Tell me all about Webasto Thermotop heaters.

[Ex Member]

18 minutes ago, malce said:

Hi just bought a thermotop V and just want to turn it on/off via a remote control, any idea how easy it is, I have the fuel pump so hopefully just a few more bits.

You just need to supply 12V, so very easy.

[ballcock]

2 minutes ago, Red90 said:

You just need to supply 12V, so very easy.

As far as I know the Thermotop V requires a W bus signal or Can bus to operate. Please enlighten me otherwise.

[Ex Member]

https://www.butlertechnik.com/downloads/Webasto_Heater_Thermo_Top_V_Workshop_Manual.pdf

Pretty sure they still power up as normal with 12V to pin 2.  No need for the Can bus.  See page 702 for the basic timer hookup.

[daveturnbull]

45 minutes ago, ballcock said:

As far as I know the Thermotop V requires a W bus signal or Can bus to operate. Please enlighten me otherwise.

This is the original problem I came across. Some are happy with 12v, some need w-bus, but there seems to be no obvious way to tell which from the model numbers. 

[Badger110]

1 hour ago, Red90 said:

You just need to supply 12V, so very easy.

It's not unfortunately. It requires a timer which outputs a W bus signal to start.

1 hour ago, ballcock said:

As far as I know the Thermotop V requires a W bus signal or Can bus to operate. Please enlighten me otherwise.

Have a look here;

http://www.disco3.co.uk/forum/topic118254.html

 

[ballcock]

2 minutes ago, Badger110 said:

It's not unfortunately. It requires a timer which outputs a W bus signal to start.

Have a look here;

http://www.disco3.co.uk/forum/topic118254.html

 

I have read that and others that all point to needing a W bus or Can bus signal hence my previous posts. But as I am always willing to learn I shall see if my unit will power on with a 12v feed to the plug. The unit I have came out of a VW. 

[Badger110]

5 minutes ago, ballcock said:

I have read that and others that all point to needing a W bus or Can bus signal hence my previous posts. But as I am always willing to learn I shall see if my unit will power on with a 12v feed to the plug. The unit I have came out of a VW. 

The issue with your previous post was that i read it and in my rush to reply, forgot it.

Which just means i'm a little slow this evening

[malce]

23 hours ago, ballcock said:

Mines on hold for a while. The timer I bought doesn't appear to be sending out a signal niether 12v or W bus so looking for an alternative. You an use a remote as long as it operates a W  bus signal.

Thanks for the info, looking at the telestart T100 htm, I am totally new to this and working on a wing and a prayer. haha

 

 

[ballcock]

On 12/5/2019 at 9:23 PM, ballcock said:

I am in the process of fitting a thermotop V to my Defender. The installation manuals are easy to find on line. I have bought a 1533 timer to run mine which has a W bus output which hopefully will make it work. The unit I have is out of VW which is Audi badged and has a different plug to the Land Rover units. I was talking to a company at the Land Rover show at Stoneleigh the other weekend who make leads up for these units. They also make a unit which triggers a w bus output with a 12v input signal which sounded good value for money. The company is called futuranet and appear to be quite active with the Disco 3 forum. I have no connection with them but they seem to know what they are talking about. On a seperate note the fuel pumps also act as a metering pump so you need the correct pump for the heater type.

A little update on this. Having bought a second 1533 controller as the first didn't seem to be putting out a signal I was still unable to get the unit to work. I decided to try the other unit I got from a similiar car this also would not work. I found a unit out of a Jaguar on ebay at a good price so decided to buy that. I also ordered some cableing from Futuranet to connect to my computer. What I have learnt might be of use to someone else.

Firstly the Jag unit doesn't come with a water pump although the socket is there. The Webasto software seems easy to use. Which seems to show that the VW units will only run as auxillary heaters and are unable to run as parking heaters, Unless some one knows how to reprogramme this.

Unfortunately both the water pumps on my VW units are useless so I need to find a replacement and see if I can get the Jag unit to run it, if not then a seperate supply from the controller with an overun timer might work.

[plaviator]

If you buy a second-hand Thermo top Z/C from a car, you will probably find that it will not work as it needs the cars' computer to talk to it before it will fire. This can be overcome by fitting a new control card as I have found out. The man who makes these pcb's  is in Poland and can supply the board for around £50. If you are interested, contact me <email removed>. Michael

Edited April 29, 2020 by Retroanaconda
Public display of email address not a good idea - suggest PM is used to make contact.

[Tobias]

ballcock, you might have luck opening the water pumps u and spraying wd40 or similar inside and try to work them loose. I've had success in resurrecting pumps.

T

[ballcock]

20 hours ago, Tobias said:

ballcock, you might have luck opening the water pumps u and spraying wd40 or similar inside and try to work them loose. I've had success in resurrecting pumps.

T

It's not the impeller causing the problem. Due to their position on the vehicle water gets into the motor end and seems to have frozen and blown the unit open.

[plaviator]

On 12/4/2019 at 11:37 PM, Badger110 said:

They are unfortunately.

It is a simple matter to convert these type of heaters from Can Bus control using an analogue conversion PCB to replace the original.

If you have the one pictured on the right then this board on the left will convert it to be controlled by a simple on/of switch

 

 

 

 

[RAF3]

On 12/3/2019 at 8:32 PM, Gluv said:

I have a winterised wolf with the thermotop pro fitted. I usually warm the engine through prior to starting in the winter months . The radiators in the back really kick some heat out. Mine just starts from a simple switch on the dash 🙂

Gluv 🇬🇧

How does that wolf system work with the radiators?

[Snagger]

18 hours ago, RAF3 said:

How does that wolf system work with the radiators?

Winterised Defenders had convective radiators along each side of the load bed, basically a full length loop of 1/2” copper pipe with heat sink vertical plates to increase the surface area and protect the pipes.  They are little different from a domestic wall mounted radiator.

[Gluv]

4 hours ago, Snagger said:

Winterised Defenders had convective radiators along each side of the load bed, basically a full length loop of 1/2” copper pipe with heat sink vertical plates to increase the surface area and protect the pipes.  They are little different from a domestic wall mounted radiator.

There's a small radiator in the battery box too . Both lots of rads can be turned off by means of valves in the seat box and and also the rear  bulkhead 

Gluv🇬🇧

[simonr]

As far as I'm aware (proven accurate for me, so far), any C or E will work with a 12V switched line, without any W-Bus input.  E's are rare as they are lower power than C's though the only difference is the ECU.  You can put a C ECU in an E and it will run at the higher power.

Unless you really need a Webasto timer, the ECU's from the guy on eBay are cheaper than the OE Timer.  The only real advanage of (some) timers is they give diagnostic info.

The last one I bought, on eBay was a BMW X5 Aux Heater - for £35.  It was just a bare unit, without the fuel or water pump.  I mostly bought it for spares / experimentation.  I bought a £10 chinese fuel pump and a Chinese water pump (search "Auxiliary water pump parking") - £20 to £30 is typical.  The bare plugs to make up my own loom proved more expensive than just buying a ready made loom.  Bottom line is you can be up & running for under £100.

[Dave9252]

Where are you guys plumbing them into? On the heater line or the head?

 

[Tobias]

the heater hose from head to heater.

 

[Tobias]

Sort of like this