muddy Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Does anyone know of ways to get more steering lock out of a 24 spline axle, I have removed the lock stops and tab thingymabobs from where the swivel housing bolts to the axle. This is a road going motor so I don't really fancy clocking the swivels or playing at cutting and welding steering components. Is the smaller cv better for this purpose as it can move more in the housing? Can the housing be ground out to allow more room or does the steering box become the limiting factor? Will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishbosh Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 The only way really is to have wheels with a bigger offset - the radius arms (assuming a coil sprung vehicle here as you say 24 spline) will foul your tyres otherwise. Even with a reasonable offset and 235 x 85 tyres you need to use the lock stops to stop the tyres rubbing the radius arms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 The more steering lock you have, the greater the chance of shattering CV joints offroad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco-Ron Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 I have a 300tdi 90, with 24 spline axles, i have adjusted my sterring lock for better turning circle as i compete in rtv trials, i use 7inch 0 offset modular wheels, with 235 85 tyres, and i am unable to get anymore lock, my caliper touches the axle casing before the tyres rub the radius arm, no one can quite work it out, but thats the way it is........ i have yet to have any CV issues, but time will tell!..... one thing i never do is use much throttle when on full lock......! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muddy Posted October 16, 2013 Author Share Posted October 16, 2013 Apologies, I should have added more information. This is for rtv-ing I am running heavily offset disco steels with 235/85 tyres which do not foul the radius arms, I am also aware that I'm running the weakest cvs in a fairly harsh environment especially asking them to cope with all the rip snorting torque of a tdi! I have been following the hockey stick and various one link threads with great interest and even rolled around underneath the motor with a tape measure looking at one link packaging using bent hockey sticks a bolt in crossmember and possibly one of si's ball joints. But all this is semi pie in the sky as it still wants to be reasonable on the road. Will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dirtydiesel Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Will, my 1 linked pajero was simply perfect to drive on the road, it used the axle ends of the radius arms with a fabbed up a frame back to a rangy a frame ball joint, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewis Posted October 18, 2013 Share Posted October 18, 2013 SimonR posted a link a while back to a build on another site that was using an x joint as a one link joint, I think he said it wasn't strong enough as standard and that the ball in the joint he used on his own one link had been made as a one off out of a stronger material (en24t instead of en8 iirc) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muddy Posted October 18, 2013 Author Share Posted October 18, 2013 I do recall si saying the joint would need to be adapted for use in this application. I mention that type of joint as I feel it's articulation suits the particular use. Which way round did you mount the ball joint dan, taper into the chassis x member I guess? May I be shot down in flames and ejected from this forum, but...... What is the legal stance in doing this? I presume it's just the same as fitting some spurious cranked rear trailing arms ie a rather grey area. Will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted October 18, 2013 Share Posted October 18, 2013 As it can all be bolt on, yes I think so.... Not modifying the chassis = DVLA not needed not be informed (in this case, there are plenty of other occasions you should of course!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted October 18, 2013 Share Posted October 18, 2013 I do recall si saying the joint would need to be adapted for use in this application. I mention that type of joint as I feel it's articulation suits the particular use. Which way round did you mount the ball joint dan, taper into the chassis x member I guess? May I be shot down in flames and ejected from this forum, but...... What is the legal stance in doing this? I presume it's just the same as fitting some spurious cranked rear trailing arms ie a rather grey area. Will. On my present 3 link, I use early adjustable A frame balljoints, orientated to put the ball pin in compression and tension. The ball joint unit is bolted to the radius arm/bulkead chassis outrigger and the tapered socket welded to the end of the lower control arm. My initial concern that the tapered joint wouldn't hold, and place too much tensile stress on the threaded shank of the ball pin were unfounded. However, I did try a later swaged non adjustable A frame ball joint, and it failed due to the tensile force pulling the ball pin through the swaged housing. I cast my own ball liners from melted down lead wheel balance weights when the plastic ones of the second hand adjustable joints I use are worn out, as I assume the plastic ones are not available separately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicken Drumstick Posted October 18, 2013 Share Posted October 18, 2013 If this is for RTV trials I assume its AWDC rather than ALRC? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muddy Posted October 18, 2013 Author Share Posted October 18, 2013 Yeah non Alrc. Bill if I may skip around a little what is your preferred method of bending the radius arms to achieve a neat and equal bends, I have a tubela hydraulic tube bender and a 60 ton press at my disposal, I was mulling over whether using a v block in the press would impart too much local stress into the bend? Must go find a fag packet to design on..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 I have never really had much tooling and just make do with what is lying about. I bent curved lateral cranks in my radius arms once to clear 36" tyres at full lock by tack welding 2 short H section beams to the vertical side of the radius arm,a measured distance apart. I then machined up a cap for my hydraulic press ram to which I welded a 3" thick piece of 6" dia steel bar I had lying around to act as a mandrel. I then tack welded the bottom of the mandrel to the side of the radius arm at half distance between the H beams. The flange and cross web of the H beams flex and bend to allow the bend to be made, and the tack welds prevent slippage and stuff from firing out under 10 tons of pressure, causing personal injury. I found if you use new pieces of H beam for the second radius arm and tack weld them and the mandrel in the same locations, it's not too difficult to bend both arms close to identical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewis Posted October 19, 2013 Share Posted October 19, 2013 When I bent the last three pairs of radius arms I used heat. I bent the first one trial and error, once I was happy with the shape I made a bend profile which picked up on the axle end bushes, then mounted bend profile and arm in the vice, applied heat with a gas torch and used a short length of tube on the chassis end of the arm for extra leverage. As i was using the same angle on both sides the bend profile could just be mirrored and reversed on the other hand arm. I over bent the arms slightly to allow for spring back. With this process I found repeatable results easy to achieve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
o_teunico Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 Lewis, how did you cooled them after bending? Water inmersion or just leaving them to slowly cool themselves? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewis Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 I allowed them to cool to ambient temperature in air Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
o_teunico Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 I will prefer cool bending, but I dont have any press. Instead I have access to a forge and big vince. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 I will prefer cool bending, but I dont have any press. Instead I have access to a forge and big vince. What, can 'Big Vince' bend steel with his bare hands? There's a bikie gang moved in down the road a bit. Can I borrow 'Big Vince' for a couple of days to help lay down some ground rules? Lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
o_teunico Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 It´s incredible what a change can make a single letter... "Big Vince" will certainly be the perfect man for having a "chat" with those bikers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 It´s incredible what a change can make a single letter... "Big Vince" will certainly be the perfect man for having a "chat" with those bikers Yep, he'll do the business alright. He could probably bend those radius arms for you too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daan Posted November 16, 2013 Share Posted November 16, 2013 I saw a neat way of achieving more steering lock. look at this clip: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JMLvSmTyaBE The new holland t6080 has a steering front axle, which also pivots around a central point, behind the axle. This would be perfect in combination with a one link. It cam to my attention because my nephew has a large toy model of the new holland which has this working exactly like the real thing. I could'nt stop playing with it! Daan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muddy Posted November 16, 2013 Author Share Posted November 16, 2013 They call it super steer on the new Hollands, it works well if a little odd at first as your weight block moves 4ft sideways! As this is for RTV trials and I want to show off at tescos, such heavy mods are out in my book. I was hoping I could grind some off the cvs and or swivels to get an extra degree or two. Do the td5 swivels with the front drag link mounting points have any different Ackerman to the track rod mountings? Maybe I should just learn to drive...... :/ Will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted November 16, 2013 Share Posted November 16, 2013 Straying ever so slightly off topic, but from my experience with the absolute rubbish castings on a Deutz powered Ford New Holland trackscavator, I give that tractors front axle half an hour before it snapped off the chassis ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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