tuko Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 A few short months ago I replaced the fuel lift pump on my 300Di motor with one that I bought on eBay. Steering away from anything mechanical from ****parts I found another alternative pump made by Delphi costing in the 24£ range before postage. The seller is one that lists in the popular LR magazines and wrote "Delphi Quality Pump" in their auction. Well after a grand total of a tank and a quarter, yes that's it a tank and a quarter then the flipping thing dies! Just doesn't die on the road or any wheres convenient but when I was offroading We tried everything yesterday to see if it was something else before convicting the lift pump. The fuel lines were clear, no carp in the tank after looking in and we removed/drained/inspected the fuel filter. There is no resistance at the lift pump even after hand pumping for several minutes. Even turning over the motor did little to no help with building up any resistance. The funny thing with this situation is that motor will run but there is no accelerator Push down on the pedal and nothing With the motor running we cracked the bleeder screw on the fuel filter housing and absolutely nothing came out of there, even after 5 minutes of the motor running. So I have two alternatives tomorrow, 1) buy a Land Rover original lift pump at the dealership 2) convert over to an electric fuel pump. If I consider the electric fuel pump, firstly has it been done on a 300tdi without any motoring issues? Secondly, should I buy a pusher or suck pump? I'm eying the inline pumps that Bosch make for Volvo cars. (small compact and should be easier to place next to the frame) Anyways I'm thoroughly peeved at these so called "quality parts" that are advertised for Land Rovers then don't last, no matter the name stamped on their sides. So what is the most reliable route that I should consider from this point forward. Electrical or original? Todd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BogMonster Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 I don't think even the genuine ones are that brilliant but they last longer than that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 I'm surprosed at a Delphi item failing, their stuff is usually good quality. Most of the parts I fit to Euroboxes is made by them. Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmy_neutron Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 Les, I went through a similar thing with my 200tdi which i know is different but in some ways the same if you know what i mean. I replaced the pump for cheap ones twice and they lasted a while. Then i replaced it again but this time i forgot to fit the black plastic spacer plate. It lasted about a tank full. Then i fitted a genuine from landrover and it cost loads but its lasted. So i'd say check to see if you too have changed your pump at 10 at night tanked full of ale and have also thrown away a vitally important thing like a packing plate and then fit the genuine pump. Electric fuel pump is a really bad plan as insurers will see it as a change in safety case. For example if you are in a head on collision lets say and your fuel line is severed then your I/P will drag in air and your engine will cut out causing the current fuel pump to stop pumping which is good. Then think of the same scenario with your electric pump. Cars with electric fuel pumps normally have some kind of fuel pump shut off shock sensor. Some are under the boot lip , some are beside the footwell, and more modern ones can be triggered by the clever airbag system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mo Murphy Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 Todd, the injector pump should suck enough to keep you going albeit with much reduced performance, are you sure it's the lift pump ? Mo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tuko Posted August 9, 2009 Author Share Posted August 9, 2009 Todd, the injector pump should suck enough to keep you going albeit with much reduced performance, are you sure it's the lift pump ?Mo Mo, The injector pump did exactly that. I thought that it was strange that it didn't fill the fuel filter all the ways when I had the bleeder screw open. I opened up the tank today the tank is crud free and the hoses are all new therefore I can't say that the hoses are old, cracked and drawing in air. No leaks either. The Land Rover mechanic and I both seem to think that it is the lift pump as we both tried unsuccessfully to pump fuel into the filter by using the handle on the pump. There was no resistance at all at the handle. If it was moving fuel we should have noticed the pressure and of course had fuel spilling out of the bleeder screw. Todd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landkeeper Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 Todd give it a direct feed to the inj pump from a gravity feed,see if its ok with that. if it'll run and drive with that in situ you know its down strem of the inj pump Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 Simple test of the lift pump is to remove the outlet pipe from it and then crank the engine. If fuel jets out, then it's working ok. Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn Posted August 9, 2009 Share Posted August 9, 2009 I'd consider an electric replacement. Something thats designed for low pressure draw-thru systems like a facet carb fuel pump would probably do the job just nicely. An EFI pump probably wouldnt like sucking the fuel out of the tank, as they're generally designed to be submersible or gravity fed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tuko Posted August 9, 2009 Author Share Posted August 9, 2009 Simple test of the lift pump is to remove the outlet pipe from it and then crank the engine. If fuel jets out, then it's working ok.Les. I'm not so keen on diesel pouring out all over the drive (if it actually does work), but I'll try to jerry something up so that I test the lift pump in the morning. The electrical pump I was looking at today is from a Volvo 740, which are under slung next to the frame rail of the 740's. So this type does "suck" from the tank further back. The only thing was that it has a banjo fitting on one end, not necessarily a simple plug and play install. Todd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tuko Posted August 9, 2009 Author Share Posted August 9, 2009 Todd give it a direct feed to the inj pump from a gravity feed,see if its ok with that. if it'll run and drive with that in situ you know its down strem of the inj pump I'll try this in the morning to. Thanks! Todd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 Take the oulet pipe off where it connects to the filter housing and stick the end in a bottle or something. No mess on your blingy drive then Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lara Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 Cheap = Buy quality "Once" Lara Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 tuko: if its underneath the car, its still likely being gravity fed from the tank? Most EFI pumps wont "pull" fuel uphill, as i found out trying to drain the tank of an old golf i was scrapping. Pump just whirred with a bit of hose on the inlet going down into the tank. ended up submerging the pump and that worked just fine. If you've got it laying about then i guess its worth giving it a try though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 300TDi lift pump is on the engine block and is purely mechanical. It's designed to pull fuel up from the tank. Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 Exactly, so if hes wanting an electric replacement, he'll need to find one designed to pull fuel up from the tank, a lot of pumps designed for carb engines will do this, alternatively you could install a pump submerged in the tank itself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tuko Posted August 10, 2009 Author Share Posted August 10, 2009 Exactly, so if hes wanting an electric replacement, he'll need to find one designed to pull fuel up from the tank, a lot of pumps designed for carb engines will do this, alternatively you could install a pump submerged in the tank itself. Believe me I'm considering all my options. You say that a pump designed for carb engine is sufficient for pulling from a tank, but does it provide the required pressure to the injector pump? I'm assuming that it would be low pressure to the injector pump, approx. .20~.45 bars. Todd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 i dont think the injector pump would need much pressure at all. A carb pump will usually deliver somewhere around 3-5psi which is likely to be more than enough. An EFI pump is capable of generating 5-6 bar usually, however the pressure it attains will depend on how much restriction the pump places on the fuel inlet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lars L Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 I think that an EFI pump will put up too much pressure. I had an electrical pump from Biltema a while, it did what it should for quite a while. It now has a new life in an 110 that has been converted back to its original V8 glory. Call me if you like... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tuko Posted August 10, 2009 Author Share Posted August 10, 2009 Now that the rain has stopped I've replaced the fuel filter with a genuine filter and as suggested I removed the out line from the lift pump and cranked the motor. A few moments of nothing then a spit of fuel then nothing....spit of fuel and nothing again......on and on. I could remove the line from the fuel filter housing completely, the spits were so small. Now it's if I want to buy a genuine lift pump or go electric. Lars, I'll drop you a line. Todd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rusty_wingnut Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 should you mix a pump design for petrol with diesel? IIRC the rubbers used in petrol pumps don't like diesel and melt in it's presence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 I didn't notice the electric pump question - sorry. Wouldn't the fuel supply be completely cut off if an electric pump was fitted, so you would be conked out at the side of the road? At least with a mechanical pump you can still drive the thing - you just need a reliable one Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tuko Posted August 10, 2009 Author Share Posted August 10, 2009 Yes I've decided to take the 'reliable, oh my wallet hurts' option. Should have the lift pump on Wed. Todd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 You could get a Britpart one overnight - just ask the guy to wait a few minutes, so he can take it back. Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tuko Posted August 10, 2009 Author Share Posted August 10, 2009 LOL Lars told me today that I could buy 2 from them for less than what I'm going to shell out for original. I could keep the spare in the vehicle for such emergencies. LOL He to was funny today. Todd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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