Puffernutter Posted August 20, 2023 Share Posted August 20, 2023 I know that this is covered by many threads, but nothing seems to work! LR90 Defender 1989 - The back story - at the last MoT the landy only just passed on handbrake with the comment it will need looking at sooner rather than later! So, on that basis, I ordered new shoes. Today I had a look at the handbrake. On removing the drum, it was clear why there were problems - very greasy shoes! Everything was removed (a few bits from the expander fell out), I cleaned the drum and backplate, re-assembled and it was worse then ever. Removed it all again having read there is a specific way to reassemble the expander! Took the back plate off and on my bench, removed all the parts to the expander, cleaned, greased and reassembled, holding it all together with an elastic band! Re-assembled it all back on the car and the handbrake lever is at the maximum extent and it barely holds. So we have: New shoes Expander assembled correctly Handbrake cable on the very last threads at the drum end And still I cannot get the handbrake anywhere close - a gust of wind will move it ! It's almost as it the cable is too long, it is a newish cable and hasn't had much use and it was OK at one time (so I doubt if it has stretched) So, what is so obvious I'm missing it? Thanks in advance Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve b Posted August 20, 2023 Share Posted August 20, 2023 Have to say, the cable is the prime suspect. With new shoes I assume the adjuster opposite the cable is near minimum ? Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve b Posted August 20, 2023 Share Posted August 20, 2023 How much slack is in the cable with the HB off? Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puffernutter Posted August 20, 2023 Author Share Posted August 20, 2023 (edited) I've just put the car away, but by the fact that I am at the extreme of the thread at the brake end and I have to go to almost the extreme travel of the handbrake before even a slight resistance is felt - too much! It's almost as if it is too long at the brake end from the end of the thread. I am not sure if there are different handbrake cables? The other question - the adjuster opposite the expander - moved until I could hear it rubbing then backed off. The shoes are also in the correct way round! Edited August 20, 2023 by Puffernutter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve b Posted August 20, 2023 Share Posted August 20, 2023 Time for a new cable by the sound of it. They can get damaged if there is or has been a bad main earth - starter to battery . JLR cable if available would be my choice Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eightpot Posted August 20, 2023 Share Posted August 20, 2023 When you say everything inside was greasy - I take it you meant the shoes and you have now fitted a new oil seal? Also on the early style handbrakes, they can have a lot of wear on the operating lever that the cable attaches too, its hinge and the expander mechanism, meaning you have to move the handbrake lever a long way before the shoes even start to move. Add that to a stretched cable and you'll struggle to get much to happen. Whip the drum off, get an assistant to pull the lever on & off and have a look at what's happening - the shoes should start to move as soon as the lever is pulled. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puffernutter Posted August 20, 2023 Author Share Posted August 20, 2023 Yes and yes. I love the phrase "whip the drum off" which = chock the front, jack up the rear and put in axle stands, remove 4 nuts and 4 nuts and bolts then two cross head screws. All whilst lying underneath 🙂 However, I take the point about the wear on the operating mechanism! I do wonder if it is wear on the piece that fits in the expander that is some of the problem. Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muzaz Posted August 21, 2023 Share Posted August 21, 2023 Is the handbrake the early linkage type? I had the transfer case off recently and I took the handbrake mechanism apart to service it. The adjuster is pretty straight forward, its just a threaded cone and 2 siders, can't go wrong with the installation. However if you took the expander apart it's quite difficult to reassemble under the car. There are 2 small rollers which if not correctly positioned will not expand the brake. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puffernutter Posted August 21, 2023 Author Share Posted August 21, 2023 Hello, it's not that early. It has the square end and no threaded cone that I could see! The expander, I realised when the parts fell out it wasn't simple in the car, so I took off the backplate and cleaned everything and re-assembled it correctly - at least the two parts seems to move slightly when the central rod was operated. A question for the collective, in case there is too much wear in my expander I have bought another, with the three sliding clips - what order do they go in? There seems to be two sliding clips (I assume one from the top and one from the bottom) bit where does the "space go? In between them, at the bottom, on the top? I've looked and cannot find any information! Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve b Posted August 21, 2023 Share Posted August 21, 2023 5 minutes ago, Puffernutter said: at least the two parts seems to move slightly when the central rod was operated. The "pistons" should move quite a distance - how does the new pre-assembled one compare? clips 515468 plate- spring to back plate from top 515467 plate- locking next from bottom 515470 plate- packing finallly from bottom. The boot 515466 then fits over the edge of 515467 hth Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puffernutter Posted August 21, 2023 Author Share Posted August 21, 2023 23 minutes ago, steve b said: The "pistons" should move quite a distance - how does the new pre-assembled one compare? clips 515468 plate- spring to back plate from top 515467 plate- locking next from bottom 515470 plate- packing finallly from bottom. The boot 515466 then fits over the edge of 515467 hth Steve Movement - I'll let you know when it arrives. I only ordered it last night! On the one I have, I didn't see much movement at all to be honest and I double checked I had the pistons and the rollers in the correct way round! Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hurbie Posted August 21, 2023 Share Posted August 21, 2023 maybee this helps : make sure you have the piston's in the right way 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puffernutter Posted August 21, 2023 Author Share Posted August 21, 2023 Thank you - my manual shows the expander being held in by 2 bolts - I am certain the expander is correct, I know there is a ramp on the end and I took great care in re-assembly! But that picture of the plates in invaluable! Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muzaz Posted August 21, 2023 Share Posted August 21, 2023 (edited) The expander is held by the spring clips, the manual adjuster on the other hand is bolted. This is the early cable/linkage type handbrake. It took me a while to assemble the adjuster correctly, my mistake was I had the plungers 180° off, so when I pulled on the linkage, I had little to no movement on the plungers. Took them apart and rotated them and immediately the travel was much larger. This thread might be of interest. Edited August 21, 2023 by muzaz Added a link Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonpelly Posted August 21, 2023 Share Posted August 21, 2023 Some pictures if it helps. Simon... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puffernutter Posted August 21, 2023 Author Share Posted August 21, 2023 That's a different set up to mine. The one I have is as per the picture above yours and the Defender manual. No retaining clips on the shoes, two springs and an expander and adjuster opposite each other. Thanks anyway. Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve b Posted August 21, 2023 Share Posted August 21, 2023 9 minutes ago, simonpelly said: Some pictures if it helps. Simon... Yes, this is 300 Tdi onward direct acting cable type - a worthwhile upgrade from the earlier linkage type imo Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retroanaconda Posted August 21, 2023 Share Posted August 21, 2023 Yes, the later type is a far better design. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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