Mark90 Posted November 21, 2007 Share Posted November 21, 2007 And if you can thread your hook and thimble through the fairlead ( I know I cant ) You don't need to be able to do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WALFY Posted November 21, 2007 Share Posted November 21, 2007 And if you can thread your hook and thimble through the fairlead ( I know I cant ) Pass new loop through the fairlead around the drum then back through the fairlead. Pass hook through loop and pull tight. Nice and easy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milemarker Type S Posted November 21, 2007 Author Share Posted November 21, 2007 Thanks for all the info guys... I am leaning towards ways that mean that the line is properly secured to the drum- all to easy to run out of line when lowering out and then suddenly finding out the hard way that a long fast drop onto something hard is going to hurt!! Will have to sort something PDQ as I need it for Saturday at Wellington... Shrek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted November 21, 2007 Share Posted November 21, 2007 Not sure I have ever seen the point of wrapping it on under tension. Soon as it is used in anger it is invraiably not going back on with tension and there are no problems.As for the criss cross method too, this causes pinching of the rope too, albeit not as much. In my view too much is made of this handling with winch rope as in practice it seems to be fine both ways. It's only after side pulls where the rope has bunched up that I will spool out and re-wrap. Just my personal opinion Cheers Steve Steve, I found on 2 occasions that not having in on tight meant when it tightened up and gripped it "span" and ripped itself off the terminal on the drum, then the whole rope turned on the drum , another time I shoved it on neatlyish cotton reel styllee and under no load, did a huge heavy recovery and as it bit the rope tighened jumping down through the layers and becoming a complete £$%^&*() to undo Just my experiences, agree a rewrap always a good plan Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
treebloke Posted November 22, 2007 Share Posted November 22, 2007 Pass new loop through the fairlead around the drum then back through the fairlead. Pass hook through loop and pull tight. Nice and easy clever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WALFY Posted November 22, 2007 Share Posted November 22, 2007 At least some one thinks I am. Plenty would disagree with you :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
treebloke Posted November 22, 2007 Share Posted November 22, 2007 Hi, on my milemarker type r's i have welded half a chain link in the middle of the drum push rope through and tie a knot in it, simple, fast and dosn't come ofi would post a pic but the camera as been misplaced Good idea, why did you pick the middle of the drum, would it not be better tucked up the corner?. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishbosh Posted November 23, 2007 Share Posted November 23, 2007 I would guess that it is actually out of the way in the middle as you really run out of space at the ends of the drum with side pulls rather in the middle on straight pulls where the rope spools on far more evenly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milemarker Type S Posted November 23, 2007 Author Share Posted November 23, 2007 I have now established that the retaining bolt on my MM drum is 1/4 inch UNC. I have currently gone for bolting on the terminal-with the line knotted around the drum as well, fed on under load and then a load of gaffer tape of good measure... Will see how this holds up tommorow Didn't have time for anything fancy but will defintiely be looking into the positive attachment methods suggested. Thanks agian for all the input guys. Shrek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milemarker Type S Posted November 24, 2007 Author Share Posted November 24, 2007 Will see how this holds up tommorow The answer not very well... Line has spun on the drum and sheared off another retaining bolt...- although the knot kept the line attached to the drum this time! Shrek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted November 24, 2007 Share Posted November 24, 2007 ... Definitely wasn't me!!- I am definitely a flasher and a waver (to other Landys) Shrek I'd be very concerned about your type if I was a innocent young LandRover. what is it with Brits and machinary ? The other week it was the bloke with the bicycle. Bill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milemarker Type S Posted November 29, 2007 Author Share Posted November 29, 2007 Anyone know how much 12mm plasma will fit on a standard MM drum- and be usable for winch challenges? I have seen 100ft of 12mm which was a tight fit even when perfectly spooled... No chance when even slightly bunched up... The sandbag is considering getting me some for christmas and I am fed up with snapping the 10mm... I was thinking of about 80ft of 12mm?- I can then use my old 10mm as an extension to make up for the lack of length... The winch will also be coming off for a well earned service so will have to look into welding a loop on and either tying a knot or indeed splicing around it... Shrek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishbosh Posted November 29, 2007 Share Posted November 29, 2007 The joy of plasma is if it is too long you can easily cut bits off until it fits! erm, sorry, no idea how much will fit on your drum [whisper] mine's electric[/whisper] I have emplyed SimonR's suggestion of splicing a loop in. It needs a bit of encouragement to stay put for the first couple of wraps, but after that it is fine. Alternatively you could use a bit of gaffer tape. The great thing is it is so easy to get it off the drum when you're done and you have the peace of mind that it can't come off under load. Cracking idea IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bull Bar Cowboy Posted November 29, 2007 Share Posted November 29, 2007 Anyone know how much 12mm plasma will fit on a standard MM drum- and be usable for winch challenges? Shrek 22m .................. Ian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WALFY Posted November 29, 2007 Share Posted November 29, 2007 On both my winches I lay the plasma across the drum and tape it in place with some horrible black nasty tape from work. Tape is 4" wide and a wrap of tape at either end holds it tight enough for me to then wind the rest of the rope on under some sort of tension. Works for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milemarker Type S Posted November 29, 2007 Author Share Posted November 29, 2007 22m .................. Ian Hi Ian, I won't ask how you know that??!! Do you reckon that it long enough for challenge use or should I be steering towards a longer 11mm? Shrek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bull Bar Cowboy Posted November 29, 2007 Share Posted November 29, 2007 Normally that length is ample ....................... most pulls on a challenge event are short, but I also carry two 20m extension ropes (12mm) & a 40m extension rope (10mm) 22m is 72ft 2inches ................. If you try to get any more than 22mm on the standard drum then you risk bunching and will probably destroy the end plate ............. Ian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peatbog Posted December 4, 2007 Share Posted December 4, 2007 I use a standard terminal end crimped onto the rope....BUT! before the rope went on i put 6 turns of (deep breath) 'self adhesive waterproof high-grip non-slip decking tape'. basically the stuff they put on boat decks to stop you falling on your ass when its wet.. the 1 inch wide stuff costs about £3 per metre and wraps nicely round the drum, obviously make sure the drum is clean first. And no, it doesn't damage the rope as it doesn't slip over the tape, just grips to it. Sticks like s**t to a blanket!! B) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milemarker Type S Posted February 22, 2008 Author Share Posted February 22, 2008 Well after all the 'um'ing and 'ah'ing I finally plucked for welding a quarter of a chain link the the corner of the drum- I had the winch in bits to service it so it seemed rude not to. I have passed the line through the link, right around the drum, and then spliced the line back into itself. If When I go to far when lowering out I will end up hanging on the line spliced around the drum, and the welded link means that when I start winching in again the drum takes the line around with it and starts winching in again rather than the loop just staying still and the drum spinning doing nothing... or at least that is the plan... Competition tommorow so will find out whether the plan works...or not!!!??? I also have to admit to having had a bit of a 'moment' when I put my nice new shiny 75' of 12mm Dyneema Christmas present on the drum... It is a very tight fit even when spooled very neatly... the splice holding the hook on was being squashed slightly by the tie bars, and the slightest gap or mis-spool and it was applying pressure to them- not good... Option one was to shorten the rope but that seemed daft as it cost lots so why just hack bits off to not use, and it would also have left the line really too short to be usable for competitions- I would guess that about 60' of 12mm would be the most I would have been happy to have put on there from a not blowing the winch appart perspective- (for some reason when I saw BBC's with 75' of 12mm, very very neatly spooled onto it, I got it into my head that he had 100' of it??? No idea why and then thought that the 75' would be right...really must engage brain more often!) After some sleep (after I had collecting all my teddies and put them back in my cot...) I took option two... and went and saw Anton at OEC, where my other half got the 12mm from, with my cap in my hand- his response was spot on- top customer service again! "Okay, we will take the 12mm back and change it to 11mm and sort the money accordingly- how long 11mm do you want?" One short phone call to David at Goodwinch (David Bowyers off road centre) and an 80' 11mm was sorted out... I popped straight up to him to collect it (because as per usual I had left everything to the last minute and needed it for tommorow morning) and it was all spliced up and waiting for me when I got there! Then more top service from David with a tour of the place and some of his ideas for better hydraulic winches... and a free copy of his DVD about winching and driving techniques!! Top man. Got back, spliced line around drum and wind it all on- looks just about right! 100' of 11 mm would fit but need to be spooled on straight all the time... 80ft of 11mm looks about right allowing for screw ups! There endeth a much happier day - with the truck all loaded up for tommorow!! Shrek P.S. No connection with OEC or DB- Just a very happy customer who cannot recommend them highly enough! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milemarker Type S Posted February 24, 2008 Author Share Posted February 24, 2008 Well one very hard days winching later and... It worked- line still attached to the drum with no slippage... Happy bunny- thanks for all the top suggestions guys. Shrek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bull Bar Cowboy Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 Simon, I will have to look through my calcs, but If I can remember correctly your winch will stall at 3.7T due to the setting of the PRV on the ZF74's...... IIRC is about 1200 or 1500psi................ My PRV is on the spool and I have that set at 2500psi, which is a little beyond the safe spec for the motor (2300psi) , but it means the winch will stall out at just over 17000lbs ...7.14T I have stalled it when pulling out a tractor ................ but once the pressure gets over 2000psi I watch the gauge like a hawk and only ever let it flash up to 2.5K The Std MM is happy with 22M of 12mm ........... in comp use, or heavy winch use, I rarely re-spool all ............. we just coil it around the A bar. For longer pulls I carry several length of extension string .............. in total about 400ft o plasma in 20m and 45m lengths.............. Yes, 22M does tend to keep you focussed, but most comp stuff is short pulls............ also I use a Bushnell yardage pro scout laser rangefinder that will give me 1yd accuracy and up to 450yds to a tree...............so whilst winch monkey uncoils the rope, I just point to the tree we need.............easy Ian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milemarker Type S Posted February 24, 2008 Author Share Posted February 24, 2008 I will have to look through my calcs, but If I can remember correctly your winch will stall at 3.7T due to the setting of the PRV on the ZF74's...... IIRC is about 1200 or 1500psi................ Hi Ian- nice to see you yesterday. My gauge shows mine maxing out at 120bar which I think is about 1740psi?- Alan Byrne (4x4winches.co.uk) quotes the stall at 4.7T for this set up? No idea if that is right- I don't think I have the torque figures for the motor to be able to work out the pull from the pressure? Either way I have never managed to stall it... I used to run at 130 bar (1835psi) with the old pump- snapped the line more with the new set up but then the line has got older! I use a Bushnell yardage pro scout laser rangefinder that will give me 1yd accuracy and up to 450yds to a tree I like it... trust you to get all technical! Shrek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bull Bar Cowboy Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 The ZF I had was set to 100bar ………. So I guess he must reset them these days…… OK …………. From the manufacturers data and the fact that you are flowing 20L ish, gives a torque of 3007in/lbs and a speed of 90rpm……. Therefore in theory your max pull will be, Max pull = motor torque (in/lb) / Drum Radius (in) Max pull = (3007 X 6) / 1.25 (low gear in 6:1 – drum dia is 2.5in) Max Pull = 14433lbs ……or 6.44T …….. but we have not allowed inefficiencies….. So yes, a good 5T ……..probably closer to 6……. Your line speed will be ((2.5 x Pi) x 15 ) /12 ………or 9.8ft/min Ian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milemarker Type S Posted February 25, 2008 Author Share Posted February 25, 2008 Max Pull = 14433lbs ……or 6.44T …….. but we have not allowed inefficiencies…..So yes, a good 5T ……..probably closer to 6……. Your line speed will be ((2.5 x Pi) x 15 ) /12 ………or 9.8ft/min Excellent- thanks for that Ian... No wonder the 10mm went ping quite a lot then!!! Pretty much spot on for the line speed as well- I measured the time taken for 10 revs of the drum and then worked it out that way... 9ft/min in low at the drum surface rising to 18ft/min in low at the top layer (assuming diameter of 5" at that point) Shrek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m&mv80 Posted March 5, 2008 Share Posted March 5, 2008 sorry to bring this up again but is it posible to weld half a chain link to the centre of the drum without stripping the winch down, i dont want to melt anything and dont have time to remove the winch and strip it down before the weekend, thanks martin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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