blz6662 Posted June 23, 2017 Share Posted June 23, 2017 Hi Guys, Anyone had this one before? 1993 3.5V8efi auto KA Chassis Just testing all the lights before final prep for mot and I'm faced with this. Tested side, head, tail, fog lights and all good to go. Tried hazards first all good, tried right hand indicators and ALL lights flash at normal pace, dash light works but trailer light on as well. Repeated for the left hand indicators and same thing. Stopped car, operated alarm/central locking and indicators all flash 3 times correctly. Pressed remote again and started car and tested again, same thing.! To be fair the car has stood a while in my dry workshop whilst carrying out various repairs/servicing etc. No cutting or carving of any wiring undertaken though. A couple of years ago I did fir a new indicator/hazard/wiper stalk assemble (Lucas) and all worked well. Just wondering if it is the flasher unit sticking or perhaps the contacts in the hazard switch (as I pressed that first before trying the indicators). By the way the horn and wipers work fine on the stalks. Lets have your thoughts guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverik Posted June 28, 2017 Share Posted June 28, 2017 Could be your hazard switch, as the indicators all go through that switch too... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blz6662 Posted July 4, 2017 Author Share Posted July 4, 2017 Hi guys, Problem update, so far changed out the indicator/hazard stalk for new Lucas one. Tried that and same problem. Changed the flasher unit for a new one - same problem - grrr. Renewed the trailer socket and traced wiring for damage and tested socket - all working correctly apart from power to both indicators on right or left stalk position. I've now removed the steering wheel and stalk shrouds to get a better look in. Inspected all plugs, connectors to each bit of hardware including the alarm/immobiliser unit and all in great condition. I'm really stumped now, but talking to a mate with the same model/year/V8 etc. and he has exactly the same problem !!! I've now contacted a mobile auto electrician guru who will be with me next week for a look so I'll keep you all up to date if we have any luck. This is now obviously a problem that has not occurred during mechanical repair due to the fact my mate has the same problem, therefore please let me know if you have any theories as it's driving me mad. Cheers All Baden Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sierrafery Posted July 4, 2017 Share Posted July 4, 2017 So just confirm now the dash indication is OK but no external light at all or how? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blz6662 Posted July 5, 2017 Author Share Posted July 5, 2017 Hi there, The dash lights flash indicator and trailer warning light in all modes. All outside lights flash both sides as per hazard mode when indicating right or left. Yesterday I unplugged the trailer harness and still the same warning lights on dash and all external lights flashing on direction indicator or hazard mode. Also tried the same thing having removed the trailer fuse - same result! Really got under the dash and did the 'wiggle' test of all the wires in each mode and all remained stable flashing all corners/side. Could there be a fault in the ignition switch? By the way it doesn't blow fuses at all therefore no short circuits and just to say again ALL other electrical systems are working perfectly. cheers Baden Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted July 5, 2017 Share Posted July 5, 2017 Is there no separate hazard switch on yours? Do the indicators flash at a normal rate, or fast? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blz6662 Posted July 5, 2017 Author Share Posted July 5, 2017 Hi Bowie69 This is the early type with the top mounted hazard switch integral with the indicator/lights/horn stalk, hence changing the whole thing out for a new Lucas unit. All flashers operate at normal rate in each mode (No LED bulbs in the system either - just standard) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sierrafery Posted July 5, 2017 Share Posted July 5, 2017 I'm not sure i found the proper diagram for that type but watch the plug which goes into the stalk, if you see green/white and green/red wires going into it unplug the stalk, take a piece of wire with a 5A inline fuse and give direct 12V from a live one of those wires at a time, with 12V to the G/R wire only the LH indicators should light on and on the G/W the RH ones... if they all come on no matter in which of those two wires you give 12V there is a short in the harness or in that plug Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blz6662 Posted July 5, 2017 Author Share Posted July 5, 2017 just returned from the workshop after going through the tests in the Land Rover Workshop manual and all test ok proving the new stalk/switch is ok. I'll try your direct 12v trick and see what I get. Thanks for that, I'll update later Baden Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blz6662 Posted July 8, 2017 Author Share Posted July 8, 2017 Right, here is the result from your test sierrafery. Gave direct feed to the green and red wire via 5A fused link - fuse blew immediately. Tried the same test on the green and white wire - guess what yep, blew the fuse straight away. Excuse my electrickery ignorance but not fully sure what that's telling me. Do I now have to unwrap the harness for those wires to find a short or is there a quicker way to solve it? i.e. run new wires. many thanks for the help so far. Cheers Baden Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sierrafery Posted July 8, 2017 Share Posted July 8, 2017 try with a bigger fuse cos the test is to see if there is a short between the two sides or not cos according to the diagram i've seen the GW and GR wires are going to the bulbs so as long as they come on all it's not supposed tio be a short to ground but a short within them and so the load of all can be bigger than 5A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sierrafery Posted July 8, 2017 Share Posted July 8, 2017 I edited the diagram to make you understand what we are doing, so i delimited with green the GW circuit for RH and with red the GR circuit for LH ... you can clearely see that if the circuit on your vehicle is like in the diagram if you give feed on those circuits separately they must work only one side at a time, actually that's what should happen when you move the stalk to each side so as long as they come on all when you indicate one side we must see where is the problem...if when you'll give feed to one of those wires all the light will come on it means without any doubtb that there is a short between the GW and GR wires somewhere Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blz6662 Posted July 11, 2017 Author Share Posted July 11, 2017 OK, now fitted a 10A fuse and this is the result. GW wires powered up - ALL lights come on including repeaters GR wires powered up - Nothing at all, not even a glimmer or glow from any light. I've just been looking al the loom plugs and checking earths under bonnet and wings looking for the obvious but now found anything yet. Can you suggest the best way forward for me to go in order to trace this fault. Cheers Baden Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snagger Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 Sounds like a short between left and right systems. Look for damage wiring on the loom between the stalk switch plug and where they separate for the body sides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sierrafery Posted July 11, 2017 Share Posted July 11, 2017 3 hours ago, blz6662 said: OK, now fitted a 10A fuse and this is the result. GW wires powered up - ALL lights come on including repeaters GR wires powered up - Nothing at all, not even a glimmer or glow from any light. I've just been looking al the loom plugs and checking earths under bonnet and wings looking for the obvious but now found anything yet. Can you suggest the best way forward for me to go in order to trace this fault. Cheers Baden Unfortunately in this case the diagram might not match with your vehicle cos if nothing comes on with voltage applied to the GR wire the lights should not come on when you indicate to the left but you said they do and indicating to the left according to the attached diagram means voltage switched to the GR wire if you see what i mean... measure with multimeter for voltage in the stalk side plug where the GR and GW wires are should go while you indicate each side to see if you get voltage as in the scheme Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blz6662 Posted July 12, 2017 Author Share Posted July 12, 2017 Ok, Here we go again - Snagger checked the wiring up to the bulkhead, undone some of the insulation tape local to where the indicator harness is bound to the lighting harness. Nothing visible so checked under the bonnet for dodgy stuff and again undo/inspected anything sub standard but no joy. Went through the live feed to each technique again - (As previous the plug was disconnected from the indicator stalk and live feed down each side). This time as before GW wire lit up all lights. Retested GR wire and all lights came on as per GW wire! Maybe my earlier test connection wasn't good enough. The other thing was when I disconnected the live link wire the clip and wire were getting really hot after only a 20 second test each side. Just for info there are 2 GR wires in the one pin (factory fit - not an add on) and only 1 GW wire feeding the other pin. Checked voltage with the connector plugged into the stalk and operated each indicator side - 12volts each. Sierrafery, your wiring diagram is very similar the the official manual. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sierrafery Posted July 12, 2017 Share Posted July 12, 2017 (edited) Now you have the confirmation that there is a short between LH and RH circuits, if you can find the splice joint where the lamps are all connected to the feed each side better cut the GW and GR wires and run new ones from the stalk's plug Edited July 12, 2017 by sierrafery Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blz6662 Posted July 12, 2017 Author Share Posted July 12, 2017 Great, thanks for your help I'll just need some luck finding the joint. I'll start at the stalk and work my way forward. Tried doing it from the engine side earlier and got lost. I'll let you know how I get on. Once again many thanks Baden Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blz6662 Posted July 14, 2017 Author Share Posted July 14, 2017 Yep, I'm back again! Spent hours yesterday trying to trace the splices, unwrapping insulation tape, removing conduit etc and managed only to trace to a blue multi-pin plug for the front RH indicator and a white multi-pin for the front LH indicator. To test the connection to the RH pin I ran a direct live and the front bulb failed to light. Did the same on the LH side and the bulb lit up so all good. This leaves me with the task of finding the repeater lights and the rear lights splice/connection points. To be honest with finding a problem with the front RH circuit from the multi plug I am tempted to forget the search and just run complete new cables to front, rear and repeaters from DF1 as the task is so time consuming, cable carnage and awkward. Because the hazard switch DF2 is one unit with DF1 stalk I'm assuming the link wires GR & GW are built into the switch unit and not actual wire runs. Note also on the Land Rover Manual diagram I attached, they have actually got the GR &GW the wrong way around!! Let me have your thoughts on this one before I upset anymore wiring Cheers Baden Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sierrafery Posted July 14, 2017 Share Posted July 14, 2017 I encourage you to rewire the whole thing and cut the old circuit, at least then you know for sure it's well done Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blz6662 Posted July 27, 2017 Author Share Posted July 27, 2017 Hi sierrafery, All done and working perfectly. Many thanks for your help. If any of you guys get a similar problem don't spend loads of time and money searching and replacing good parts, just do the live test down each circuit and if you get what I had rewire to 2 circuits. Not too bad a job but does take a while to do properly. Cheers blz6662 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sierrafery Posted July 27, 2017 Share Posted July 27, 2017 Well done, i'm glad it's sorted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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