western Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 I think it's Karsons the website is http://www.miku.com/prod2.htm never had dealings or heard of them before today, new stub sounds like it's been machined to the top end of the tolerance measurements & bearings are near the nominal/standard size, reckon you'll be sending that stub axle back for exchange to a genuine item. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eds Posted December 7, 2011 Author Share Posted December 7, 2011 Yes sorry that is Karsons............. What a waste of time and effort............. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eds Posted December 7, 2011 Author Share Posted December 7, 2011 No wonder it is made in India Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 My new stub axles needed a light sand with some strips of emery. they are still nice and snug in the bearings . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 I've used Karson bearings many times before and they are normally absolutely fine, in fact my RRC is running on them at the moment, and has been for a couple of years with no problems. The bearings do need to go on very square.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eds Posted December 7, 2011 Author Share Posted December 7, 2011 Well I have measured them both Timken bearing ID = 45.00 Karsons stub axle OD = 45.35 Am I really supposed to fettle the shaft with sand paper Or is this wrong? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 I've had to punt a hub assembly back on with a soft mallet before because the bearings/stub was a very close fit. Don't beat the carp out of it though. Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 .35 is too much to sand off. I suggest you take it back. Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eds Posted December 7, 2011 Author Share Posted December 7, 2011 The bearings won't go on at all, not a bit Should I sand them. 0.35mm does not sound much Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eds Posted December 7, 2011 Author Share Posted December 7, 2011 You beat me to it Les! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eds Posted December 7, 2011 Author Share Posted December 7, 2011 NEW NEWS I thought to see how easily my new Timken bearings slid onto my old stub axle. Guess what...... They would not fit. My old stub axle measures 45.20 and it is worn in................... Could these Timken bearings be duff? Does anyone have something to measure to help? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Might sound silly, but you are measuring straight across the inside of the bearing? I know how easy it is to measure off centre. I have to have mine dead square to get the bearings on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eds Posted December 7, 2011 Author Share Posted December 7, 2011 UPDATE I tried my old discarded Timken bearings on the new Karsons stub axle and they slid on perfectly. What does it all mean I thought Timken bearings are never wrong............. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eds Posted December 7, 2011 Author Share Posted December 7, 2011 I don't know what is going on anymore........... The discarded bearings and new bearings show same ID = 45.20mm Discarded bearings fit both old and new axle. New bearings don't fit either old or new axle Old and new axle show same OD = 45.20mm This is crazy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Are the new bearings dry? try a light smear of grease round the inside before you try sliding them on, and make sure they are 100% square. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eds Posted December 7, 2011 Author Share Posted December 7, 2011 They are well greased. I am going stupid crazy so am going to leave it until tomorrow now as my head hurts. It all makes no sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted December 7, 2011 Share Posted December 7, 2011 Have you checked for any burrs on stub axle? where it goes from the thread to the bearing bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eds Posted December 7, 2011 Author Share Posted December 7, 2011 I'll have a good look tomorrow I think I am going to hit it quite hard and see if I can get it on that way! I'll try a wooden mallet first and build up to a lump hammer. I am thinking the cold weather is making it worse. I am becoming intolerant of these fine tolerances :-) If it won't go on tomorrow I am going to cry! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eds Posted December 8, 2011 Author Share Posted December 8, 2011 I bashed the hub with a lump hammer and the inner bearing went on. I then tapped the outer bearing with a hammer and punch and it also went on. I have bruised the hub a little where the drive flange seats. I then did the hub nut up as tight as it would go and I can not get the bearing to bind. It does spin nicely with no play I can twiddle with one finger and some effort. Not free wheeling. As the bearings were so tight there is no way I can get any hub end float. Should I just do the hub nut up as tight as I can and then back off a bit. When I back off a bit it does nothing to the hub running more easily. When people describe binding of the bearings does it become impossible to turn the hub? I can't understand how tight to do these nuts. Any help would be appreciated Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 Normally I would expect doing up the first hub nut to eventually get the hub very stiff to turn, this is then when I would back it off slightly. I think the tightness you are having is the fact the bearings area tight fit on the stub axle. Backing off isn't going to do anything until you have tightened it to get the binding I describe above. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PS_Bond Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 For the 300TDi, tighten to 37lb ft (should still rotate with no play in the bearing), back off 90 degrees, tighten to 7lb ft. Then fit the lock washer, then the 2nd nut & tighten to 37lb ft. After that you can test end play on the drive shaft with a DTI if you have one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 I don't think it is a good idea to go by the torque figures in this instance due to the tightness of the bearings on the Stub axle. When you tighten up the bearings, try grasping the disc top and bottom and see if you can feel any movement; this is what you want to remove. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eds Posted December 8, 2011 Author Share Posted December 8, 2011 There is certainly no play in any direction. If I do the hub nut up as tight as possible the wheel does not bind as such. I can turn it with two fingers. When you say bind I assume you mean it will no longer turn. Should I put more pressure on the hub nut or be satisfied with quite tight and let it be? How would I know if it was too tight? Does too tight mean no turning wheel? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
landroversforever Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 hmm... hard one to judge without feeling it... when I say bind I'm meaning its getting obviously hard to turn. Too tight is going to either mean wheel can't turn or just some very hot bearings as they will have a larger than normal load. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted December 8, 2011 Share Posted December 8, 2011 I agree with landroversforever - tighten the inner nut and turn the brake disc until you feel increased reisitance, then back off a little until the disc turns freely with some resistance. It's worth mentioning that the bearing inner track doesn't turn anyway - only the bearings and the outer track/hub does. Inner bearing tracks are always a very close/tight/interference fit on a stub axle or similar. Ed - when you fitted the hub inner oil seal, did you drift it so that the raised lip is level with the hub itself? Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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