Mark90 Posted July 4, 2006 Share Posted July 4, 2006 Having fitted an auto box in the 90 with a big oil cooler, a temp guage and a manually switched fan. I was wondering what is ideal running temp for auto box's (the one in question is a ZF if that makes any difference), I had heard as cool as possible, is that right? Also at what temp should I start to worry it's getting too hot? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Hiatt Posted July 4, 2006 Share Posted July 4, 2006 Below 200F, 170F as a reasonable running temperature is the recommendation for my TH350 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveG Posted July 4, 2006 Share Posted July 4, 2006 You need to chat with Petergg or Simon at Devon 4x4, they have exhaustive experience of ZF auto box temps Cheers Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
honitonhobbit Posted July 4, 2006 Share Posted July 4, 2006 Good old Simon can boil auto fluid so it shoots out of the breathers! Mark, Unless you run huge gay tires without adjusting the gearing enough, the standard cooler will be fine. If you make the mistake of running a puffey electric fan and not a nice thermocouple jobbie, you will need additional constand assisitance air flow cooling over the cooler... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark90 Posted July 4, 2006 Author Share Posted July 4, 2006 200°F = 93°C that's lower than I expected. I'm running non-gay ickle tyres and I have a 34 row cooler with a puffy 9" electric fan Might register on D4x4 forum and pose the question there as I had heard Simon had experience of this sort of thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeriousIIa Posted July 4, 2006 Share Posted July 4, 2006 Good old Simon can boil auto fluid so it shoots out of the breathers! I can do that too Running 33x12,5 tires and it has problems when pulling a 3 ton trailer. Now altering the gearing to 1:4 t-case and mounting bigger cooler this weekend. Any ideas how much work involved changing the Transferbox with 4 pole lift? (how many hours??) Thanx! Cheers bowy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petergg Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 Having fitted an auto box in the 90 with a big oil cooler, a temp guage and a manually switched fan. I was wondering what is ideal running temp for auto box's (the one in question is a ZF if that makes any difference), I had heard as cool as possible, is that right? Also at what temp should I start to worry it's getting too hot? I have an modified ZF22 in my td5 90, on an event in France a month ago my gauge was reading 150c which I am lead to believe is to hot, it run ok and cooled down OK. As soon as I have time (after Billing) I will be fitting a new radiator and changing the pipe work to my Laminova oil to water cooler. I steered away from an air oil cooler, as to prevent it being blocked up with mud. I would say the best temperature is the same as you engine runs at and no more that 100c. I contacted a load of Oil manufactures and they all came back with different stories. I do put in Lubegard from Ashcroft’s, I can’t tell you what difference it makes as I have not run without it. Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark90 Posted July 5, 2006 Author Share Posted July 5, 2006 Cheers Peter, useful info. I don't suppose you have drained the oil that went to 150°C to see if it was burnt? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petergg Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 Cheers Peter, useful info.I don't suppose you have drained the oil that went to 150°C to see if it was burnt? I have loosened a pipe and taken some oil out which looked normal, it will be drained and replaced when I do the rad change. I did fit a new gauge and sender unit (In box Sump) when I fitted the Box but have not checked to see how accurate they read yet. Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark90 Posted July 5, 2006 Author Share Posted July 5, 2006 Cool, good to know the oil still seemed ok. I'm probably worrying unduly but it's nice to know what the limits are. I have a Racetech capliary guage fitted in the gearbox sump, checked in boiling water before fitting and it's bang on at 100°C Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petergg Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 Cool, good to know the oil still seemed ok.I'm probably worrying unduly but it's nice to know what the limits are. I have a Racetech capliary guage fitted in the gearbox sump, checked in boiling water before fitting and it's bang on at 100°C That must only just be in the oil, mine is a lot lower than that in the bottom part of sump. I have no dip stick and oil level is at the bung height. I think it is very important on the quality of oil, and changed frequently. Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will_warne Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 That must only just be in the oil, mine is a lot lower than that in the bottom part of sump. I have no dip stick and oil level is at the bung height.I think it is very important on the quality of oil, and changed frequently. Peter Mark, Peter is spot on. Change the oil regularly (every other one day event or every 2 plus day event is normally what I do) and use good quality, preferably with an additive. I also use Lubegaurd and it seems to do a good job. Where is you're cooler situated? The the biggest problem with air to oil coolers on Defenders is trying to find a sensible place to mount them. If you use the factory 50th Anniversary / NAS location under the radiator it'll get blocked at the first sight of mud and then things are going to get hot. The time you'll get hot anyway is during really long, tough winches and very demanding technical driving. This is when an underdrive really helps take the stress off the 'box. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark90 Posted July 5, 2006 Author Share Posted July 5, 2006 That must only just be in the oil, mine is a lot lower than that in the bottom part of sump. I have no dip stick and oil level is at the bung height. I checked where the oil level was on the sump from the markings on the dip stick and the sender is fully under the oil. I didn't want in on the lower part of the sump as I felt it was more vulnerable to damage. I realise it may well be out of the oil on steep slopes but that is something I'm happy to work with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will_warne Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 I'd build a gaurd onto the gearbox cross memeber if I were you; the ZF sumps are made of very thin steel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark90 Posted July 5, 2006 Author Share Posted July 5, 2006 I have been thinking about something out the front of the crossmember to protect the guage and pipe and something on the back to protect the sump. So many jobs, so little time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petergg Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 I'd build a gaurd onto the gearbox cross memeber if I were you; the ZF sumps are made of very thin steel What like this? Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will_warne Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 What like this? Peter Yep, I'm replacing my "no time, better make something" one that'll be along those lines. I'll also take the oppertunity to build in mounts for a 3rd link Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
white90 Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 Pete are thse QT arms? if so you have the phote reversed or the arms on the wrong side as the "QT" is backwards I did that and had to remove/swap them around Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filthy boy Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 I run a Laminova in my bottom hose on a Td5 and my auto box runs at 60 to 70 degrees C all day long. FB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will_warne Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 I run a Laminova in my bottom hose on a Td5 and my auto box runs at 60 to 70 degrees C all day long.FB I'm going to be getting my rad altered slightly to allow me to do something simerlar. At the moment I use coolant that's just been through the heater but this is not ideal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollythelw Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 theres a nice bloke in Reading Will, sorts all my rad mods out for peanuts if you want his number Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filthy boy Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 I'm going to be getting my rad altered slightly to allow me to do something simerlar. At the moment I use coolant that's just been through the heater but this is not ideal. Will Its really easy to just chop out a section of the bottom hose, pop in your Laminova (the big one just fits OD and lengthwise) and plumb it in. And you just need to make up a mount for it that fits neatly on the front cross member. Easy-peasy and almost free! FB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Petergg Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 Pete are thse QT arms?if so you have the phote reversed or the arms on the wrong side as the "QT" is backwards I did that and had to remove/swap them around Tony, Yes and Yes, they are wrong way round, but I put the paint on upside down so fitted arms to suit FB, That's what I will be doing in a couple of weeks, at the moment I draw hot water from heater like Will and it is not good enough. It stays at about 70c normally but a lot higher when worked hard. Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filthy boy Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 FB, That's what I will be doing in a couple of weeks, at the moment I draw hot water from heater like Will and it is not good enough. It stays at about 70c normally but a lot higher when worked hard. Peter Peter Never understood the heater hose deal. It fits so easily in the bottom hose. Only problem is you do have to lose the viscous fan. FB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
will_warne Posted July 5, 2006 Share Posted July 5, 2006 WillIts really easy to just chop out a section of the bottom hose, pop in your Laminova (the big one just fits OD and lengthwise) and plumb it in. And you just need to make up a mount for it that fits neatly on the front cross member. Easy-peasy and almost free! FB Yeah, the only issue is that the laminova's tucked up nicely under the top of the offside wing with all the hosing done properly. I may have to move it when I go coilover but I'm not sure yet. Jez, yeah, I may get that number off you. Does your guy work on alloy rads? Did you get my message a little while ago about roofs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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