mattdrummond99 Posted November 28, 2009 Share Posted November 28, 2009 why, if i wanted all the hassle of fitting an lt77 to my 109, do i have to change over transfer box or get dif mods? i know it has ujs instead of cv joints, but surely this is nt to much of a problem? a lot of older fwd cars have uj s. it says on little plate inside cab, something like if you use 4wd all the time, it will deteriate tyres quicker! so why not put lt 77 in and move whole lot 4" forward and leave as permanent 4wd? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRecklessEngineer Posted November 28, 2009 Share Posted November 28, 2009 Hi, and welcome. There have been many discussions about this in the past. I suggest using the search button. It also might be worth reading the guidance posts for new members at the top of this forum. James. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattdrummond99 Posted November 28, 2009 Author Share Posted November 28, 2009 hello again i had ran search and couldn t find any thing of real conclusion!and very few posts about, although i believe fridge magnet has a similar setup to what i would like to do? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon White Posted November 28, 2009 Share Posted November 28, 2009 I run mine in permanent 4wd. Why do you need to move it all forward? My engine in in the stock location and with an LT77 and LT230 the gear lever positions are perfect. Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattdrummond99 Posted November 28, 2009 Author Share Posted November 28, 2009 ok. thats all i needed to know other, than chassis strengthener did you move it? mine is 109 ex mil bolt on job is this in same place? thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
errol209 Posted November 29, 2009 Share Posted November 29, 2009 ok. thats all i needed to know other, than chassis strengthener did you move it? mine is 109 ex mil bolt on job is this in same place? thanks Its easier to use google: try this clicky linky thing (142 hits) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted November 29, 2009 Share Posted November 29, 2009 Mine's R380 but it's the same difference. You have a vehicle of superior wheelbase so you have plenty of space to fit it all in (usually people convert 88's which results in a rear propshaft about 6" long). My engine & box are actually further back than normal by a fair way. I removed most of my crossmembers for various reasons (winch trays, fuel tank, gearbox, PAS) and replaced with fabricated ones, the gearbox/bellhousing one being a bolt-in jobby from a Range Rover as they're flatter profile, and we had one kicking about. You need to drill & tube the chassis for the bolts (M10x100 from memory) and the same thing for the (standard RR again) gearbox & transfer box mounts. I went the LT230 route as it gives you a choice of ratios for high range and saves a lot of faffing about. I converted mine to 2WD, although as Jon W says you can run them in 4x4 no problem. The sticker on the Series bulkhead (and other vehicles too) refers to vehicles with no centre diff - they are either 2WD or locked 4WD, which will wind up and break if used on tarmac locked, whereas the LT230 has a centre diff when unlocked. Coincidentally, Nige has just written a big post about gearing so that will help you too. Plan view, x-members removed but not replaced yet: Side view: Clearance worked out well - flat bottom: And a very nice man made me a lovely transmission tunnel: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattdrummond99 Posted December 1, 2009 Author Share Posted December 1, 2009 hello! i see you have the v8. mine is 200tdi conversion, with this is there any need to chop and change x members? or will it just drop in and all line up? matt 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Hancock Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 The std bellhousing cross member needs to go as it will foul the front prop, you might get away with a 109 gearbox crossmember repositioned a bit like a stg 1 V8. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattdrummond99 Posted December 1, 2009 Author Share Posted December 1, 2009 The std bellhousing cross member needs to go as it will foul the front prop, you might get away with a 109 gearbox crossmember repositioned a bit like a stg 1 V8. ok thats fair enough, what happens about prop lengths? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 Matt, no offence but you may wish to invest in a tape measure so you can check these things for yourself Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattdrummond99 Posted December 1, 2009 Author Share Posted December 1, 2009 sorry chaps! but just wondering what i need to source before starting project! and what problems may/will arise, and if i really want to bother! its not really a drop in type of thing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 The photos I posted show you most of the main points - namely an LT77/R380 and LT230 sat in a 109 chassis in about the right place. My setup is a bit odd as I have a long (RR/Disco) bellhousing with a defender shifter. A quick crawl under the nearest defender with the tape measure / digital camera should tell you what the rest of it looks like. The tape measure will tell you what's needed props-wise, you may be able to get away with jiggling it all around to use off-the-shelf props (list of std lengths in the tech archive) or one standard and one custom, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve b Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 Hi ..When I built my 109 with a 200tdi and disco LT77/230 combo I ended up with 2 RRC/Disco rear props underneath, front and rear , I did mod the seatbox/ floor of mine tho so the gearstick might come out of the seat box on yours , that can be fixed tho as FF mentioned cheers Steveb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattdrummond99 Posted December 1, 2009 Author Share Posted December 1, 2009 i think i need to get me tape out! and go visit a mate of mine!!!! its a def short bell housing lt77 box, will change transfer box to disco 1.2 if i decide to go ahead! lets see! cheers matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted December 2, 2009 Share Posted December 2, 2009 Mind where the gear shifters are, you can't swap them without taking the whole box apart. Ask me how I know Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon White Posted December 2, 2009 Share Posted December 2, 2009 I'm running a disco 200tdi thats bolted in using the standard series engine mounts (mine was an 88" 2.25 petrol). Defender LT77 and disco transfer box - this set up puts the gear levers in the right position, and I've cut away the series trans tunnel and an using a cut about defender one. The only mod I had to do to the seat box was to get it to mate up to the trans tunnel. I cut out the bellhousing crossmember and the one that acts as geabox mount on the series. I replaced the bellhousing one with a modded one from a disco. You dont need the gearbox mount one as the LT230 has its own mounts. Props are made up to suit - rear is just a shortened series rear one, front is a shortened rangie one. It aint rocket science - you just need to make things up to suit. A bolt in mod it certainly isnt! HTH Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRecklessEngineer Posted December 2, 2009 Share Posted December 2, 2009 I'd be interested to know how you get on Matt. I plan on doing similar to mine, only with a V8 and conversion plate to defender lt77 all inside an 88". We should have similar front end issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gremlin Posted December 2, 2009 Share Posted December 2, 2009 If you manage to find one, fit a 1.003 TC, especially if you intend to keep series diffs and a tdi or v8. This mine before and after, with all the x members removed and a replacement welded in. G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattdrummond99 Posted December 2, 2009 Author Share Posted December 2, 2009 had tape out today! still working out, but bucketing down so did nt want to get too wet!! but seems (very rough) that yes, front prop about 200 odd mm short of front flange, yep was thinking about shortening rrc or even just a rear 109 prop and rear prop needs about an inch or so off. very rough measurements! and will check again when not raining! after which will check out shaft lengths in tech section (thanks fridge magnet) will also check out gear shifts but it seems that has just been answered, thanks. i saw on the dreaded bay, that there is a gearbox xmember for defenders that looks like couple of 1/4 plate welded to big diameter scaffold pole. anyone got any dimensions for this? as was wondering about using this for gearbox/bulkhead x member???????????? anyway its looking reasonably doable now!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twizzle Posted December 3, 2009 Share Posted December 3, 2009 hello this is how i done mine http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?showtopic=15793&view=findpost&p=195194 TWIZZLE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happyoldgit Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 Moved to the Series forum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattdrummond99 Posted December 4, 2009 Author Share Posted December 4, 2009 hello again! my only worry about this is the xmember behind gearbox, by pushing it back 4", will it not casue prop uj to be too tight? mine is ex millitary, so already has longer shackles on springs. love the disc brake idea twizzle, spose it does nt need moving at all then? trouble is they so damn expensive!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattdrummond99 Posted December 11, 2009 Author Share Posted December 11, 2009 hello again peeps! have actually got gearbox to take some measurements off now! i think , for me, easiest thing would be as follows: def bellhousing gearbox,(lt77 whatever!) disco lt230 1.2:1 as do quite a bit of trailer stuff, no point much higher. need to pull engine 4" or there abouts, forward, to give enough clearance to be able to: keep standard 109 rear prop and give enough clearance to remove handbrake drum, pull gearbox off of engine for removal etc i will need to move gearbox bellhousing crossmember back by a couple of inches if!! i want to run a shortened rear prop in sted of putting a 4"prop spacer on t box front shaft. I HAVE MILITARY CROSSMEMBER SO IT IS SCALLOPED! in order to give clearance for extra height on mil spring hangers, othether wise would prob leave as is!(if scalloped) now, i think! just a question of gearbox mountings? engine mountings are just chopped off and moved forward. any ideas? also any ideas on any kind of rad that will fit in front space behind front grill? was thinking about asking nice chap in twells to cut rad down in height and just fit in hole! got price for prop shortening as well £40 just incase any interested! give us some come back pls!!! oh and if anyone from kent wants to swap a 4.10 transfer for a 1.2 i would be more than interested!!! cheers matt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon White Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 Disk handbrake is the way to go - much better than the orgional drum! A standard series radiator will happily cool a TDi without modification. Why muck around with anything else? If you can weld shortening props is easy yourself. Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.