samwilk200 Posted December 28, 2006 Share Posted December 28, 2006 A while back I fitted twin batteries in parrallel to my 90 incase I ever had to do some hard winching. Batteries were bought from local place and was assured that new batteries come fully charged. Winch is wired through a cut off. No split charge. Done small amount of winching and everythings been fine. Engine (2.8 Isuzu) always fired into life instantly. 2 days ago I did a bit of offroading with mate. Got stuck several times and had to use my 8274 to extract myself and my mate! Did about 10-15 pulls within 1.5 hours, most short, but 4-5 the full length of the cable. Winch never stalled (came close onece) and was only on single line pulls. Winch motor (std 8274) was getting warm (was steaming as was covered in wet mud) but this is surely normal? Drove on road for about 20mins on way home. Came to start vehicle this morning and nothing! Not even an ignition light. Put the voltmeter across batteries, reading was approx 3v. Seperated batteries and took voltages again, 6 and 5v. Batteries have been on charge all day, and will stay on charge tomorrow as hardly charged yet! If still wont take charge I'll take them back as there under a warrenty. Any ideas as to why they should suddenly be dead?! Did I kill them winching (anyone want to swap an 8274 for PTO'd milemarker )?! And the winch was isolated, ignition was off and all lights were off, so nothing obvious to drain batteries. Your advice please! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BogMonster Posted December 28, 2006 Share Posted December 28, 2006 Are you sure the alternator is charging, maybe that got fried? I've seen many people say "well I drove it here only half an hour ago and it died" and in almost every case it is the alternator. I will keep my Milemarker thank you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Posted December 28, 2006 Share Posted December 28, 2006 if you get enough mud inside the alternator they can die without the charge light appearing. my mates old 110 did it regulary, in the end he fitted a volt meter after several days when it wouldnt start later. always an easy fix though, take the brush pack out & wash it in WD40 till the brushes move again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ciderman Posted December 28, 2006 Share Posted December 28, 2006 I was thinking alternator also. As Andy said its probably caked in mud . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samwilk200 Posted December 28, 2006 Author Share Posted December 28, 2006 If it was the alternator wouldnt the winch have slowed down whilst i was using it and the engine struggle to start though, before it went completely dead?! To check the alternator I just need to put a voltmeter across it and check its putting out about 14V right?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BogMonster Posted December 28, 2006 Share Posted December 28, 2006 If it was the alternator wouldnt the winch have slowed down whilst i was using it and the engine struggle to start though, before it went completely dead?!To check the alternator I just need to put a voltmeter across it and check its putting out about 14V right?! Yes, shove a multimeter across it, you should be about 14.2 to 14.4 volts with a few revs on, less than 14 suggests there might be a problem, and then stick everything on (all lights, fan on full, heated rear windscreen and the wipers) it should not drop back more than about half a volt, if it goes below about 13.5 to 13.8 there is definitely a problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mo Murphy Posted December 29, 2006 Share Posted December 29, 2006 Double lining your winch line will also reduce the load on your batteries. Mo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samwilk200 Posted December 29, 2006 Author Share Posted December 29, 2006 Checked alternator, with nothing on and a few revs its about 14.5v. With everything on its about 13.5v. If I rev it more it puts out more volts. Do these figures mean that its all ok?! Put fully charged battery in last night, came to it this morning and nothing. I have several relays I've added to power lights and fan etc, so I've now disconnected these to see if one was stuck on causing a drain! This is the only thing I can think of that would cause the battery to die over night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted December 29, 2006 Share Posted December 29, 2006 If they're not heavy duty batteries you could've knackered them, too much load makes the plates bend and then no amount of charging will save them. I wouldn't think they're old enough to get sulphate in the bottom yet but you never know. Truck batteries are a good bet as truck starter motors put a big load on so the batteries cope better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samwilk200 Posted December 29, 2006 Author Share Posted December 29, 2006 They're two heavy duty batteries. Not quite as big as the standard 90 ones, but bigger than discovery ones! Think the fact that somethings draining the batteries is more of a worry now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 If it was the alternator wouldnt the winch have slowed down whilst i was using itHell no - your alternator puts out maybe 50-80A at absolute full chat, a winch draws more than that before it's done much more than take up the slack, everything else comes from the batteries.If the battery has been damaged it will discharge itself internally - easy way to check for a drain is WITH ENGINE OFF disconnect the batteries and then put an ammeter between the battery terminal and the connection, if there's a significant current flowing then you have a drain (there will be some current for stuff like the dashboard clock and an alarm if you have one) at which point you can turn stuff off / pull fuses till it stops and you've then found your problem. Heavy duty doesn't mean much, are they deep-cycle or truck batteries or just car batteries with the words "heavy duty" on the side? Halfords sell "heavy duty" batteries but you won't find them running the winches in many challenge trucks... A drop test (your local battery place should be able to do this) will tell you how much life's left in your batteries. Also: Lead acid batteries designed for starting service, such as those used in most automobiles, are not designed for deep discharge. They have a large number of thin plates designed for maximum surface area, and therefore maximum current output, but which can easily be damaged by deep discharge. Repeated deep discharges will result in capacity loss and ultimately in premature failure, as the electrodes disintegrate due to mechanical stresses that arise from cycling. And: Wikipedia: Sulfation in lead-acid batteries Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miketomcat Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 just one other thing to check is your battery cut off i've had problems in the past they'll let the igniton work but when you try and start it all dies came down to knackered switch mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samwilk200 Posted December 30, 2006 Author Share Posted December 30, 2006 Fairly sure I've got a drain somewhere now as putting a voltmeter between battery live terminal and battery live connection with engine off records about 8v, so somethings pulling quite a bit of voltage! Just gotta find what now! I'm guessing usually I should expect a minute reading for the clock etc?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LandyManLuke Posted December 30, 2006 Share Posted December 30, 2006 You don't want to measure voltage here, but current, as Fridge said. switch the settings over (and usually change the probes to different sockets) and measure the current draw, with the probes connected to the +ve of the battery, and the +ve battery lead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samwilk200 Posted December 31, 2006 Author Share Posted December 31, 2006 And measuring the current like this should give me a tiny reading?! I'll give it a go and see! Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WALFY Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 I've had the same prob recently. You'll get a reading in amps. Anything upto 1 amp is OK, so I was told. In the end my batt was U/S. But the reading from + term to +batt lead with everything off was .35amps. I just turned something on to confirm that the reading changed. Sidelights takes the reading to about 2amps IIRC. Hope that helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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