Avon Rangemaster 6ply

[Allan Soffientini]

Hello everybody,

As this is my first post on this forum, so a bit of presentation: I'm the happy owner of a 1985 N/A Ninety for six years now, and I'm writing from Italy, near Milan.

I hope to find some help to source four new Avon Rangemaster 6 ply, as they seems to be no longer available! . I've called the italian trader of Avon tires and I've been told 8ply only are in production, the italian catalog shows that model only.

Anybody knows if 6ply are available in Uk, from a trader who can send them to Italy, I've sent a mail to Craddock, but 8ply only (at almost half the price i've been asked in Italy!)

Anyway are 8ply as good as 6; sourcing the Net, I've found 8ply are too heavy for the front axle and make the steering dire, and I've no PAS...

Help please!

PS I've been in Uk two times with my Landy, visiting Cornwall, Devon in 2006 and Sussex and Kent this year. Great times and great places, I think I'll come back in 2009, perhaps to Wales.

Thank You!

Allan

[tacr2man]

The 8 ply will not be noticeably different from the six ply, but will have a greater load carrying capacity, they will not affect your steering at all especially as you are fitting four . If the steering is too heavy then what tyre pressures are you running? Are your swivel hubs properly lubed etc. The contact area for a tyre size is not really affected by the ply rating of a tyre it is mostly down to tyre pressures. HTSH

[sotal]

Heavy tyres don't seem to make any difference my new tyres are approx 1.5x the weight of the tyres they replaced and the steering is no heavier, it feels exactly the same and they're 2" wider so the contact area is much larger.

I very much doubt you will notice any difference.

I don't have PAS, and it's on a 1970 series 2a, I can't see the point of power steering on a series/90 they're so easy to steer without it

[Eightpot]

I used to run Michelin XZY on my non-power assisted 90, and they are 12 ply!

mind you the stering was bloody awfull

I didn't notice any difference in the weight of the steering over the previous lighter tyres though - at speed it's irrelevant and when parking the tread pattern, compound of rubber and tyre pressure makes the biggest difference.

[Allan Soffientini]

I used to run Michelin XZY on my non-power assisted 90, and they are 12 ply!

mind you the stering was bloody awfull

I didn't notice any difference in the weight of the steering over the previous lighter tyres though - at speed it's irrelevant and when parking the tread pattern, compound of rubber and tyre pressure makes the biggest difference.

Thank you very much! So many answer in so little time! Great!

So I think I'll go for Avon Rangemaster 8ply. Finally four good tyres, afther years of second hands and remoulds! I hope they last as long as advertisements on the net promise!

Grazie

Allan

[BogMonster]

Any particular reason you want Rangemasters?

I just ask as they are IMHO a tyre that falls into the category of "jack of all trades master of none" i.e. they are not really that good off the road, and not really that good on it... there are newer and better options available.

[Allan Soffientini]

Any particular reason you want Rangemasters?

I just ask as they are IMHO a tyre that falls into the category of "jack of all trades master of none" i.e. they are not really that good off the road, and not really that good on it... there are newer and better options available.

Ehm... Excuse me, but what's IMHO?

Anyway I think that old crossply tires wuold be good for me as I use my Landy 60% on the road and 40% off, always on hard and rocky surfaces on alpine tracks. I've bought remould off road tires in the past, but the were very noisy on the road and the rocks ruined the tread fast; I supposed they are designed for soft mud.

I've never used crossply tires before, but think they are more robust than radial, with few punctures and last longer. Obviously if somebody has suggestions about better tyres I'm here and will be glad for any good advice!

Thanks

[Eightpot]

I was also going to ask why you would want to go with Avon rangemasters - there are much better tyres out there. I used to have them on a Range Rover and they were ok on road but not very good off road.

There is a long list of alternatives, but common 'upgrades' which should be easily available at good prices would be;

BF Goodrich AT

Cooper Discoverer ST

General Grabber AT2

Your Avons are probably 205x16? you could look at 7.50x16 or 235 85 16 which are a bit taller and will give you a bit more ground clearance.

[sotal]

Ehm... Excuse me, but what's IMHO?

In My Honest Opinion

[BogMonster]

Ehm... Excuse me, but what's IMHO?

Anyway I think that old crossply tires wuold be good for me as I use my Landy 60% on the road and 40% off, always on hard and rocky surfaces on alpine tracks. I've bought remould off road tires in the past, but the were very noisy on the road and the rocks ruined the tread fast; I supposed they are designed for soft mud.

I've never used crossply tires before, but think they are more robust than radial, with few punctures and last longer. Obviously if somebody has suggestions about better tyres I'm here and will be glad for any good advice!

Thanks

In My Humble Opinion

Avon Rangemaster 7.50R16 are radials not crossplies - only the older Avon Ranger 7.50x16 was a crossply. The radials use a "ply rating" (PR) either 6PR or 8PR but they are radial not crossply - hence 7.50R16 where the R means radial.

Eightpot's list would cover the possibilities that I would regard as better - if you have 7.50R16 fitted at the moment and want something a similar size then the nearest metric equivalent is 235/85R16. Be aware though, that most modern tyres are tubeless and if you have the original equipment steel rims then the tyres need to be fitted with a tube which then brings other problems with tubes chafing inside the carcasses of the tubeless tyres which are often much rougher internally than "tube type" tyres like the Avons.

[Allan Soffientini]

I was also going to ask why you would want to go with Avon rangemasters - there are much better tyres out there. I used to have them on a Range Rover and they were ok on road but not very good off road.

There is a long list of alternatives, but common 'upgrades' which should be easily available at good prices would be;

BF Goodrich AT

Cooper Discoverer ST

General Grabber AT2

Your Avons are probably 205x16? you could look at 7.50x16 or 235 85 16 which are a bit taller and will give you a bit more ground clearance.

Sadly, italian law forbids to fit tyres of sizes different from the original, on my Landy I can fit only 205-16 and 750-16 . I agree with you that 750 is better, but they are becaming increasingly hard to find as new, only remould ones are largely available.

Now, the only available here are:

michelin xcl

good year wrangler radial s/ar

fulda multitrac

avon rangemaster

I've seen General SAG radial on Paddock's website at a good price, but, since they are not available here i don't dare to order them without have seen them previously and knowing nothing about them.

Thank you again!

Allan

[BogMonster]

If you do want Rangemasters, Avon UK seem to think that both 6pr and 8pr are available

http://www.avon-tyres.co.uk/?page=tyres&am...ail3&tid=18

The radial General SAG's are very like a slightly more aggressive version of the Rangemaster and I think they might be tube type as well

[Allan Soffientini]

In My Honest Opinion

Thank you for the explanation!

[Allan Soffientini]

If you do want Rangemasters, Avon UK seem to think that both 6pr and 8pr are available

http://www.avon-tyres.co.uk/?page=tyres&am...ail3&tid=18

The radial General SAG's are very like a slightly more aggressive version of the Rangemaster and I think they might be tube type as well

Well... how many precious informations!

I really did not know Avon Rangemaster are radial . So they are not that old fashioned!

Since last year I had four steel wheel from a td5 whith tube and 750 remould mud tyre, Now roostyle with tubed 205, but i'm not satisfied of them as they are too small and the speedo reads false. Anyway, part from that, never had problem with both and very few punctures.

I'm planning to fit Avon (or other?) on td5 wheel with tube.

Ciao!

[Yostumpy]

Take a look at lro wbsite, 5x avons and wheels for sale £120 for 5, second hand but 10mm tread, so loads of life left.

[6cyltdi]

3x 7.50r16s on 10mm + tread with rims, free to a good home....???

[geoffbeaumont]

I'd agree with those who are questioning why you're going for Rangemasters - I have a set which I use on the Discovery (and previously on a Range Rover) for laning and off roading (I run smaller more road biased tyres for everyday driving). They're okay, but I only have them because I got a complete set virtually new on decent rims for £125, which was too good a deal to refuse. If you're paying list price there are better tyres for the money (last time I was buying tyres they were more expensive than BFG ATs, which are vastly better on the road, and I would think at least as good off road too.

On the plus side the Rangemasters are very hard wearing, and as Bogmonster says, they're a jack of all trades - but it's also true that they're master of none. They're a bit noisy and not especially grippy on the road (though not too bad), and decidedly interesting in the wet - probably not much better than a good mud tyre. Off road they're good on rock but clog up in mud.

If you can live with the wet weather road manners they might actually suit you as they work well on the sort of tracks you describe. One thought though - do you drive in snow? I have never driven on a tyre which has less grip in snow...

[BogMonster]

One thought though - do you drive in snow? I have never driven on a tyre which has less grip in snow...

I have - the crossply 7.50x16 Avon Rangers! There isn't much in it though... both are "quite scary"!

[Yostumpy]

Hmm! funny that,. I'm running Avon Rangemasters on my 110, most of the time. In NO way would I call them scary, Surefooted I would say, and as for NOISY!!!!!!!! well My MT's are noisy, when I put the avons on, its like driving a roller! Softer, quieter. I can even talk to swambo in that soft deep sexy voice that I have,

WAT!!!!!!!! speak up will you this bl##dy landrovres so bl##dy noisy I carn ear nofin'

nuffin dear!

[tacr2man]

There is no reason why you cant fit tubes into tubeless tyres, as long as you remove the labels and any trace of the glue they use to stick them in with (usually done with a buffer tool) for normal use. If you intend to drop them to very low pressures i.e. for sand work (land rover give emergency soft pressures for tube type tyres in their old handbooks) they can be more of a problem. You cannot fit them in tyres above HR speed rating without dropping the speed rating with insurance compliance problems . Tubeless tyres will run cooler, and therefore get better life mileage . Tubeless tyres are also better from a punc repair point of view. HTSH

[BogMonster]

Sorry but the rough ribs inside "some" tubeless tyre carcasses can and sometimes do cause problems, I know from experience that BFG MTs can have problems with this no doubt others might as well. You could clean up all the ribs as well but it would be a long job

[tacr2man]

never had a prob with BFG in particular, it may be quality of tube , as some cheap tubes sourced from Taiwan etc. are very poor quality. I always used tubes sourced from Goodyear, at wholesale the price can be upto 200% different.

[BogMonster]

The tube brand/quality helps for sure, but the ones we had issues with you could see the ribs on the tyre had chafed grooves into the tube and inevitably one of the grooves had gone through to the point of leaking.

[nicks90]

Sadly, italian law forbids to fit tyres of sizes different from the original, on my Landy I can fit only 205-16 and 750-16 . I agree with you that 750 is better, but they are becaming increasingly hard to find as new, only remould ones are largely available.

Thank you again!

Allan

cant comment on the particulars of any countries specific laws - but i do know that several other european countries forbid you from fitting non standard sized tyres.

HOWEVER - as long as the tyre you fit is a standard LR size option, then you can fit them. It doesnt have to be what was fitted to your model in the year it was made.

eg, you motor from 1985 would have been fitted with 205/16 or 7.50r16

But later landrovers were fitted with metric equivalents, 235/85/16 and 265/75/16 and therefore these should still be legal as they comply with all landrover specifications. The police or other inspectors would have to be very eagle eyed to spot 235/85/16 as different from 7.50/16 and as they are a standard LR fitment then you should be ok. Will also open up a much larger and nicer range in tyres too.

[sotal]

The police or other inspectors would have to be very eagle eyed to spot 235/85/16 as different from 7.50/16

Why? 7.50's are 190mm wide compared to 235/85/16's being 235mm wide, that's a difference of 45mm, you don't have to be eagle eyed to notice that - and the fact that it is plastered over the side of the tyre helps them too! They're also approx 10mm higher.

If they fitted 235/85/16's to exactly the same axle etc then it might be OK anyway (as you say it depends on local law) but as a metric equivalent they're not really that close. I guess really you would need a 190/100/16 tyre to be exact but I don't think that's made