darthdicky Posted September 17, 2006 Share Posted September 17, 2006 Having a complete nightmare with the bloody thing at the moment. Finally got the power steering fitted and it works nicely, but haven't been able to use it as the engine won't run properly! Having been for a quick test drive and the engine continually dying, the starter seemed to give up when we got back. That was changed for a spare, but still the engine wouldn't run for more than 30 seconds. A mechanic had a quick look and suggested that the ignition had probably been left on for a while at some point and damaged the coil, so that was changed along with the points and condenser. Having spent a day fiddling around with it, whenever you set the points it runs beautifully for about 45 seconds, then starts getting rougher and rougher then stops. When checking again, the points have closed up completely. I've put a whole distributor on from a spare engine and it idled fine for a bit longer and even for a 3 minute drive, but still the points closed up and it stopped down the road. The points seem to be in right and the screw is tight, what can be happening? Richard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JST Posted September 17, 2006 Share Posted September 17, 2006 its the engine way of saying please change me for a tdi.............. sorry, dont know bugger all about petrols, has it got fuel in it???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darthdicky Posted September 17, 2006 Author Share Posted September 17, 2006 I know, but after the hassle of 'simply' fitting power steering, I think 'simply' chucking a TDi in is a little beyond me! Yep, got half a tank of fuel in it - as far as I can see it's just the points moving that stops it running, but why do they move? Richard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JST Posted September 17, 2006 Share Posted September 17, 2006 cant hlep at all ont he engine front other than if you do ever find a tdi and decide to go that route you are more than welcome to use my place to fit it, and i'm more than willing to help out - DSNs 200 disco engine was only £500 with all the bits less a downpipe, took us 45 man hours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rtbarton Posted September 17, 2006 Share Posted September 17, 2006 Having spent a day fiddling around with it, whenever you set the points it runs beautifully for about 45 seconds, then starts getting rougher and rougher then stops. When checking again, the points have closed up completely.I've put a whole distributor on from a spare engine and it idled fine for a bit longer and even for a 3 minute drive, but still the points closed up and it stopped down the road. The points seem to be in right and the screw is tight, what can be happening? Richard How do you measure the gap? is it with the heel of the contact breaker on the peak of the cam or with the engine in a given position? If the latter sounds like the dizzy is moving in its mounting, there are 2 screws holding it, one horizontal acting as a pinch bolt clamping the dizzy to its mounting plate and one through the mounting plate into the block. You don't happen to have 2 clapped out used dizzys do you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darthdicky Posted September 17, 2006 Author Share Posted September 17, 2006 Cheers I'll keep that in mind James if one turns up at the right price... Getting it down to yours could be fun at the moment though, stopping every 3 minutes! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darthdicky Posted September 17, 2006 Author Share Posted September 17, 2006 How do you measure the gap? is it with the heel of the contact breaker on the peak of the cam or with the engine in a given position? If the latter sounds like the dizzy is moving in its mounting, there are 2 screws holding it, one horizontal acting as a pinch bolt clamping the dizzy to its mounting plate and one through the mounting plate into the block. You don't happen to have 2 clapped out used dizzys do you? Measured with a feeler gauge with the heel on the cam. My dizzy was fine until this problem started, the other one I've just put in is from an engine that was also fine and was only taken out to fit a V8. Both bolts are tight and the dizzy itself doesn't appear to be moving, I'll have another look tomorrow though I'm wondering whether leaving the ignition on for ages has damaged something else other than the coil and the points? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwardatherton Posted September 17, 2006 Share Posted September 17, 2006 Measured with a feeler gauge with the heel on the cam. My dizzy was fine until this problem started, the other one I've just put in is from an engine that was also fine and was only taken out to fit a V8. Both bolts are tight and the dizzy itself doesn't appear to be moving, I'll have another look tomorrow thoughI'm wondering whether leaving the ignition on for ages has damaged something else other than the coil and the points? Have you got a high-power coil? Exactly the same happened to me when I fitted a Lucas gold coil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darthdicky Posted September 17, 2006 Author Share Posted September 17, 2006 Hmmm, it's one from my car, so could be more powerful than the original one. I also tried one borrowed from the garage (probably also from a car I guess). I assumed it would be the same? Worth buying a standard LR one then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn Posted September 17, 2006 Share Posted September 17, 2006 old points based ignition ststems usually have a length of resistance wire in its positive feed from the battery newer electronic systems dont have this resistance wire in the feed line and the coil resistances are different to give a much stronger spark u may well find if you've fitted a modern high energy coil your overheating the resistance wire causing coil supply voltage to drop, connect a multimeter to the coil positive to see if this is the case Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rtbarton Posted September 17, 2006 Share Posted September 17, 2006 old points based ignition ststems usually have a length of resistance wire in its positive feed from the batterynewer electronic systems dont have this resistance wire in the feed line and the coil resistances are different to give a much stronger spark u may well find if you've fitted a modern high energy coil your overheating the resistance wire causing coil supply voltage to drop, connect a multimeter to the coil positive to see if this is the case Yes. Series don't have this ballast resistor, IIRC the v8's do. Look at the points very carefully, I understand they can get hot and melt the plastic bits, any distortion will affect the gap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diff Posted September 18, 2006 Share Posted September 18, 2006 Hmmm, it's one from my car, so could be more powerful than the original one. I also tried one borrowed from the garage (probably also from a car I guess). I assumed it would be the same?Worth buying a standard LR one then? Hi Richard, leaving the ignition on can burn out the points, and the coil and possibly the condensor. It doesn't have to be a landrover coil as such, but it DOES have to be from a car designed with contact breakers. The lower resistance coils of modern electronic ignition cars can burn the points or melt the plastic heel on the points, both of which will cause a closing gap as mentioned by others. Check also that the wiring of the points in the dizzy is absolutely correct and make sure that the wires are not grounding on the dizzy inside. Regards, Diff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petergg Posted September 18, 2006 Share Posted September 18, 2006 If it runs Ok prior to the points closing, I would just consentrate on that problem first. Check to see if the cam is nice and smooth (not rusty and pitted) if so when you set gap you should set the dwell not the gap but for a start the gap will be good enough, put a VERY SMALL amount of heavy grease on cam to lubricate the heel of points. Make bolt that you use to secure the points is holding tight. I asume that you have the dizzy with 1 set of points and not 2? Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edwardatherton Posted September 18, 2006 Share Posted September 18, 2006 Yes. Series don't have this ballast resistor, IIRC the v8's do.Look at the points very carefully, I understand they can get hot and melt the plastic bits, any distortion will affect the gap. The plastic heel was literally melting on my 2.25 when I had the high-power coil on it. The other problem I have had which produced nearly the same symptoms was the 'clip' where the wire goes from the condensor onto the points - the gap was so small I had to bend it away slightly from the baseplate otherwise when the ignition advanced it misfired as it was grounding! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
02GF74 Posted September 18, 2006 Share Posted September 18, 2006 Having spent a day fiddling around with it, whenever you set the points it runs beautifully for about 45 seconds, then starts getting rougher and rougher then stops. When checking again, the points have closed up completely.I've put a whole distributor on from a spare engine and it idled fine for a bit longer and even for a 3 minute drive, but still the points closed up and it stopped down the road. The points seem to be in right and the screw is tight, what can be happening? What exactly do you mean by "the points have closed up?" Do you mean you are trying to slip in the feeler guage but cannot? There are a number of possibilities, first the obvious one is the screw holding the points in place is not done up tight or is able to shake loose allowing the plate to move resulting in the points closing. The other one is that the advance plate is sticking so the plate is in the wrong postion when you set the points gap in the first place. The other, as has been said, is the plastic part that rides on the cam melts so becomes less talll; it may be obviouls by comparing to a new set. Also the points themselves can be arcing badly so material erodes from one point on to the other thus closing the gap - you should be able to see a piton one and a pip on the other. The last two would happen if you a passing more current than t he points werre designed for i.e. using a ballasted coil without ballast resisitor but I would be surpirsed if that would cause the poiiunts to fail so quickly, but then again.... As you have used to different distributors, then the first 2 are unlikley - I wonder if something is up with the cam - a bearling collapsed or some problem with the rive for the distributor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon White Posted September 18, 2006 Share Posted September 18, 2006 Richard, Try doing the screw up tight enough!!! You want it Nigel Barker tight, not Darthdicky finger tight!!! Funnily enough I had exactly this problem when i had the 2.5 lump in my series. The points were forever closing up! The be all and end all fix it would be to get down the scrap yard and obtain the various bits of electronic ignition from a Maestro, and they can be made to fit the landrover dizzy giving you electronic ignition and doing away with the points entirely. I found a page on the web somewhere detailing exactly how to do it somwhere........I'll see if i can find it! Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darthdicky Posted September 18, 2006 Author Share Posted September 18, 2006 Cheers for all the replies guys, it's finally running again! Put the proper coil on it and another set of points and it's been fine for a 30 mile run. Obviously the coil was too powerful for it and melting the points, closing the gap and stopping it running. Never had a problem with the points before, so hopefully won't need to worry about electronic ignition, although I've got a mini dizzy in the garage with all the stuff on it to swap over if I do have more problems. Richard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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