What do you think of these vehicles?

[mmgemini]

My Defender is Ex BT. Bought with 124,000 miles on it.

Not the best of paint jobs. It seems well looked after.

Now on 207.000 and still very good BUT I service on time or mileage which ever comes first.

I've just had my first real expence. A s/h turbo and a s/h transfer box. The box was ALL my fault so I shouldn't complain.

Chassis is still good although the rear crossmembe looks a if a plate will be needed next year.

mike

[tweetyduck]

Ok so I went to see it with a mate’s dads friend who’s a series guy and owns a 90 200. He's really clued up and has rebuilt loads. The price was just too much for me considering it wasn't mint (as described).

For £8000 I wouldn’t want this.

• It had a back door that was going at the bottom. steel frame underneath.
  
• Door 2 and 3 foot well had a bit of corrosion. Doors seemed OK though. Slight bubbles but nothing.
  
• Back cross member was starting to look a bit dodgy on the inside ends
  
• Three different tyres. Front two same and back two different.
  
• No spare attached to rear door. Allegedly in the garage.
  
• Slight oil leak on the seal joint under the front transfer box (Mate didn’t see that but I did. At the Bell housing? Is that the right term)
  
• New standard fuel tank for some reason
  
• Paper work not available. Most worrying thing of all.
  
• Couldn’t tell me if cambelt had been done due to not having paperwork
  

It was pretty OK to drive. No clunks or bangs. The gears seemed OK and all gears were easy to get. Clutch felt like a normal heavy Defender. It did wallow a bit but that might just have been me. Never checked the roll bars and all the chassis but confident it was OK (only OK, not mint!). Steering had normal feel and no excessive play. Started immediately from cold with no glow plugs and exhaust looked fine. Did spit out some black oily stuff. Not sure if that was worrying or not.

For the price I wouldn’t put up with that. I would at least expect decent tires, all the paperwork and none of those issues. Am i being unreasonable? I’d actually expect a half decent unscheduled service to send me on my way. I know they have some old age issues but for £8000 I should be in middle age.

Continuing to try the specialists as recomended.

[NickHodgson]

It is important to remember that even with a specialist the same list of checks still applies.

Cheers

Nick

[FridgeFreezer]

It had a back door that was going at the bottom. steel frame underneath.

New back door is ~£100 unless you want to get fussy about perfectly matching paintwork. People's opinion of acceptable rust varies greatly based on a number of factors so difficult to say what's acceptable.

Back cross member was starting to look a bit dodgy on the inside ends

Not a big job if it is just the ends, see previous answer.

Three different tyres. Front two same and back two different.

I wouldn't care too much about tyres, first thing most people do is fling them in the bin for a bigger/lumpier set anyway.

No spare attached to rear door. Allegedly in the garage.

That's a GOOD sign, putting the spare on the back door f**ks the hinges and door in short order, especially on unmade roads.

Slight oil leak on the seal joint under the front transfer box (Mate didn’t see that but I did. At the Bell housing? Is that the right term)

Define "slight". Front transfer box? Sounds like the gearbox to me. The bellhousing has a drain hole so if the engine rear crank seal or gearbox front shaft seal leak, the clutch isn't contaminated. It very much depends if it's minor dampness or a proper leak.

New standard fuel tank for some reason

Again, I can see no reason this should be a bad thing - fuel tanks rust, so a new one saves you a job a few years down the line.

Paper work not available. Most worrying thing of all.

Now that is something to be worried about. Carry on.

Never checked the roll bars and all the chassis but confident it was OK

Riiiiiiight. Often the cleanest looking trucks have the worst chassis so for the love of god get under there with the hammer!

Did spit out some black oily stuff. Not sure if that was worrying or not.

Depends if it was oil or normal exhaust soot plus condensation that you get out the back of anything. A bit of condensation out of the exhaust from cold is normal - white, blue or other colours of smoke are not. A bit of black smoke, especially on acceleration, is normal for a diesel.

Given your intended use, you need to look at what's important and what's not. As I said in my previous post, an immaculate vehicle is not necessarily what you need to base an expedition truck on, you need a solid and well looked after vehicle. You shouldn't worry about stuff you're most likely to change as part of your prep such as tyres - would you rather pay extra for a truck with a new set of tyres you end up throwing away anyway?

[reb78]

What he said ^^^^

Also, the chassis was the thing that you were most worried about yet you didnt check it all!! Take some overalls next time get underneath and have a really good poke around. You need to define where the oil leak was actually coming from. As said, you've described a couple of potential places, but the descriptions dont match up with one place.

[tweetyduck]

Not an expert. It was a drip thats all. Not sure what everything looks like but it was there. If someone points me at a pic of the under parts i'll photoshop where it was.

The reason i didn't do the full once over is considering it wasn't mint i'd decided £8000 was too much for it. We both had a pretty good poke around though. I wiggled, banged and crawled under as much as i could (or knew how to).

[Godlykepower]

Never checked the roll bars and all the chassis but confident it was OK

What? You have been banging on about chassis replacements, and chassis condition has been your primary concern, now you dont even bother checking the condition of the one vehicle you go and inspect.

[FridgeFreezer]

Not an expert.

Take a digital camera next time, take hundreds of photos (especially of bits you're not sure of), upload to photobucket/flikr/whatever and post them here so we can all see what's what rather than guessing from vague descriptions.

[reb78]

Trouble is, you wont get mint for £8000. A few dents to the body and a little surface rust or oxidation are all be normal at this age. More important is the condition of the engine, running gear and chassis.

[RustyNissanPrairie]

What about ex-MOD?

I bought a winterised 110 4 years ago with 54k on it, mint chassis and bulkhead and generally in good condition apart from the fact the every panel was dented/covered in squaddy paint. Paid £2500.

Its been a real trooper since, and due to a change in plans is now taking us through Africa next year rather than just being my daily driver.

I've done a lot of work on it, inlcuding changing a lot of the panels/repainting not long long after I bought it, but I'm now 100% certain of its reliability and if something does go wrong I know how to fix it. Its getting painted a more overlanding friendly colour and being prepped internally over the winter.

The engine is the old 2.5NA non-turbo that everyone slates, but I dont think I'd want to overland with any other engine. Its dead simple to work on, bulletproof, lots of low down torque, reasonable economy, and the only electrics are to stop it from running (fuel cut-off solenoid).

Ours pulls well and the same fully loaded as empty-its not the fastest Defender in the world but you're overlanding-the aim is to see countrys from the locals point of view-not race through pretending to be the paris-dakar rally.

Also because its book value is low-the carnet cost is equally low. Ex-mod Defender already have side storage lockers, as standard as well..

And finally, our reg number is only a few digits out from Sam Watsons white ex-mod winterised 110 thats often featured in the magazines and thats been everywhere, Roaming Yak and his bright green winterised 110 that frequents Morocco, also the 2 lads who did south America in their blue, again ex-mod 110 (Iguana overland?).

Its strange that a bunch of identical, cast off ex-mod 110's have ended up plodding around the world!

Edited to add that the 2.5NA is a great LR engine for cooking on as you drive! far better than the Tdi's

[tweetyduck]

Still looking. I get the feeling they get more expensive everytime i look.

I've looked at all the ex-util, ex-forces, ex-whatever and not found one that suits yet. I'd be all to happy to buy one for £2000 with quie a bit needing doing but spending 8000 and for it to need something doing immedialty is more than i can stomach as a Yorkshireman. Of course now my plans have changed i need a 110 TDi 300 SW. I might just take our fiesta.

I'd actually pay £15k if it was already pristine and done up (outside and under bits) as long as the book price was lower for the carnet. That would just leave me to get all the bits inside done. Another £10K probably.

[tweetyduck]

Trouble is, you wont get mint for £8000. A few dents to the body and a little surface rust or oxidation are all be normal at this age. More important is the condition of the engine, running gear and chassis.

not at all bothered about dents and paint. Spotting the good one under it though, for me, is a challenge.

[Happyoldgit]

My advice is to slow down! There are plenty of vehicles out there. Buy in haste - repent at leisure.

[FridgeFreezer]

RustyNissanPrairie speaks the truth.

[RustyNissanPrairie]

"i need a 110 TDi 300 SW. "

no if theres just 2 of you, you need a 3 door 110 hard top, lighter so can carry more/or less loading on suspension components for the same amount of kit taken, bigger load area, less glass/windows= less security grilles you need=lighter weight and less door frames/door pillars to rot/replace and more money to spend on other stuff.

Hardtops/van are better value for money compared with station wagons.

130's are overkill for 2 people, and are massive.

Look for 1991 (H reg) issue military 110's they had improvements to the engine breathing system over the earlier 1986 contract.

I've seen the odd 300tdi engined 110 hardtop around the 1993 year for sale-but wernt to Wolf/XD spec, basically just a stripped down basic civillian 300tdi hardtop I think they may have been ex-raf. Perfect.

[FridgeFreezer]

^^^ yet more great advice I'd say.

Also, £2.5k for an old 110 + £500 for a rusty 200/300TDi Disco = good 110 with your desired engine, and a pile of spares.

[RustyNissanPrairie]

http://www.ihana.com/big_trip/the_landy/index.htm

http://www.roamingyak.org/landy/index.html

[tweetyduck]

Found one in preston for £6200 private. Should get it under £6k if its not sold. Still looking. May view it this weekend.

Its exactly what i want and is pretty clean from the photos. Long way to drive to see it but i'm not going to jump over the cliff yet. Plenty of time as my learned Admin states. A Yorkshireman and is money aren't easily parted!

I suppose if i completly cock up i can throw some money at it and put it down to a very expensive mistake (made a few of those, just ask Northern Rock). I don't want to do that though. I want to feel like i've made a good purchase. Is that possible with used cars....

Lots of time yet. Not leaving for over a year....or two.

Thanks for the links. More reading. Busy next few days as i have to work to fund the dream.

Next Viewing.

[tweetyduck]

Its sold. back to the search.

[mmgemini]

Neil.

Stop buggering about ....At least three of us have mentioned one dealer..Marc at the Defender Centre...

Ring him and discuss what you want....You could save yourself a lot of unessary time.....

mike

[Happyoldgit]

Neil.

Stop buggering about ....At least three of us have mentioned one dealer..Marc at the Defender Centre...

Ring him and discuss what you want....You could save yourself a lot of unessary time.....

mike

Good advice!!!

Defender Centre

[tweetyduck]

Already done that guys. I've just called him again to make sure he knows i'm serious.

[Godlykepower]

Did you also try my other suggestion, and call Mark Griffiths at The Land Rover Centre? Tell him your requirements, and he can source the vehicle you want. Also discuss your exact requirements with him, as he has a ton ofknowledge and he really knows what he's on about, he will be able to offer some suggestions that you would do well to take on board.

Mark Griffiths - 07801 746 805

Land Rover Centre - 01484 542092

Martin

[tweetyduck]

Did you also try my other suggestion, and call Mark Griffiths at The Land Rover Centre? Tell him your requirements, and he can source the vehicle you want. Also discuss your exact requirements with him, as he has a ton ofknowledge and he really knows what he's on about, he will be able to offer some suggestions that you would do well to take on board.

Mark Griffiths - 07801 746 805

Land Rover Centre - 01484 542092

Martin

Just called him again and he's told me to go to a place i went this morning. They have a few hardtops in their barn. Very dirty and i didn't have time to crawl under any so i'm going to go back next week.

I'm off to Taunton next week and have three SWs to see at landroverman. Trying to figure out if a hardtop is better. Is there much difference in floor configuration between a SW and hardtop. If the rear seats in a SW are removed are the footwells the only difference?

[Godlykepower]

At some point in your search for a vehicle, the name MRM Land Rovers will turn up, if it hasnt done so already. Whatever you do, dont bother dealing with this guy. I have yet to hear of someone with a nice word to say about him & his stock.

With regards to going down the Station Wagon or Hardtop route, well you need to think carefully about the layout of your vehicle when it is loaded. Each variation will have its pro's & cons I reckon.

If I had not poured so much money into my 90 already, and if it was not quite as brilliant as it is.....for my own expedition I would ideally want a 110 double cab pickup with a 300 Tdi motor.

As luck would have it, its the one variation that Land Rover did not bother making. Its available in a TD5, but I would want a Tdi engine only.