Les Henson Posted September 9, 2006 Share Posted September 9, 2006 The 'red shed' being the property of Dr Goon, member of this website. Vehicle is a 300TDi CSW - both front prop uj's were worn, causing an awful squealing noise, and vibration through the drivetrain. Once the UJ has started to wear, it needs to be repaired quickly, as the vibration can cause damage to other components, such as transfer bearings, prop sliding joint, and pinion oil seal/bearing. Anyway - you have to take the prop off the vehicle in order to fix it. The correct propshaft tool is a good idea, but at a pinch you could do it with a couple of 14mm spanners. At the transfer case end the nuts can be removed, but not the bolts - they are captive by the position of the drive flange, so undo each one and remove the nuts - tap the bolt threads backwards as far as they will go. Axle end next, and the nuts and bolts can be removed. Once the prop is off the vehicle, a work bench and vice is preferable. You can do this job at the side of the road if you have to, but it's better to have a bench and vice to hand. The UJ gets quite rusty, as do the circlips that retain the bearing cups. A soaking with thin oil will help. Remove the grease nipple and carefully remove the circlips - if they are seized or very corroded, then the eyes can snap off. Using a drift or similar - knock the bearing cup inwards as far as it will go. The cup on the opposite side will stick out of the yoke a few mm. The cup can then be gripped in the vice or in a pair of vice grips and pulled out of the yoke,. Once the cup is out, knock the spider back the opposite way until the opposite cup is then sticking out, and remove it in the same way. The shaft and end yoke will then separate. The remaining two bearing cups can be removed in the same way. The remains of the needle rollers. Once a UJ starts to go, it disintegrates very quickly, and it's quite normal to see them in this condition. The flange and prop end now need to be cleaned. It's very important that no dirt gets inside the new UJ. There are some real cheap and nasty UJ's on the market - these are GKN (who own Hardy Spicer), good quality items. The new UJ, you get 4 new circlips and the grease nipple. Remove the bearing cups from the spider. Each cup has a seal. These are small and quite delicate while off the bearing. Take care not to damage one when doing this job. From now on in, you have to take great care not to dislodge any of the needle rollers, they are only staying in place because of the adhesive qualities of the grease. If a needle falls over while you are assembling the new UJ, you won't know about it until a circlip won't fit in it's slot, and will have to remove (and then possibly have to replace) the UJ again. Place one bearing cup in it's housing - not so far that it sticks through on the inside, and don't forget the seal. Now carefully fit the spider - take care not to dislodge a needle roller. If you are unsure - take the spider back out and check. Place the second seal on the spider and the put the second cup in the housing. Place the assembly in a vice (or use a G-clamp), and carefully press the bearing cups in. Make sure that the spider stays square and fits inside both cups without dislodging the rollers as it goes. In order to get the bearing cup right in, use a socket and push the cup in until it's inside the circlip slot. Don't worry if you push it too far in. Put the first new circlip in. Turn the UJ round and once again press the opposite cup in with the socket - which will push everything tight up against the first circlip you fitted. The second circlip slot should now be visible flush with the top of the cup, and you can then fit the second clip. If you can't see the second slot, and the UJ is flush against the first clip, then a needle roller has fallen over, and you'll have to take it all apart again. Don't use excessive pressure, and at all times make sure the bearing cups are going in nice and square, they can bind in the housing and wreck it if you're not careful. Method is exactly the same for the drive flange. Once the first cup is in place - hook it onto the spider. Place the second cup in the housing, and press the two in the same as before. There's a threaded hole for the grease nipple - usually 8mm socket. The new UJ - all finished. Both ends done and the prop is as good as new. That's it - re-fit the prop to the vehicle, grease the new UJ's and the sliding joint. Few things to beware of - the needle rollers can fall over or be easily dislodged. You won't know it until the bearing cup won't go far enough in to fit the circlip, and dismantling the new UJ to fix the problem may result in you having to buy another one. The small seals - don't forget them - the first of each pair of cups it goes on the cup once it's in the housing, but then on the spider before fitting the second cup. Make sure the work area, the parts of the prop you are using again, and tools, are clean. Any grit inside the new UJ will wear it out very quickly. Don't forget to grease the UJ's once the prop is back on the vehicle. Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GBMUD Posted September 9, 2006 Share Posted September 9, 2006 Top job Les. No criticism, just a few points I have observed... I use a slightly different and more voilent method - employing a copper hammer and a large vice - to remove the old joint. Next time I will attempt to photograph and post up an appendix. A little extra grease applied to the rollers can help retain them in position during assembly - any surplus grease wil be ejected on assembly. Take care not to use too much grease, only a little, applied with the little finger over the top of the rollers for added security. I also always remove the joint from the shaft end first and then from the flange end. This is simply because you are then working with a smaller piece of ironmongery for part of the operation. I assemble it in the same way, flange first. One thing you did not mention Les, and something I was taught, is that one should always mark the propshaft so that the shaft and flange always go back together in the same orientation. This can affect that balance of the shaft, causing a (very minor in this case) vibration. Lastly, it is important when fitting the new U/J to ensure that the grease nipple faces in the correct direction. On some joints the nipple comes out at an angle so that it points towards the shaft and away from the flange (which would otherwise be in the way of the grease gun). You should also align the nipple with the others for convenience sake. The importance of this will not become apparent until the first time you go under the car to grease the joints... Cheers Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saley Posted September 9, 2006 Share Posted September 9, 2006 i personally put a cut with a slitting disc about 2mm deep and wide in all 4 shaft ends it helps the grease to flow into the bearings easyer and seem to make them last a lot longer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BogMonster Posted September 9, 2006 Share Posted September 9, 2006 Once the UJ has started to wear, it needs to be repaired quickly, as the vibration can cause damage to other components, such as transfer bearings, prop sliding joint, and pinion oil seal/bearing. And the floor/exhaust pipe/wiring/..... I have seen a couple where the prop has let go completely at speed, on one of them the floor in the drivers footwell was about 2 inches from the bottom of the pedals where the prop had been trying to get in when the UJ on the front of the transfer box let go at about 50mph leaving the prop thrashing round underneath Another one let go right in front of me just outside work, there was this almighty bang and suddenly the back end of the vehicle leapt a couple of feet in the air, the rear prop had let go at the handbrake drum and dug in, neatly catching a seam in the road, pole vaulting the rear of the vehicle and then wiping out the whole of the rear section of the exhaust and various other bits and pieces. Didn't do the prop much good either As Les said if in doubt replace it - the alternative may be expensive....! (and dangerous) Another first class post Les Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted September 9, 2006 Share Posted September 9, 2006 How about a 'Masterclass with Uncle Les' section in the tech archive for all these 1st class threads Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted September 9, 2006 Author Share Posted September 9, 2006 uncle Les UNCLE!! Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BogMonster Posted September 9, 2006 Share Posted September 9, 2006 Grandpa? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
white90 Posted September 9, 2006 Share Posted September 9, 2006 http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?showtopic=4731 see new section under the Letter "H" a section for the duck murderers of this world Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted September 9, 2006 Share Posted September 9, 2006 Those circlips with small eyes are a major PITA when old and rusty, especially when the eye breaks off. I always try to fit the other type of circlip that gives me a sporting chance of removing them in the bush with just pointy nose pliers. Bill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted September 9, 2006 Share Posted September 9, 2006 http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php?showtopic=4731see new section under the Letter "H" a section for the duck murderers of this world Superb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted September 9, 2006 Author Share Posted September 9, 2006 see new section under the Letter "H"a section for the duck murderers of this world Oh dear! Could you add a disclaimer Tony? Never mind the dead duck - have you glued it's head back on yet? Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Posted September 9, 2006 Share Posted September 9, 2006 on a similar note to this thread. which way does everyone fit their front prop? when i got my disco the sliding joint was at the tbox end. when i lifted the disco it started eating UJs on the tbox end of the front prop. on a hunch i swopped the prop round so the sliding joint is at the axle end. in over a year ive not killed another UJ, makes me wonder if it was fitted wrong when i got the car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted September 9, 2006 Share Posted September 9, 2006 Defender workshop manual says slidy bits to transfer box, Discovery section says front & rear prop's slidy to transfer box Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BogMonster Posted September 9, 2006 Share Posted September 9, 2006 All the ones I have seen were slidy bit to t/box. Which in a way is a bit dumb because muck is more likely to run down the splines... but that is the way LR say they should go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Posted September 9, 2006 Share Posted September 9, 2006 thats what i thought from looking at other trucks as well as how mine was when i got it. its staying slidly bit to the front axle though, means UJs last at least 4 times longer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted September 9, 2006 Share Posted September 9, 2006 And they are not kidding : "How to with Les Henson" 110 front hub rebuild Alternate swivel seal replacement Diff pinion seal Wheel bearing adjustment Caliper rebuild Discovery clutch change Gearbox/clutch/rear crank seal change LT230 rear bearing and seal replacement Discovery clutch change Gearbox/clutch/rear crank seal change LT230 rear bearing and seal replacement Oil and filter change Fuel filter change UJ replacement 300TDI PAS pump replacment Replacing a V8 power steering pump in a 110 Like a 4x4 version of "Listen with Mother" Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted September 10, 2006 Author Share Posted September 10, 2006 There's 26 threads in total in the archive that I have done. Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
white90 Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 27 I make it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 Excellent Les, this has got to be the best place for owners new to LR's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Posted September 10, 2006 Share Posted September 10, 2006 Discovery clutch change Gearbox/clutch/rear crank seal change LT230 rear bearing and seal replacement so good he listed them twice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Les Henson Posted September 10, 2006 Author Share Posted September 10, 2006 3 vehicles there though - 300TDi Disco clutch change, 90 gearbox - clutch change, and oil seal, and 90 transfer box rear bearing and seal. 300TDi CSW front wheel bearing later this evening. Les. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
02GF74 Posted September 11, 2006 Share Posted September 11, 2006 nice. 2 questions reltated to balancing issues. 1. do you not need to mark the yoke/prop to ensure it goes back the same orientation 2. and the grease nipple fitted in same position as the original? It proabaly will make little difference but if I were doing it, I would keep the assembly as it was so that it is in balance as much as possible - ofcourse if the UJ was replaced before, there is no guarantee it is - a 50/50 chance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GBMUD Posted September 11, 2006 Share Posted September 11, 2006 nice.2 questions reltated to balancing issues. 1. do you not need to mark the yoke/prop to ensure it goes back the same orientation 2. and the grease nipple fitted in same position as the original? It proabaly will make little difference but if I were doing it, I would keep the assembly as it was so that it is in balance as much as possible - ofcourse if the UJ was replaced before, there is no guarantee it is - a 50/50 chance. Good idea. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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