Hybrid_From_Hell Posted August 22, 2010 Share Posted August 22, 2010 Been a cleaning - big time The Inlet Trumpet, was not in a great shape, the ali trumpets are very thin ./ fine and light, and delicate over the years they have been bent, dinged and dented, I have spent several hours with a light hammer and a sand filled bag dollies and drifts, and files and all is now well again look close and your see the hours worth of fettling tapping filling and praying all is well EXCEPT One trumpet - which was 'loose' them came away completely while sorting them all out. Gawd Knows what these are stuck in with, I have 'Stud Lock' and various 'Loctite' tubes, and even thought of using the 'Black Flange sealant' stuff used to "Glue 200/300 Sumps on - but wondering if these will a - be right good and suitable or b- which of the aboveis best and c - is there something more suuitable / proper ?? Don't really wnat one "Coming out" so to speak again ? Thoughts please - Prefer from those who 'know' rather than "Guesses" - I can guess meself Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
errol209 Posted August 22, 2010 Share Posted August 22, 2010 Thoughts please - Prefer from those who 'know' rather than "Guesses" - I can guess meself I've just checked out my first hunch, and given the relatively low exposure to nail varnish remover and lowish mechanical forces, give the joint a very very good clean with degreasers and apply a little ethyl-2-cyanoacrylate (alias superglue). Perfect for this kind of joint. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anderzander Posted August 22, 2010 Share Posted August 22, 2010 'Devcon Aluminium Putty' is used on Motorcycle inlet tracts, ports etc, by a lot of the professional tuning shops. They use it to reshape ports for gas flowing - and it always bonds to the surface and I've never known of any to come off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted August 22, 2010 Author Share Posted August 22, 2010 Hmmmm Unsure if Mr 209 is pulling my chain or serious ? As to putty, its a seriously tight fit, so prob needs to be liquid ? Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickeyw Posted August 22, 2010 Share Posted August 22, 2010 Hmmmm Unsure if Mr 209 is pulling my chain or serious ? As to putty, its a seriously tight fit, so prob needs to be liquid ? Nige If it's that seriously tight, does it need any adhesive? However given the tight fit I would agree with Errol, the right grade of Loctite or cyanoacrylate glue is very good for creeping into joints. Superglue is good at this but I'm not sure the inside of an engine is the best environment for the domestic type of adhesives. Go for something of a commercial nature. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted August 22, 2010 Author Share Posted August 22, 2010 If it's that seriously tight, does it need any adhesive? However given the tight fit I would agree with Errol, the right grade of Loctite or cyanoacrylate glue is very good for creeping into joints. Superglue is good at this but I'm not sure the inside of an engine is the best environment for the domestic type of adhesives. Go for something of a commercial nature. Its tight, but pull outabull if that makes sense, not a loose wobbly fit I Have : Wurth "Thread Lock" Loctitie 270 Loctite 243 ?? Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRecklessEngineer Posted August 23, 2010 Share Posted August 23, 2010 I'd be going with epoxy I think. Not much will dissolve it and it certainly won't be coming out afterwards! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lara Posted August 23, 2010 Share Posted August 23, 2010 ARALDITE! No question! Lara Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
errol209 Posted August 23, 2010 Share Posted August 23, 2010 ARALDITE! No question! Lara I was serious about superglue. None of Wurth "Thread Lock", Loctite 270 or Loctite 243 appears to be a cyanoacrylate, they're Dimethacrylate ester based. Superglue is good to 150 degrees C, and Loctite 270 to 125 degrees C. Araldite softens above 65 degrees C. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lara Posted August 23, 2010 Share Posted August 23, 2010 We use Araldite and JB weld to improve gas flow in inlet manifolds and inlet ports, used it for many years and never had any problems with it coming loose or melting! I personally have used it in similar applications to this bell mouth with much success. Araldite info sheet shows it works to 100C and although it looses some of it's bond strength, I don't think it would be an isue in this instance. I actually glued a coplete air cooled 2 stroke gearbox together with it when I was 16 after a friend took a hammer to it in a frenzied fit! lost his patience and then gave it to me, I had it running after a long weekend and it lasted for years like that! He was gutted Lara Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn Posted August 23, 2010 Share Posted August 23, 2010 mate of mine used JBWeld/Chemical Metal type stuff on an inlet manifold to change port shape to match a different cylinder head, and when he pulled the manifold several months later the jbweld was gone. We could only guess that the petrol had dissolved it, as if it had come off in a big lump it'd have properly lunched the engine. That said, those trumpets are unlikely to see much petrol. I'd use superglue personally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickeyw Posted August 23, 2010 Share Posted August 23, 2010 For already close fit diameters I would not try to use an an epoxy. They are generally a thick substance, and therefore difficult to get into a joint - you'd end up with more of a fillet bond. Loctite have a vast range of products for differing applications. You want a retainer product rather than the thread locking ones you have mentioned further up. There are ones to apply prior to assembly, ones to apply post-assembly that use creep characteristics to fill the joint. If you look through the data sheets you will find mention of the max gaps that different variants will fill. For this application I would look for a low viscosity product. 601 could be an option but it's only good to 150 deg C. 620 is good to 230 deg but a little thicker. I recall many years ago in my apprenticeship days, a colleague stuck a 2p coin to a steel bench with 638 retainer. It took a good wack with a hammer and screwdriver chisel to remove it Definitely one of the retainer range for your application Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted August 23, 2010 Share Posted August 23, 2010 I found Loctite's tech helpline very helpful for this sort of question, pointed me to exactly the right thing for the job - unfortunately it wasn't for this sort of job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V8 Freak Posted August 23, 2010 Share Posted August 23, 2010 Nige, When I bought my inlet manifold from V8 Developments, Shaun said they used Superglue (or maybe a commercial version of...) to stick the trumpets in... Might be worth a call to him to check ! Neil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zim Posted August 24, 2010 Share Posted August 24, 2010 Araldite or CA glue. Used with an activator CA is extremely useful and quick drying. I used to rebuilds speakers for people they're completely stuck together with CA and when it comes time to clean the ally basket up you end up taking a layer of ally of with the glue. G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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