all looks fine in there, it'll be ok for another good few thousand miles with a new belt on it.

[Troll Hunter]

Many thanks for the replies. I was under the impression that the VIN included the engine number in the last eight digits. From memory, this was the case with my vehicle when it had its original V8 engine. Anyway, all is now clear, thanks.

The good news is that I did MB's wiggle with a bit of hooked wire and it came out clean. No fluff at all, so perhaps the mod has been done, but I won't know until I open her up. If it hasn't been modded, I suppose I'll just have to fit a new cambelt anyway, and try to get the required mod kit and another new cambelt as soon as possible. Oh, the pleasures of having a Land Rover!

Mike

[western]

VIN aka xhassis number only has a code letter for the engine version, it doesn'f have any other reference to the engine, the last 8 digits are the year of build,factory of build & chassis serial/production number.

the engine number is a totally seperate identity for that particular engine as CW says 16L is a genuine Defender 300tdi.

[Troll Hunter]

Thanks for all the info, but I still don't know which timing belt kit to order. As I said above, I don't get any fibrous particles adhering to a wire hook when wiggled inside the timing chain case, so perhaps the engine has been modded. Paddocks do two timing belt kits for the 300Tdi, described as for early and later models, with VA117353 being the last of the early models. If this is the VIN, can anybody tell me the appropriate, or approximate, engine number applicable, please, assuming that engine numbers are allocated serially and not randomly?

Mike

[Aragorn]

Chassis number VA is the 1997 model year.

Your engine is 1995 from the above list, meaning you have the "early" engine.

[Troll Hunter]

Thanks for the info, Aragorn. It seems then that my engine is an early model, as far as Paddock's timing belt kits are concerned, but since I'm not getting any "fluff", it has had the appropriate modification made to prevent the timing belt wearing prematurely. So, back to the question of timing belt replacement. Does a modified "early" engine need the "early" or "later" timing belt kit? I don't know if the modification to "early" engines included changes to the belt tensioner and idler, which are the only differences between the two kits. Being in Canada, I don't want to order the wrong kit, since a return is out of the question due to shipping costs, and I certainly don't want to hedge my bets by ordering both kits.

Mike

[CwazyWabbit]

The only difference between the kits that I can see on paddocks site is the idler and tensioner.

I think the only way you will find out is to remove your old idler and tensioner. The difference between early and late idlers can be seen by looking at the part numbers via google image search, the later one has a deeper bearing mount.

Later

Early

Not sure on the difference in the tensioners, but I doubt you will be able to tell what has been done to your TDI in the past without dismantling it as there were different kits available to solve the belt problem one of which included a new timing chest. The kit that included the timing chest was apparently rarely fitted as it was expensive ......

BTW when I did my timing belt I changed the crank pulley as well, there are two types of modified crank pulley. The genuine one has spot welded flanges to keep the belt in line and these spot welds have been known to fail, one of the other brands has a pulley with these flanges being part of the pulley casting and is apparently a better option.

[CwazyWabbit]

Just noticed the difference in the tensioners.

The later tensioner doesn't have raised shoulders whereas the early one does, if I remember correctly the early tensioner with shoulders goes with a crank pulley without shoulders and the later tensioner without shoulders goes with the crank pulley with shoulders.

Thinking about it a bit more when I did my timing belt the idler and tensioner that came off were the early style and the type I put on were the later style (remember I changed crank pulley as well). If I remember correctly the extra bit on the new idler is to replace a spacer washer in the old setup.

[CwazyWabbit]

Just checked I fitted kit STC4096L and it replaced the early style idler and tensioner and crank pulley that were fitted to the engine (I still have the old bits sitting in the shed for some reason so I am certain it was the early style that came off)

[cackshifter]

The one piece cast crank pulley is bearmach.

[Troll Hunter]

CwazyRabbit, many thanks for your most detailed replies and photos. I'm reconciled now to having to open up my timing case and examine the bits before ordering. There are too many "mix-n-match" options for getting it wrong without doing so, and I'll make darn good sure that I get the best combo of replacement parts, even if I do need a new crank pulley as well. Thank you for the lead on that, Cackshifter.

I'm coming to UK this summer on holiday, so I guess I'll be traveling east with empty bags and west I'll be paying excess baggage for LR parts! Many thanks again, both.

Mike