Phill S Posted December 11, 2021 Share Posted December 11, 2021 I've been trawling through the various postings on this conversion and pretty sure this is the way I'm going on my vehicle. I'm currently going through the first pass of the planning process. I'm pretty comfortable with most aspects of what I'm in for in this job. Thinking to go 3.5 or possibly 3,9, largely because it's an engine I'm very familiar with, and an R380 box. At the rear end I currently have a very good 1.41 LT230R and would expect to use that. A little delving and I find the Defender R380 box models are the 60A and 61A. These seem to have the same gear ratios, so can anybody tell me what the difference is? I'm quite happy rebuilding R380's, and indeed LT77's, and will be looking for a suitable R380 that I can rebuild. On that basis, I assume I can use any suitable R380 as long as I use the correct input shaft? That would give me a wider choice of second hand units to choose from rather than specifically looking for Defender model. Is it reasonable to assume that any R380 will mate with my LT230R? Finally (for now!), what bellhousing am I looking for? I assume that the length of my current LT77 from the front of the steel casing to the back of the rear ally casing is the same as an R380? I'm obviously wanting to make sure the position of the engine mounts will end up in the same place as the 1987 factory models. Grateful for any help in pinning this down - don't want to start buying the wrong stuff! Once I understand what I'm after I'll start posting wanted ads... Thanks Phill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retroanaconda Posted December 11, 2021 Share Posted December 11, 2021 All back ends of R380s are the same so will mate to the LT230 okay, as long as you rebuild with a V8 input shaft/pinion then you can build up any spec you want in terms of shifter position etc. An R380 is an inch longer then an LT77, and so the two V8-type bellhousings are also a different length so that the overall package length is the same. This is important as an LT77 V8 bellhousing will fit onto an R380 but will be too long and not allow the input shaft to properly engage with the back of the crankshaft. From memory the correct R380 bellhousing is about 11” long compared to the LT77 one at c. 12”. R380 V8 bellhousings are fairly rare, but Ashcrofts do make their own new ones if it comes to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill S Posted December 11, 2021 Author Share Posted December 11, 2021 Hey - that's brilliant, thanks. That looks like the solution I'm looking for. One further query, does the R380 with 11" bellhousing bring the sticks out in the "correct" place? I've done some searches on the Ashcroft website, but can't find the item. I'll put in a query and see what comes back Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill S Posted December 11, 2021 Author Share Posted December 11, 2021 Well I've found the original part number: https://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?showtopic=7397&st=0&gopid=76634 V8/R380 FTC3922 - Thanks Western Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rednaxela Posted December 11, 2021 Share Posted December 11, 2021 https://ashcroft-transmissions.co.uk/product/r380-v8-bellhousing/ Then I think you'll need FRC 2859 cover plate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted December 11, 2021 Share Posted December 11, 2021 6 hours ago, Retroanaconda said: All back ends of R380s are the same Defender ones have a different shifter turret mounting to the Disco/RR ones although Ashcroft do a conversion kit for them I think - it looks like you should be able to bolt a Defender shifter onto a RR/Disco box but you can't... ask me how I found that out As for engine choice, I'd be looking at cheap MOT-failed but running V8 Disco 2's and P38's as the 4.0 / 4.6 give a few useful improvements like better oil pumps, single serpentine ancillary belt, and cross-bolted mains as well as a useful torque boost over the 3.5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted December 11, 2021 Share Posted December 11, 2021 Considered going auto? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missingsid Posted December 12, 2021 Share Posted December 12, 2021 I see you have cast your net wide? You're on the Rover V8 engine appreciation Facebook group then, I only just joined and the first post I see is looking for an R380 bellowing 11 inch as 12 inch is just too long, ooh err. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill S Posted December 12, 2021 Author Share Posted December 12, 2021 Thanks guys - I think I'm getting there on gearboxes... 16 hours ago, rednaxela said: https://ashcroft-transmissions.co.uk/product/r380-v8-bellhousing/ Then I think you'll need FRC 2859 cover plate. Great! I'd overlooked this item, but if I understand correctly this will bolt directly onto the back of a good old 3.5/3.9 and have everything line up correctly? Just want to make sure before I start ordering parts! I understand the cover plate issue, that doesn't sound like a big deal. 14 hours ago, FridgeFreezer said: Defender ones have a different shifter turret mounting to the Disco/RR ones although Ashcroft do a conversion kit for them I think Thanks for the tip. However. Can't find this either. Ashcroft search facility seems to have changed since last I used them and I'm now having trouble finding anything unless it's obvious... Will lodge a query with them. 13 hours ago, Bowie69 said: Considered going auto? My personal preference is manual, and R380 over LT77 for a bunch of reasons 5 hours ago, missingsid said: You're on the Rover V8 engine appreciation Facebook group then, Yeah - only found out about it the other day. Hoping to start work on this project early Jan, and so setting about collecting up the right bits Thanks again all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill S Posted December 12, 2021 Author Share Posted December 12, 2021 So I think I have just two more questions to nail down the gearbox side of things... 1) I assume the LHS mounting bracket fits onto the R380 box in the same place as the LT77 that's coming out? Or is it a grinding and welding job to get an R380 specific bracket in the right place? 2) What about the body aspects. Am I going to need to chop the bulkhead about, replace floor, tunnel or seat box with R380 jobs? Thanks - Phill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill S Posted January 7, 2022 Author Share Posted January 7, 2022 I believe I'm on top of this now, but just before I start spending money I thought I'd test where I've arrived at on you guys. I've spent this afternoon stripping down a quite good R380that will need overhaul. Its a 55A 0600 and something suffix J, i.e. a Discovery box so: Existing Input shaft has 22 teeth, so it looks like the part I will need for the V8 will be FTC5044 I picked up a bell housing that I think is the correct one - 277mm between faces I think the crankshaft bush will be the usual 549911 I'll probably use the Disco to Defender adapter kit from Synchro Gearboxes so I can use my LT77 gear change unit I have some clutch parts, the guide FRC4803, lever 576137 and push rod 571160. Looking at p331 in the parts book, I think all the rest of the bits should be available Anybody able to say whether that lot sounds about right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junglie Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 I can't answer but I'm interested to see what everyone else has to say... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted January 7, 2022 Share Posted January 7, 2022 I'm in the workshop tomorrow, I'll try and measure my bellhousing. I have a pile of V8 clutch release arms here if one of those is of any use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill S Posted January 8, 2022 Author Share Posted January 8, 2022 9 hours ago, FridgeFreezer said: I'm in the workshop tomorrow, I'll try and measure my bellhousing. I have a pile of V8 clutch release arms here if one of those is of any use. Thanks for that! I'll put up some pics this evening of what I've got - much easier to see what's what that way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted January 8, 2022 Share Posted January 8, 2022 Measured it, 277mm is about bang on along the bottom of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill S Posted January 8, 2022 Author Share Posted January 8, 2022 Excellent - thanks. I picked up the bell housing I have via the "Rover V8 Engine Appreciation" Facebook page. Here's what I have - I haven't cleaned it yet. I assume the casting date is saying 1986 rather than the 1998 I'd prefer it to say? The clutch parts in the last pic look re-useable, but I haven't yet investigated the other bits needed, or plastic bits that need to be replaced. Busy in the guts of the box just now... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted January 9, 2022 Share Posted January 9, 2022 I think XCess4x4 do a stainless steel clip and I think also sell the all-metal clutch release bearings which are more resilient than the stock plastic ones. The metal clutch bearings are fairly available everywhere if Nige doesn't have any. Here's my shamefully filthy bellhousing: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill S Posted January 10, 2022 Author Share Posted January 10, 2022 On 1/9/2022 at 2:58 PM, FridgeFreezer said: I think XCess4x4 do a stainless steel clip Ok - haven't come across them before, will take a look at what they have.... On 1/9/2022 at 2:58 PM, FridgeFreezer said: Here's my shamefully filthy bellhousing Thanks for that - looks plausible that it's what I have. What gearbox do you have? Think I'm just going to have to go and buy an FTC5044 pinion on sale or return and mock up the front of the gearbox to see if it all fits together properly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted January 10, 2022 Share Posted January 10, 2022 5 hours ago, Phill S said: Thanks for that - looks plausible that it's what I have. What gearbox do you have? Think I'm just going to have to go and buy an FTC5044 pinion on sale or return and mock up the front of the gearbox to see if it all fits together properly I have an R380, but it was built by Ashcrofts for me so it's got the V8 front end with a Defender shifter housing, plus their usual upgrades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill S Posted January 11, 2022 Author Share Posted January 11, 2022 19 hours ago, FridgeFreezer said: I have an R380, but it was built by Ashcrofts for me so it's got the V8 front end with a Defender shifter housing, plus their usual upgrades. Ok - thanks. I think I know what I need for the box now. I'll itemise once I have it all working. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phill S Posted January 12, 2022 Author Share Posted January 12, 2022 That looks too good to miss! I owe you beer Who would have thought that the right thing would turn up at exactly the right time. I was about to start ordering parts this morning - for the record, David Ashcroft got back to me last night to confirm that FTC5044 would be the correct input shaft/pinion. I just have to work out how to get it from Oban to Lands End complete with delicate pipework and ineffective oil cooler... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted January 12, 2022 Share Posted January 12, 2022 13 hours ago, Phill S said: That looks too good to miss! I owe you beer Not at all - it saves me having to convince myself I don't really need a spare R380 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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