Chevy Small Block Gearbox Advice

[mcc1979ian]

hi, after reading many v8 threads iv taken a mad idea, either 5.3 or 6.0 v8 chevy small block into the 90, i can get a complete turnkey engine for very reasonable money but the big question is,

Which gearbox (no auto's for me, sorry)?

Any other mods needed to fit?

If it helps engine coming out would be disco 200tdi mated to lt77 box and disco lt230 transer box.

[Hybrid_From_Hell]

I use to race on a SBC 5.7 with 4 B Holley and ali BV heads balanced and tweaked .........

I used a LT95 and blew it up - ...............regularly

Tried LT85, ...............blew that up,

tried LT77 .............last les than 1 lap,

Ended up with TF727 3 speed, lasted well after I sold it on

Its not the BHP its the torque

Nige

[FridgeFreezer]

Forget anything LR.

Pick anything from the states that is designed to live behind it, it's all easily found for good money. If memory serves, advance adapters or someone sell kits to fit the LT230 to a couple of yank boxes.

Be prepared to break the rest of your drivetrain in very short order, except the LT230 as those will live with big HP.

There will be lots of mods needed to make everything fit & work & reliable & safe - keep in mind you are easily quadrupling the power the vehicle is designed for, any fool can bolt a big engine in but making it so it doesn't pitch you through the nearest hedge backwards and on fire when you go near the loud pedal is a bit more of a job. Persuading your insurance company might also be fun.

[robertspark]

Which engine are you thinking of specifically??

The issue that you have is twofold..... gearbox / transmission + bellhousing......

Once you've decided that the LR gearboxes may not be up to the task at hand..... (depends upon the torque you're intending to run). ..... then the problem becomes how you connect the non-LR gearbox upto the LT230 transfer case (apparently bulletproof.... [yet to be tested in my application]).

If you're thinking about an LS engine, the bellhousing is the same as the SBC, minus one bolt at 2 o'clock.

Marks 4x4 adapters http://www.marks4wd.com/products/engine-trans-conversions/rangeroverindex.html do a conversion plate from LS engine to LR gearbox, but from an email I had from them, they only estimated the following estimated power and torque rating : "rated power output of 270kw and 530nm of torque.".

The GM TH400 kit that they do is also sold by Advanced Adapters http://www.advanceadapters.com/search_results.php?keywords= in the US I understand. MEZ made one, and their is a write up on his site. http://www.mez.co.uk/4l80e-1.html

The common route seems to be to use the Tremec TKO500 or TKO600 (rakeway do a conversion for them to the Landrover) http://www.rakeway.co.uk/page21.html

The decision on the TKO500 or 600 (no relating to the rated torque) is more of a ratio choice.

I am still working on my conversion, once I get my axles on the new chassis, so am no further than having the engine (LS7), having the chosen gearbox (TR6060) and having what appears to be the last T56 Magnum mainshaft [still in the US.... at present].... other than that the LR rebuild is going along swimmingly...

I decided on the TR6060 because they are more higher rated than the TKO's and offer 6 gears (double overdrive) so I hope to be sitting at about 2000rpm at 70mph, and it was also cheaper, it also can handle much more torque than the T56, and the only place to get T56's in the UK is really aston martins... the 2nd hand boxes cost more than a new TR06060 and I would have exactly the same issues mating up the transfer case. Once the T56 Magnum mainshaft is installed it will be good for whatever I throw at it, but the rest of the drivetrain may not...

There is also the cooling to consider (bigger radiator), power steering to re-plumb, new exhaust to route and make, new engine mounts (maybe)

Other things to consider are what sump is on your chosen engine (engine > sum clearance)

I have heard of a "magical / mythical R380" gearbox that I'm told was used in police rangerovers, in a small quantity, they are like rocking horse poo, and apparently the person I spoke to said that Ashcrofts had a number of them at NASA prices (no disrespect intended, as they are one offs), and knew where all of the 70 odd lived... But that was just a brief conversation.... even if you used one of them, then you have a bellhousing problem, and maybe an input shaft issue (not sure of the spline count)

[SeriousIIa]

I've got a TH400 behind my 350 and it works fine together with LT230. For more info about the conversion search for BIC 127 in the projects forum.

I've got a 727 lying around with a conversionsplate to 350 chevy and adapter to LT230. You can have it if you like (I can bring it to Billing which I will be attending). This 727 wsa the one I was planning to fit, but then I bought a complete donor driveline with a TH400 attached so went for that.

Cheers Bowy

[mcc1979ian]

ebay item number 15083724335 or 150837250836 or 150825369574

sorry but i havent a clue how to paste a link

[Steve Hiatt]

I have some experience in this area. Length is also a consideration if you're trying to get it in a 90. If you're on a budget LT95 is your only sensible choice. You may break third gear but you should get home. I was buying them for less than £100. The 101 bellhousing will shorten the length by 4.5", from memory.

Bear in mind there are small blocks and small blocks. Some are no more powerful than a Rover. There is a casting number at the rear of the block behind the heads that, via google, will tell you the original spec.

Personally I'd go for an early American auto with manual shift and engine breaking, and a low stall converter. It's nothing like a normal auto.

Finally bear in mind that an LS is better in every respect and if you can find one will make a much better final vehicle. The engine mounts and headers are different to the SBC so changing later is not straightforward.

Ashcroft shafts and CVs will comfortably handle the power.

[mcc1979ian]

mmm sounding very technical, maybe a bit too complicated for me.

the other option for me is 3.9 v8 on carbs with a decent set of cams and a few performance upgrades.

have seen a 3.9 v8 on carbs for sale not too far away and there is an engine builder about 20 mins away can do any rebuilds and upgrades reasonably, but the question is would an lt77 box handle this, i really dont wanna cut the bulkhead or mod the seatbox if i can help it as the bulkheads just been galved and the seatbox and body has just been painted.

[robertspark]

Ian,

Both of those ebay listed engines are LS1's, basically all LS engines are roughly the same with many components interchangeable, they are very modifiable in the US where parts are cheap.

There are a few people that have done LS1 conversions into defenders (seem quite common over on ALRO and Pirate4x4), suggest you do a search on google.

The cost will not be cheap, but I think you may be able to get away with a TF727 behind one without too much agro. as I don't think that the torque rating is that high.

Beward that some of the transmissions that I mentioned above come out of fords, and have a different input shaft + bellhousing and won't bolt up to an LS engine.

As I read somewhere, you're looking for a near complete package or the cost of all the extra's will nickel & dime you to death bringing them in from the US at delivery +20% VAT & duty + handling charges....

Also I went for the TR6060 because it came new, complete with the belhousing and the clutch release bearing. all of that can add a bit more if you don't have them with your chosen gearbox.

[Steve Hiatt]

mmm sounding very technical, maybe a bit too complicated for me.

Better to realise that now than in six months time. It is a lot of work and buying the engine is the easiest and cheapest part.

[Ratty43]

I haven't the foggiest idea about small blocks but I would suggest you try a powerful car with an auto box in it before you settle on a manual. Generally speaking I wouldn't touch an auto, however I used to drive a 5.3L Jaguar XJS, the Jaguar V12 has seemingly never ending torque which suits an auto down to the ground. That combined with a three speed auto was brilliant, much more enjoyable than a manual would have been in my opinion. I suspect most people are anti autos thanks to only driving euro boxes where the engine can't supply enough torque to make decent progress.

[mcc1979ian]

i currently drive an auto renault magnum 5 days a week so really like gettin home to the old manual box, auto just isnt for me.

[Steve Hiatt]

Trust me. There are no similarities between a manual shift th350 behind a Chevy and an auto Renault Magnum. It's like a clutchless manual and you can shift at full throttle.

[nicks90]

I am also generally anti-auto.

i've driven a variety of eurobox autos and also disco v8 autos and hated every single one!

Until....... i drove an auto with a tremendously torquey turbo diesel (our new car, grand cherokee with the 2.7 merc crd and 5sp auto and tuning box )

to say it is fantastic to drive is an understatement! It launches off the mark like a scalded cat and the hellectrikery controlled autobox really does an amazing job of picking the right gear for the right situation. Alternatively manual selection. When i have tried the same in other motors (notably v8 disco), the lag between shifting the stick from 2 to 3 was horrible. This, its like doing a quick shift at full throttle and will almost induce a head snap if thats your thing!

I have now made a deal with the devil

if he promises to keep supplying me with vehicles that have an engine producing 350ft/lb of torque or more - i will happily live with a computshift autobox behind it.