Boothy Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Well just about to attempt an hill climb in front of an ethusiastic crowd at a recent play day, pre-checklist included engage both front and rear ARB's, Ashcroft shaft's front and rear at the ready, Ashcroft C/V's waiting to work, Megasquirted V8 burbling sweetly, harness adjusted, just one thing left to do and that is to move the auto shifter to D for drive, WTF was that bang?, followed by an horrific crunching of metal on metal, it was as I found out later that evening every single tooth on the crown wheel being shredded off, a very traumatic and catastrophic failure of a Land Rover diff and I still don't know why,perhaps poor adjustment by owner of bearing and pre-loads etc, we will never know now, thank god. Take a look................ h So following disturbing discovery it was a quick phone to Ashcroft for one of their superb uprated and strenghened crown wheel and pinion and another phone call to Mr Barker AKA as the Hybrid from Hell to try his diff pegging service. To those of you who do not know what "pegging" is, it is to fit a phospher bronze pad (located on two adjustable bolts) against the back side of the crown wheel and adjust it up so that it is just rubbing and no more, this pad will stop any flexing of the crown wheel and stop it from moving away from the pinion gear for a moment or two which is probably what happend to mine. They are common place on comp safari motors where the diff can be subjected to massive shock loads on taking off and landing or lifting wheels with lots of power on, and then "hey ho" bang another diff gone. That type of failure rarely occurs when a diff has been "pegged" and is another common failure point hopefully put to bed. It will be neccessary every now and then to adjust the bolts up to touch and then just back of a flat or two to ensure that close contact is still achieved. So with photo's supplied via Nige a bit of a casebook as they say, I hope you find them interesting. First job shot blast and chemically clean the casing and bearing caps ready for work, pretty good eh? Another view Now to lay out all the new bits prior to maching and welding the strengening plate in which will supoort the bolts that hold the pad, you notice on the Ashcroft crown wheel and pinion a different tooth count but I have I kept to the standard ratio which I was happy with, this re-angled gear grinding ensures a larger contact area than the standard gears but at the sacrifice of a bit more gear noise, which is totally un-noticable (hell we're not driving Jags around) so no worries there. Now for some maching, here goes Nige........watch the fingers or there will be another injuries post flying up "doh look what I've done today" Oopps another Cobalt drill bit broke, more plasters Nige??? clumsy boy....... OK now we can see the newly finished paint job and the phospher pad and holding arrangement welded in prior to fitting. This block takes a serious ammount of welding in because of the high strength required. For those of you in the know you will notice we've introduced the later TD5 bearing caps for a bit of added strength. For those of you really in the know the diff casing and "pegging" was done by Mr Barker and the diff rebuild and set up was done to a superb standard by ex-Kam man Steve. So there's Boothy's bombproof rear diff ready for action and hopefully years of hard challenges to come. There was a photo of it fitted to my recently refurbished bright yellow axle casing complete with a new Glynn Lewis DIY bombproof diff pan but the bright yellow I painted it may cause upset to certain viewers so I omitted it on health grounds. Basically it was so bright you could hardly see it, I'm hoping a few muddy days out might tone it down a bit. So many thanks to Nige and Steve for a superb job that I'm really chuffed with. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Excellent Chuffed with my 4 pin front from Nige, and my rear diff (ARB) is off for the Nige rebuild and pegging experience Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manxey Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Excellent Chuffed with my 4 pin front from Nige, and my rear diff (ARB) is off for the Nige rebuild and pegging experience Same, never had a problem after Nige did mine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zim Posted October 18, 2011 Share Posted October 18, 2011 Chris, Just be careful that you haven't bent or broken the flange on your ARB. I bent mine and i remember gunnit saying that he broke his when stripping r+p's. I went pegged after this G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boothy Posted October 18, 2011 Author Share Posted October 18, 2011 Ey up G Yep cheers mate, that was one of the main reasons I wanted somebody who knew how to build diffs properly and check things and Steve has a great reputation, I've built them in them in the past but it really is guess work and hope for the best. So that one had all new bearings and a new pinion flange / seal so common sense ruled my wallet and it's proper. Tell you what, Nige need his patio set oiling and not with EP90?, I always thought semi-retirement led to that sort of pastime........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Off Road Toad Posted October 18, 2011 Share Posted October 18, 2011 Oh stop it, i'm getting embarrased now I am genuinely pleased that you (and our other customers too) are happy with the results. Thankyou Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted October 18, 2011 Share Posted October 18, 2011 You aren't allowed to be on holiday though Steve, this means I miss out on watching Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landybehr Posted October 18, 2011 Share Posted October 18, 2011 wish I had done that modification to my diffs. Too late now, I wouldn´t tear it out again until anything fails. Is it typical for a crown wheel to have the teeth damaged all around, and .. only on the inner circumference ? First impression was that there must have been really bad adjustment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Off Road Toad Posted October 18, 2011 Share Posted October 18, 2011 In Boothy's case there was some SERIOUS mal-adjustment going on In all seriousness though it was a combination of tired bearings, contamination and poor pinion to crown wheel mesh generally. All this combined with some loose bolts and hey presto your teeth have fallen out Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonr Posted October 18, 2011 Share Posted October 18, 2011 Something I've wondered about - but not tried is..... Instead of modifying the diff casing, could you make up a washer which bolts behind the crownwheel with counterbored bolts and use shims to set it so it just rubs on the diff casing? this is the kind of thing that would be an easy DIY fit as it would not require any modification of the casing? it might take a bit more effort to set it just right - but well within the capability of anyone with a feeler gauge. Supply the kit with a load of shims and you get a refund on those you don't use? If you used countersunk bolts, you could make most of it from steel with just a thin phosphor washer to rub on the casing? Just a thought. Si Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daan Posted October 19, 2011 Share Posted October 19, 2011 I did see the TD5 bearing caps being used, wasn't aware of this mod. I also wondered whether this is fitted to an earlier casing, because I thought the bearingcaps are always machined with the diff casing and therefore unique to that diff casing? Daan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted October 19, 2011 Share Posted October 19, 2011 Few answers - starting with daans We always use an "Exchange case" Mr Boothy wnated " 'unt phooking strongun t' lad" so we decided his woukld be a later type Casing with the flats Yes, all caps are machined to casings, so he had a "Casing Upgrade" as the dreadfull 4mm thick of yellow painted "Thing" complete mit loads of broken bits was an earlier type - and scrap it turned out after I tried to get it in the Jig, casing had twisted !" NEVER EVER mix caps up, even LH to RH on the same casing Re the build, Steve is pedantic on building, he had Boothys ARB into bits to check everything, there are a number of things to check, as Zim says flange warp and ovality of the bolt holes where is goes to the CW and also bolts to CWP (his all binned as stretched etc) new ones fitted, and also cage in ARB can be cracked and broken but still work, thus Steve stripped the ARB to its component parts, cleans checks and then puts back together with (silly price) new ARB seals etc We both work on the basis if something needs changing.... then change it ....and it has to be either decent quality (ie bearing Timken seal genuine etc) and if it really doesn't need changing then we don't, .... The acid test is "Would either of us be happy with in in OUR trucks" (and we are both fussy ) In Boothys case it was hugely FUBAR'd so just about everything was replaced and bit inside the ARB too, Steve and I have so far done 51 Pegged diffs* , and had <gulp> zero failures so far, even those running standard CW&P, nothing is unbreakable (I'll prove that ) but a properly rebulit pegged LR diff offers massive strength over standard and protects the investment of lockers as when CW&Ps let go there is a wide selection of hardened broken bits just wiating to drop into the Shafts / locker / and blow them up too Been there done that, got the T shirt Nige * Even more impressive when you consider by the nature of the driver a pegged diff is bought by "The Ruffarseendofthegenepool" clients like V8Jon, McS Junior, to name and shame 2 oh and boothy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boothy Posted October 19, 2011 Author Share Posted October 19, 2011 Thanks Nige I've just been under the motor to do a few checks before this weekends Clubman challenge at Mow Cop (3 fields away from home) and have take a few pickys of said diff in place and a couple of the back end showing the Glyn Lewis "ard as nails" diff pan. Those astute members of you may notice some nuts we have welded along the tube to secure the brake pipes to, gives them a bit of chance when deep in the "Terra Firma", that's sh**e to you southerner's. Please excuse the poor wash down last weekend, it was only a "dip and go" before Mow Cop..... You can clearly see the 2 adjusting nuts on the fitted casing on the first photo... Told yer that axle was bright, it didn't look like that on the lid..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted October 19, 2011 Share Posted October 19, 2011 me retinas me retinas I'm blind I tell ya Blue Black Orange Red and Yellow its like a oil painting artist has had a big crash and his pallette spilled out everywhere big timey Those pics should come with a F H&S warning Cold water bathe me eyes............. the feeling will come back................................................... Just maybe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zim Posted October 20, 2011 Share Posted October 20, 2011 Looking good chris Try not to break anything - your mobile stores dept won't be there If i use a caphead somewhere that is going to get full of mud, i fill the end with silicone - so that when it comes to having to put an allen key in it you just pop out the silicone and everything is nice n clean G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.