Landy-Novice Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 hello all. my wallet has been putting this off for a while, but it as to be sorted, 18months ago i fitted some para' and pro comp shocks after reading the give an awesome ride and good travel. BS! its awful! here are a few photos of the rears? max out and in: its no where near the bump stop and the shock isn't limiting the travel (i remove and nothing happened) so could it be the prop? at the highest point on the wheel arch is 36-37 inches, does that sound about right or too high? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landy-Novice Posted February 29, 2012 Author Share Posted February 29, 2012 i seen many photos of the shackles at far different angles to mine? like this one from here and theirs mine (front and rear) see what i mean, theirs a huge difference? (please admire my home made mud flaps! ) then theirs the ride comfort, or in this case lack of it! at the moment, i have pro comps es3000 which i now know are not the best but i just went by the reviews! so what are cheap! shocks that will help the ride? do my pro comps have a resale value? some have over spray on them (bronze green, FOC ) which have only done around 30 miles? and the final issue, when i fitted to springs i realized the the chassis bushes are stuffed (as in me with a 3FT bar could only just move them) but being me i denied the fact there stuffed! so how can i remove them, buy a 18ish mm reduced shank drill bit and drill them out? is there a place where i could but individual poly bushes, i don't want to have to fork out for the whole set. please discuss. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Often people find 3-leaf paras on the back of an 88 too hard, what is the body o nit? Truck cab, CSW, hard top? Also, is that a home made spring mount on the rear? To me that doesn't look right, 88's have the mount underneath the chassis, is this a much modified motor or...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landy-Novice Posted February 29, 2012 Author Share Posted February 29, 2012 it has 2 and 1 supporting? can i remove it? never thought of that, its a soft top so there no weight on the back... simple now you pointed that out, and the spring mounts are standard (new cross member.). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 The link to TerriAnn Wakeman's website shows her modified 109 so none of the pictures are of any use as a reference for your standard 88. Reading the text about how to chose suspension might help though Several possible reasons for your issues: - Quality / stiffness of parabolics can vary by manufacturer - Number of leaves / load makes a difference - Likewise, trying to max the flex whilst unladen is not a good test, put a ton of bricks in the back and see if you reach the bump-stops. Flexibility is the enemy of load carrying and handling, if you want flex then run 1-leaf but be prepared to hit the bumpstops if you keep a pasty in the glovebox. - Shocks make a big difference to ride, procomps are good value but not exactly rolls-royce. - What bushes are you using? - A set of cheap paras & procomps will improve on std. leaves somewhat but it's never going to ride like a 2-ton range Rover with rubber-mounted body and a quarter of a ton of carpet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluespanner Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 It always makes me smile when people say their vehicle is light on the back as its a truck cab or whatever. Whatever the body is, hard top, soft top, truck cab etc there is never going to be enough difference to alter how the suspension works. I mean, you can lift a hard top with sides on your own can't you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 It's normally recommended to have 2 leaves for soft top vehicles, 3 for hard working truck cabs/lots of towing for example, 4 is really for 109s only. But as said above you do get a good variance between manufacturers, and shocks too, you may find cheaper ones with less damping suit your needs better, but it could all get rather expensive if you keep having to swap them out... You can get polybushes for the chassis separately, just took some googling... I replaced mine recently with these: http://www.island-4x4.co.uk/polyurethane-bush-black-britpart-569746py-p-6318.html I know it's sh!tpart, but what's better, a bush that waggles about in the hole now, or one that might waggle in a couple of years or so -it's on a low mileage truck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landy-Novice Posted February 29, 2012 Author Share Posted February 29, 2012 so ill remove the assisting leaf to see if that makes an improvement. bluespanner, there is a difference between a bit of rag and an aluminum roof with a heavy door. may not be much, but its a start. what about them gas shocks? i couldn't find any but would that make a difference? and the spring bushes are std rubber ones, does it make a diffence? cheers bowie, thats perfect! mine don't rattle, the bolt is seize solid! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 Mine were too, just order new shackles and pins at the same time.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToyRoverlander Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 mine don't rattle, the bolt is seize solid! That could be part of the problem too. If the bolt is seized solid to the inner sleeve, the rubber still being fine, and you having to use a 3ft crowbar to be able to fit the springs to the shackles, all that tension is resisting the springs wanting to compress and swing the shackle backwards. Doesn't help. Removing a leaf from the rear packs will work too. That's 33% less spring rate then. When I removed the 4door stationwagon upper body and fitted a softtop the back end came up about 2", there's a LOT difference in weight. But mine's a 109, not an 88. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian_s Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 how many miles have you actually done on the parabolics? i've put something in the region of 30k on mine and i now feel like they are starting to be a bit too soft. if you do take the 3rd leaf off, keep it in case you want to put it back after you've done more miles. replacing the bushes in the chassis will also help. i'm assuming you tried to get the bolt out but couldnt undo it as it's seized. to get them out you will probably need to get a hacksaw and cut between the shackle and the chassis, once thats off you can then start to drill out the rubber in the bush with small drill bits. once you've got as much rubber as possible out you then put a long bar on the nut of the other end of the bolt and try to turn it, this should rip any remaining rubber apart and allow you to pull the inner sleeve out. then feed a hacksaw blade through the hole, and carefull cut through the outer sleeve in several places, and knock them out with a chisel. then press the new bushes in. alternatively at the rear, buy 2 new rear spring hangers, cut the old ones off the chassis and weld new ones on. as for the dampers, if you arent getting a lot of flex, then the dampers will have little overall effect on the ride, before you spend any money on replacing them get the bushes sorted and the extra leaf removed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 Seized up bits are NOT going to help you. A 109 CSW roof with windows etc. is heavier than a rag top, but a standard panel-side roof alongside canvas & sticks there's not a hell of a lot in it. Get a fat mate to sit in the back for a spin round the block, see if that makes it better Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 Yep, a couple of sacks of cement help my lightweight loads in the comfort department. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickeyw Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 A 109 CSW roof with windows etc. is heavier than a rag top, but a standard panel-side roof alongside canvas & sticks there's not a hell of a lot in it. Have to agree here, even with an 88" it there is a noticable change in ride. I used to fit the safari (sliding windows) roof in winter and rag top in summer. I started with 3 leaf rears and ended up removing the 3rd leaf. Get a fat mate to sit in the back for a spin round the block, see if that makes it better Even putting the spare wheel in the back, especially on the rear door will also change the ride. But before you go making it more bouncy, have a think about how laden you might need to be from time to time. By the time you have 4 mates in the back you might end up regretting something. Also towing a big trailer with soft suspension can be horrendous, although I doubt you have your trailer test yet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landy-Novice Posted March 1, 2012 Author Share Posted March 1, 2012 Get a fat mate to sit in the back for a spin round the block, see if that makes it better how? throw a dougnut in the back and shut the tailgate quickly?? i have tried a few bags of sand (60-80ish kilo and althow it kept its ass in its trouser, i teeth kept falling out! Also towing a big trailer with soft suspension can be horrendous, although I doubt you have your trailer test yet YET! give it time its already have a few trailers behind it like a 2 tonne IFW flatbed and a 23ft caravan and it felt quite 'suttle' then. so i don't know what to do? replacing the bushes in the chassis will also help. I'm assuming you tried to get the bolt out but couldn't undo it as it's seized. to get them out you will probably need to get a hacksaw and cut between the shackle and the chassis, once that's off you can then start to drill out the rubber in the bush with small drill bits. once you've got as much rubber as possible out you then put a long bar on the nut of the other end of the bolt and try to turn it, this should rip any remaining rubber apart and allow you to pull the inner sleeve out. then feed a hacksaw blade through the hole, and careful cut through the outer sleeve in several places, and knock them out with a chisel. then press the new bushes in. thats some sound advice! thank you. another chance for an effing and blinding session! :ph34r: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluespanner Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 But before you go making it more bouncy, have a think about how laden you might need to be from time to time. By the time you have 4 mates in the back you might end up regretting something. Also towing a big trailer with soft suspension can be horrendous, although I doubt you have your trailer test yet I agree. My 90 has red/white stripes all round and it tows like a blancmange. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicken Drumstick Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 Cheap wrong rate parabolics will offer up carp ride and poor articulation and wheel travel. Haystee make the best parabolics or the slightly cheaper genuine Rocky Mountains Spares ones as they are a direct copy. Not yet seen or heard of any good reports of any other make/brand of parabolics and nearly all are way too higher a spring rate for off roading a lightish Landy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landy-Novice Posted March 2, 2012 Author Share Posted March 2, 2012 well mine are GB springs, and i read good reviews about them. just brought myself a 20mm drill bit, its huge! just hope my miky will cope with it! just looking at the bushes, and found these: http://www.island-4x4.co.uk/polyurethane-bush-black-britpart-548205py-p-6314.html which are half the price than what brownie found? will they be ok? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 Those bushes are two different part numbers, one is the spring eye bush, one is the chassis bush. Also, they're britpart, so likely will be a load of old w*nk anyway. The same sort of thing is true of springs - just because they're the same shape and fit the truck doens't mean they're actually made of anything proper. It's all about metallurgy and that takes thought & effort which costs money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 Dare I say it, those BP bushes will be fine, the chassis bushes don't take much of a hammering compared to say a radius arm bush off road, fit and grease well and I am sur ethey will be fine for a long while yet. I fitted the BP bushes to mine recently and they actually fitted, which was a good start, and everything bolted up OK, I will just keep an eye on them for a while, though it is only a low mileage motor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landy-Novice Posted March 2, 2012 Author Share Posted March 2, 2012 (edited) mr. FF, i know what you mean, but it might be better that a smack in the face!... started on it today, and the bolts where not as seized up at last time (something to do with the use?) and with a bit of brute force and swearing they were out! i remove the spring and got about battering the plop out of it and i got the supporting leaf off which leafs me with this: (sorry! had to say it! ) **edit** okay, thats an interesting swear filter??..... Edited March 2, 2012 by Landy-Novice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landy-Novice Posted March 2, 2012 Author Share Posted March 2, 2012 so the question is, will it be fine to bolt them back on without a bracket thing? i dont know how i would fit them as i dont want to drill holes in it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToyRoverlander Posted March 2, 2012 Share Posted March 2, 2012 Yes you can bolt them back on like this. The military wrap on the second leaf prevents it moving about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landy-Novice Posted March 2, 2012 Author Share Posted March 2, 2012 cheers! just the answer. i found some Monero gas assisted shocks if this doesn't work £28+VAT which doesn't sound to bad! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landy-Novice Posted March 3, 2012 Author Share Posted March 3, 2012 so today i did the other one, took no time at all, inspected bushes, seams to me the miles we did with the trailers unseized the bolts?! so with some grease and not done up so tight, there fine. photo time!! before, this was maxed out and i could get my fingers under the wheel: after, this had some more to go but my underwear wouldn't allow me. then the other side, the wheel didn't want to go anywhere near the bump stop. and now, it was only 2-2 1/2 inches away from bump stop. but as i said, she had more to go. we took it out for a little run and it seamed so much better and more pleasant! plus she sits better that before, so a job well done. thank you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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