crash damaged Defender

[western]

I'd get other estimates as well, over 6 grand estimate for front end panel damage is way excessive, wonder where they're getting the parts prices from.

[dudley]

Here is a photo of the damage, how can they say total loss with no chassis or engine damage?

click the thumbnail to see full size pic.

[western]

Ouch. look to be all around that left front, even the bumper is still straight.

good used panels or new will sort that for a lot less than 6grand.

[dudley]

Ouch. look to be all around that left front, even the bumper is still straight.

good used panels or new will sort that for a lot less than 6grand.

Double Ouch, look at the back of the tanker, not only did our 90 trash the trucks crash fender it bent under the rear of the floor bed.

[landmannnn]

The worst thing is when I called our insurers "Hastings Direct" to let them know of the estimate cost and to start the total loss procedure, thinking I would then buy it back, I got a shock.

Too late for you dudley, but for everybody else do not shop around on price for car insurance. The reason that some of these insurance companies are cheap is that the cover and service is rubbish. If you google the insurance company mentioned and the word claim you will see some shocking stories. Try the same with direct line, nfu etc and you won't see anything like that.

Dudley, I reckon you can get what you want but it will take a lot of calls and letters. I have copied the half a dozen paragraphs below, I would suggest you reject what the insurance company has told you in writing and insist that they behave reasonably. Don't give up.

If you have a problem with your insurance policy, or an insurance claim, write to your insurer, giving details of your complaint, and how you would like it resolved. If you are not satisfied with your insurer's response, make a formal complaint, using their official complaints procedure. If you are still not satisfied with the outcome of the formal complaints procedure, consider taking the complaint further.

All insurers must be covered by the rules of the financial watchdog, the Financial Services Authority (FSA). This means that if you have a complaint about an insurer, you can take it to the Financial Ombudsman Service. This is a free service available to policyholders who have already followed their insurer's complaints procedure. The Financial Ombudsman Service will try to resolve the complaint through mediation. If the dispute cannot be resolved this way, the Financial Ombudsman Service will begin a formal investigation. The final decision given at the end of this investigation is binding on your insurer, but if you do not agree with it, you are free to take your insurer to court. For more information about the Financial Ombudsman Service, you can visit their website at (New window) www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk, or phone them on 0845 080 1800.

If your insurer is a member of Lloyds, you can make a complaint to the Policyholder and Market Assistance Department on 020 7327 5693. If you are not satisfied with the outcome of this complaint, you can then go on to complain to the Financial Ombudsman Service.

If you have tried all the options for resolving your complaint through the complaints procedures, but have not met with success, or if your insurer is based outside the UK, you may wish to consider taking legal action. However, you should only consider going to court as a last resort. This is because the amount of compensation a court may award you could be reduced if you have not tried other ways of resolving the problem before taking legal action.

For more information about alternatives to taking court action in England and Wales, see Alternative dispute resolution in Consumer fact sheets. In Scotland, see Alternative Dispute Resolution in Consumer fact sheets.

If you would like help in dealing with a complaint against an insurer, you should consult an experienced adviser, for example, at a Citizens Advice Bureau. To search for details of your nearest CAB, including those that can give advice by email, click on (New window) nearest CAB.

[western]

Double Ouch, look at the back of the tanker, not only did our 90 trash the trucks crash fender it bent under the rear of the floor bed.

maybe they've including the tankers damage in to your repair estimate but hope not

[white90]

Go to Main dealer for repair estimate if you want to keep it

I think I'd prefer to get a good settlement.

Chassis could be damaged where that A bar has pushed back

£6200 is Mad but there could be more than is apparent when you pull it apart.

[western]

making the 90 photo much bigger, the A Bar has pulled the bumper bolts & bent them at the chassis end & the forward bolts through the bumper, maybe the estimate is probably including a new chassis cost, but it could be repaired if the front section of that side member is straight.

on the right hand side the grille surround has pulled away from the wing too,

[dudley]

making the 90 photo much bigger, the A Bar has pulled the bumper bolts & bent them at the chassis end & the forward bolts through the bumper, maybe the estimate is probably including a new chassis cost, but it could be repaired if the front section of that side member is straight.

on the right hand side the grille surround has pulled away from the wing too,

The chassis was looked at very closely and is straight and sound, but there is a tiny ripple or dent at the chassis end, on the top, where A bar bracket has bent back and down onto the chassis end. But the engineer said it was not significant. Definately no new chassis on the estimate.

Yes the grill surround is to be replaced, they cost those parts at, grille frame £104 and grille back £130.50

[western]

good that the chassis isn't damaged, keep on the case & best wishes for a succesful result in your favour, for some reason, there doesn't seem to be many S reg 90/110 on the road.

[landrover598]

they cost those parts at, grille frame £104 and grille back £130.50

Or £20 off ebay One of the great things about landies is you can repair them so cheaply.

[dudley]

Yes they are rare, thats what is worrying me, especially with air con and under 50k miles. When I was looking to buy a few months back I could not understand why I could buy a 2001 or 2002 TD5 for less than a 1999 TDi, but a dealer told me the last of the Tdi's are really sought after for export because they can be serviced and maintained anywhere unlike the TD5 which pushes the price up. But you will know all that.

Anyway thanks for your help Western.

Regards Steve.

[GBMUD]

Remember that in any case, total loss or not, the 90 is still your property until the insurance has made you an offer which you choose to accept. Once the car is out of your hands though, you may never see it again, whatever the rights and wrongs.

Chris

[nicks90]

i had a simillar problem to what gbmud says,

our beetle had an engine fire and the recovery company took it to a salvage yard. an asessor went out and he said it was a write off and we requested that we wanted it back. I had a spare rebuilt engine and was happy to have a go at repainting the back end. Plus we wanted all our personal possessions from it (caught fire in middle of manchester, so had no choice about immediate recovery and wife left everything in it).

So after about 2 weeks of millions of phone calls i finally got the address of the salvage yard off the insurers, initially they refused to give me the address saying the car was now theirs! it wasnt until i pointed out that until i get a cheque off them that the car is owned by me. When i got there i found my beloved beetle in about 50 bits. Basically the body had been fully stripped. Stereo and speakers gone, bag with spare clothes gone, fluffy dice gone all other nicknacks gone.

So i kicked off at the salvage yard and was basically told to F off and got evicted.

I ended up calling the police for theft and the insurers got completed butt-raped into paying out quite an extortionate amount of money to us for personal possessions and for the vehicle - as they had actually signed the vehicle over to the salvage company without our permission. They had just 'presumed' we wanted the payout and not wanted it back.

NEVER let a motor out of your sight if its involved in an accident. Or if it does get moved - make sure its taken to a garage you know and not left to the insurers to sort out.

[SteveG]

Here is a photo of the damage, how can they say total loss with no chassis or engine damage?

click the thumbnail to see full size pic.

Looking at pic, and assuming from your initial post that OS front wing is ok then you'll need the following..

N/S front wing and inner wing - Very good secondhand complete wing with inner wing and spat will be ~£200

Bonnet - Very good later style bonnet secondhand ~£150

Grille surround and slam panel - Good secondhand ~£60

Plastic Grille - new £20

Plastic front panel new ~£15

Bumper new ~£35

Broken lights, stickers etc £30

Painting new panels ~£650

Day for independent LR garage to strip and fit new panels ~£400

So about ~£1560

I would take it to a good local independent LR garage and get them to quote. If it's not feasible to take it to them take lots of good pics and e-mail for a good quote.

Cheers

Steve

[dudley]

Looking at pic, and assuming from your initial post that OS front wing is ok then you'll need the following..

N/S front wing and inner wing - Very good secondhand complete wing with inner wing and spat will be ~£200

Bonnet - Very good later style bonnet secondhand ~£150

Grille surround and slam panel - Good secondhand ~£60

Plastic Grille - new £20

Plastic front panel new ~£15

Bumper new ~£35

Broken lights, stickers etc £30

Painting new panels ~£650

Day for independent LR garage to strip and fit new panels ~£400

So about ~£1560

I would take it to a good local independent LR garage and get them to quote. If it's not feasible to take it to them take lots of good pics and e-mail for a good quote.

Cheers

Steve

Thanks Steve,

Thats exactly our plan. I have called the insurers again this morning to find out who their salvage company is, so I could contact them directly before I agree to the salvage option, just to find out what sort of people they are. But no way would the insurers pass on that info, it was "No we wont know who they are until they instruct them. I got the, same old, same old carp about the salvage arrangement with them not letting me keep it , but they did say they MAY consider paying for it to be repaired if I can get repair quotes below 60% of their out market value. (how nice of them?) But they will not indicate what their idea of its market value would be.

I have a local mechanic who will give me an estimate for the repair at whatever amount I ask him for. He is happy to do that even with me doing the work. If the insurers go for it I hope they will write the cheque out to me.

Obviuosly I want as much out of the insurers as possible, after all a total loss payout to me must be around £7000. So I am thinking of hitting them for £2800. I know I wont get much, if any, change after buying parts, labour and metalic spraying but at least we keep the landie.

Thanks for your tips on the parts,

Regards Steve Matthews.

[white90]

I'd stop dealing with the front office staff

ask for complaints if you get no joy contact the obudsman and make the initial enquires

also CAB to get your rights.

once armed with facts you are better placed to tackle them.

Bottom line it is your car, you should be able to decide on what is done to it.

get more estimates and present them with facts.

as a £3k payout would seem better for them than a total loss payout.

[western]

I'd stop dealing with the front office staff

ask for complaints if you get no joy contact the obudsman and make the initial enquires

also CAB to get your rights.

once armed with facts you are better placed to tackle them.

Bottom line it is your car, you should be able to decide on what is done to it.

get more estimates and present them with facts.

as a £3k payout would seem better for them than a total loss payout.

I'd go with the above too

[dudley]

I have taken your advice and am waiting on a replies to my letter/letters to the insurers but have decided not to wait as I have decided to repiar the 90 myself anyway. I will get money out of the insurers at sometime in the future but I shall progress with repairs in the meantime.

I am buying parts, good old eBay and 4x4 salvage. 2nd hand wings, bonnet, bumper and grille etc are now already sitting on my workshop floor waiting to be painted. But I also have to remove the radiator, air con rad and intercooler to do the job and I am not 100% sure if they are damaged until I get them off, but they look ok except top hoses. So my question is, while I am at it should I replace all the hoses for silicone? Oh, I am sorry as I am sure this would have been asked before but I cannot find a thread in a search.

Thanks Steve.

[landroversforever]

hope this gets sorted out!

[Marks 110]

hope this gets sorted out!

Had almost identical damage to my 110 after a mate crashed it. Insurance decided it was write off and finally paid out after I refused the first offer, got an extra 500 quid although it was still quite low. I then bought the vehicle back off them for 650 quid and repaired it myself ending up about a grand better off.(took about a day and a half)

My radiator and intercooler were damaged quite badly damaged but a local radiator specialist recored the radiator and mended the intercooler for about £75. I used a company in Leeds called PRB for 2nd hand parts IIRC got everything I needed some bits were virtually brand new anyway. Spraying for bumper and wing was about £150-200.

Found the assessors and engineers to be absolutely clueless and seemed to speak to the insurance company every day for about 5 weeks (didn't help that the landy was in france) but got it sorted in the end.

good luck

mark

[nickt]

I hope everything is sorted out for you chap I have been in a similar situation myself with my girlfriends car even before the car was taken from the assessors to the salvage yard I had been told because she was third party only the car stayed my problem as they didnt pay to scrap the car, saying it would be my bill obviously i asked for the return of the car when they delivered it i found it had been to a salvage yard where they started stripping the car. I complained and got more money to replace the missing parts but as someone has said if you dont want to loose your car or anything in it or on it dont let them take it.

[Giles tout terrain]

Whereabouts in kent are you? at £6200 it sound slike you got your estimate either done at Stocks garage in canterbury or A B crush panel craft! knowing both of these places i wouldn't trust them to repair a toy car let alone my pride and joy!

if you need any paintwork doing i run my own place nr canterbury just send a pm

best of luck with the thieving insurers!

Rob

[dudley]

Whereabouts in kent are you? at £6200 it sound slike you got your estimate either done at Stocks garage in canterbury or A B crush panel craft! knowing both of these places i wouldn't trust them to repair a toy car let alone my pride and joy!

if you need any paintwork doing i run my own place nr canterbury just send a pm

best of luck with the thieving insurers!

Rob

Hi Rob, We are in Smarden but it is getting sorted now thanks. The quote was from Ashford Accident out by Jnt10 M20.

But M C motors are spraying the panels for me now, thats all parts of both wings, grill surround, bonnet, and two wheel spats, for £500. Oh and it is metalic Rioja Red as well so I am pleased with paying £500. In fact they called today to say I can pick up tomorrow. Wont be able to as were off to the LRO international show in Peterborough , so have to be Monday. I will do post to uptate all on the progress.

Thanks for thinking about helping out, Steve.

[dudley]

I hope everything is sorted out for you chap I have been in a similar situation myself with my girlfriends car even before the car was taken from the assessors to the salvage yard I had been told because she was third party only the car stayed my problem as they didnt pay to scrap the car, saying it would be my bill obviously i asked for the return of the car when they delivered it i found it had been to a salvage yard where they started stripping the car. I complained and got more money to replace the missing parts but as someone has said if you dont want to loose your car or anything in it or on it dont let them take it.

Hi. Well, it is not sorted out as far as the insurers are concerned. After being told they wanted to total loss it, and then getting a quote for 6.3K to repair it by an insurance approved repairer I took the bull by the horns and started the work myself. I didnt send in the 6.3K quote to the insurers, I just called them and they said if I could get 2 quotes of less than 60% of market value they would pay for repair, and does not have to be insurance approved either. So a local mechanic is rustling me up two quotes for around 3200 and 3400 which should be well under 60%, not yet got the quotes mind!!! So I have gambled a bit by starting the work.

I have been on a couple of eBay road trips buying parts. Wings including lights, Grill, Bumper from Wales for £250. Bonnet from the Midlands on our way back for £51. Intercooler via post for £25.

Still have to get a radiator and maybe air con rad, but that may still be ok. When I get it all back together we shall see if the aircon is still ok. I have left that connected.

So with £500 for the paint job, it looks to be costing me about £1000 if I dont have to do the Air con rad.

It is all stripped now and while I have been waiting for the painting to be done I have been treating the chassis. I thought my 1999 TDi was a gem, it is I suppose, but it is surprising what two thorough jet washes and a de-grease to the underneath will uncover. From rear cross member forward all looks great, just very light surface rust on parts of chassis, with some Hammerite kills rust and then hammerite paint it looks great. But with the mud washed out the back box section of rear cross member its, oops , looks like a replacement is in order in the near future.

Now the chassis is all painted I shall Waxoyl it. There is not a spot of rust on the bulkhead and with the wings off it will be easy to Waxoyl it well. The back door metal frame is looking sad. I have discovered a design fault with that. The water has been getting in through the spare wheel fixing bracket where the bolt holes are, I can see water stain runs running down inside of the ali door panel which has rusted the frame below. Also water has been getting in via the handle recess, which has rusted out the bottom corner.

I have been taking pics and will post them asap.