Troll Hunter Posted May 9, 2014 Share Posted May 9, 2014 Since my R380 g'box is shedding bright flakes of metal - and the odd metal nugget - I'm planning to replace the clutch parts while I have the box out. I know that Valeo components are available over here (Canada), but none of the motor component factors can help me with part numbers because the Defender was never imported into N. America. All they can give me are RRC part numbers. Please can somebody give me the Valeo part numbers, not the LR part numbers, for the Defender 130 friction plate and pressure plate so that I can order locally, and not have to sell a kidney to afford freight from UK? Most of my driving is on-road, about 30,000 miles/yr, and I'm occasionally towing a fairly heavy trailer. For this clutch assembly can/should I use the HD clutch fork, FTC2957HD, and the HD release bearing, FTC5200HD, both available from Paddocks? Many thanks for all info and experiences you can provide. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverik Posted May 9, 2014 Share Posted May 9, 2014 Try this.... http://www.valeoservice.com/data/master/webfile/16129070104C655F313FCC9.pdf?rnd=471 Page 189/190... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dailysleaze Posted May 9, 2014 Share Posted May 9, 2014 I don't know if this would help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Hunter Posted May 9, 2014 Author Share Posted May 9, 2014 Maverick, Many thanks for the link, spot on, and now I almost know what I need . On p.190 it appears that there are two options for the R380 box, but neither is specifically for the Defender 130: Kit 801991 with a friction plate of 235mm diameter or Kit 826233 with a friction plate of 242mm diameter. They both have the same cover plate, but Kit 826233 is for a flywheel that is 28mm thick. Now, I've no idea how thick my flywheel is and I can't measure it because I haven't started to take the box out. It's still my daily driver. My Defender 1996 300Tdi Workshop Manual gives the friction plate diameter as 235mm, but no details of the flywheel, so where does the 242mm one come from? Can the 242mm plate be fitted instead of the 235mm item? Is the flywheel thickness critical in the choice of unit? I'm sorry for so many questions, but, as so often, LR rarely gives the full story! Any further info and guidance will be very much appreciated. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted May 9, 2014 Share Posted May 9, 2014 130 heavy duty friction plate has 8 damper springs, the standard fit plate only has 6. the 8 spring plate will fit any of the 4 cylinder diesel engines, I have this 8 spring in my 200tdi. standard fit plate is 235mm diameter according to my 300tdi workshop manual 242mm diameter is the friction plate for 2.25, 2.5 petrol & diesel engines pre 1987, the late 2.5 n/a & TD engines use a 235mm plate so my Defender workshop manual says.as does the Tdi engines. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miketomcat Posted May 9, 2014 Share Posted May 9, 2014 I fitted a "130" clutch to 45 for ladoga (200tdi) the flywheel and pressure plate are standard items. The only thing that makes it a 130 clutch is the friction plate as western says it has 8 damper springs and it is a bigger diameter around 10mm from memory so that fits with measurements above. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Hunter Posted May 10, 2014 Author Share Posted May 10, 2014 OK, guys, now you've got me really confused! My WSM says the standard diameter is 235mm, as confirmed by Western, but you, miketomcat, think that the 130 friction plate is a larger diameter than standard, apossibly an additional 10mm . This would sort of agree with the Valeo catalogue, which shows two kits that fit the R380 box, but the 242mm diameter kit specifies a flywheel thickness of 28mm. Perhaps somebody else can throw in an opinion. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob86 Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 Ive got a plate somewhere I'll try and find it over the weekend and see if there are any numbers and get some measurements. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miketomcat Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 When I was looking I couldn't find a 130 clutch kit I could only find a friction plate when I checked numbers it confirmed the pressure plate was standard. I bought a friction and pressure plate and fitted them to a 200tdi disco engine/flywheel the rust line on the flywheel was smaller than the new plate. This made sense to me as larger friction plate equals more contact area therefore heavy duty. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSD Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 It's been a while since I looked at this, but from memory I agree with miketomcat, 242mm is the HD clutch, 235 is the std. I shattered the spring carrier of my HD clutch, and I've heard of it happening to other people. OF course that may be due to the std clutch just slipping in the same situation. http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?showtopic=13053 http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?showtopic=6640 Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Hunter Posted May 10, 2014 Author Share Posted May 10, 2014 I've followed the links above, and many thanks for supplying them, and it appears that there's considerable difference of opinions regarding the Valeo and B&B clutches, both for 110 standard and 130 bits. I've also e-mailed Ashcroft for their view, since I'm getting my replacement box from them. When I get their response I'll post up. Having followed this post: http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?showtopic=4380, through one of the above links, what's the concesus regarding g'box removal: up, through the cabin, as with the engine crane, or down, ideally with a transmission jack? Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Hunter Posted May 10, 2014 Author Share Posted May 10, 2014 I've had a reply from Ashcroft, but they cannot help. They only use the LR part numbers, and are not familiar with Valeo part numbers, but they did refer me to their site: http://www.ashcroft-transmissions.co.uk/miscellaneous/clutches/130-tdi-clutch-kit.html Now I'm just waiting for a reply from Valeo themselves, which I'll post, but it probably won't be until Monday soonest. Dailysleaze, many thanks for the photo, but I can't tie up the numbers with any on the Valeo clutch catalogue. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 did my last clutch change by shifting the main & transfer boxes rearwards, so the front edge of bell housing was sat on the gearbox cross member, gave enough space to remove & fit the plate/cover & new release bearing. had to do it that way as I didn't have access to a crane or lift/pit to work from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob86 Posted May 11, 2014 Share Posted May 11, 2014 The plate Ive got was sold to me by paddocks as a 130 plate is 235mm in diameter and the only numbers i can see on it apart from the date is 367739 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverik Posted May 13, 2014 Share Posted May 13, 2014 I've removed 3 engines out of Defenders in the past 3 weeks, and its so easy you wouldn't believe (taking an engine out a disco is not quite so straight forward). I've got a random branded 2t engine crane which can lift the engine over the radiator. If you've not got a decent engine crane then go for the transfer box backwards option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Hunter Posted May 14, 2014 Author Share Posted May 14, 2014 Maverik, I've got to replace the g'box, not just fit new clutch components, so what is the preferred way to do this? Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miketomcat Posted May 14, 2014 Share Posted May 14, 2014 Personally I drop the gearbox and tbox together then spit and reverse. Easier with an engine Crain through the tunnel but not to bad with two jacks. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverik Posted May 16, 2014 Share Posted May 16, 2014 In my mind if you have a few options if the gearbox is coming out too, depending on what equipment you have, a gearbox and transfer box together are mighty heavy, as I presume you'll be re-fitting your old transfer box? I which case I'd split it into as smaller chucks as possible, meaning remove the T box then the gear box, then build up in reverse order... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Hunter Posted June 7, 2014 Author Share Posted June 7, 2014 At last, I've got some results to post. Valeo customer service were outstandingly unable/unprepared to help. They seemed to be totally unaware of the catalogue that Maverick provided a link to: http://www.valeoserv...CC9.pdf?rnd=471 and several e-mails indicated that they were not really interested in helping. So, I ordered from Paddocks, and received their usual good service. From their 130 Tdi menu I ordered the Valeo clutch plate, the clutch cover plate, described incorrectly as "all 4 cyl diesel except 130 300Tdi", and the clutch release bearing. Paddocks admitted that the clutch cover plate was incorrectly described and that the plate listed was the correct HD plate for 130 300 Tdi. The Valeo numbers on the friction disc and the cover plate that I received are: Friction disc: On both sides of the disc, on the friction material: F810 402 U13584310C On the steel hub: Valeo 387739 and the date and time of manufacture. The friction disc has 8 springs and is 235mm diameter. Cover plate: The only marking is: Valeo 582833 and the date and time of manufacture. The cover plate has 18 fingers. Interestingly, neither of the main Valeo numbers correspond with the part numbers in the Valeo catalogue in the link provided by Maverick! So, I'm going ahead to fit the parts I've received, and if there are any problems regarding part numbers, I'll post accordingly. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 is this any use as posted in a earlier thread you wrote http://www.valeoservice.com/html/export/en/produits.focus.php Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troll Hunter Posted June 9, 2014 Author Share Posted June 9, 2014 Hi, Western, I don't remember ever seeing this Valeo link, but having followed it, they don't seem to list any products for Land Rover, unless I'm missing something. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted June 9, 2014 Share Posted June 9, 2014 Does this help ??? from Valeo online catologue -- http://outcat-cs.tecdoc.net/ows/en/583A771E295E5519390341B0DA96F574.ows_cs4.srv?view=VIndexFramesetJsp plus my walk through from a previous post on same subject http://smg.photobucket.com/user/western214h/media/Valeo%20website/IMG_0798.jpg.html?sort=3&o=6 VALEO Clutch Disc 094446 Clutch Disc 0 Trade Numbers: D322S Supersedes: 266654 Engine Code: 11L from MY: 10/1990 to MY: 09/1994 Transmission Type: Manual Transmission, Transm. Type: LT77S,R380, Ø: 235 mm, Hub Profile: 26,4 x 21, Teeth Quant.: 23 - Passenger cars range 803387 Clutch Disc 0 Engine Code: 23L from MY: 07/1994 to MY: 11/1998 Transmission Type: Manual Transmission, Transm. Type: R380, Hub Profile: 23x23,3x26,5, Ø: 235 mm, Teeth Quant.: 23 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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