sotal Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 Went off roading a couple of weeks ago, parked up afterwards, all was fine on the way back, then had to move the series the next day, which was fine, since then it's been sat there looking muddy as I've had no time to do anything with it. Anyway I decided to go to work in it today, so I jumped in started it up which was fine, stuck it into first, put a few revs on and let the clutch out but it didn't go anywhere - no smell of burning clutch just nothing, tried second gear the same again although had to rev a bit more, third gear was the same but the engine was starting to struggle a bit. I popped it into reverse, but only tried gently as the garage door was too close! I popped it back into first and dropped it into low range, put a fair few revs on and dropped the clutch and with a bit of a bang I shot forward up the drive, I then drove to work fine with no problems at all, all gears nice and good and brakes were fine. So I now have three questions: 1 - What was it - Clutch, Brakes or Handbrake 2 - Did I do the right thing to fix it? If not what should I have done? 3 - How do I stop it doing the same again? If it is the clutch do I need a bung to go in the drain plug? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rtbarton Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 Sounds to me that you accidently left the low range lever in neutral. The bang could have been the handbrake shoes breaking free, or just general clatter when setting off quickly in low range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Attryde Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 I would say it was your handbrake. The shoes had probably rusted to the drum. I would suggest not applying the handbrake but chocking the wheels when you park it up at home would help avoid (not fix) the issue. HTH Pete. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rtbarton Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 I would say it was your handbrake. The shoes had probably rusted to the drum. I would suggest not applying the handbrake but chocking the wheels when you park it up at home would help avoid (not fix) the issue.HTH Pete. Yes, but the engine would have stalled on the first attempts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Attryde Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 He does mention the engine struggling and needing more revs so I assumed that the clutch was being slipped a little where as when it was stuck in low and the clutch dumped the drive freed up. So I don't reckon the transfer was in neutral. Pete. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 I vote handbrake too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sotal Posted November 9, 2007 Author Share Posted November 9, 2007 Thanks for the replies guys, the high/low was definitely in high range it wasn't in neutral, I did expect to smell the clutch though and I did expect it to struggle more than it did. I did put the handbrake on, as last time I left it in gear with no handbrake as I had been told to but I then couldn't shift the gear stick! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobotMan Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 I had it happen to me yesterday, and many other times over the years. The give away is the lever being slack when released as the sprung linkage isn't pulling it as it's being held by the seized shoes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 I, stuck it into first, put a few revs on and let the clutch out but it didn't go anywhere - no smell of burning clutch just nothing, tried second gear the same again although had to rev a bit more, third gear was the same but the engine was starting to struggle a bit. This part is a little confusing. Did the engine stall in 1st gear ? or was it revving away without the vehicle moving ? If it didn't stall then I would hazard a guess that the clutch thrust bearing carrier had stuck on its slide with mud or condensation build up and by trying the various gears it eventually freed up, and that it was just a coincidence that it freed upwhen you put it in low range. This of course is assuming your gearbox is series 3 or later. My other suggestion is a long shot, and that is you have a broken rear axle and your 4 wheel drive selector shafts inside the transfercase are sticking. By selecting low range you may have engaged 4wd, and when you shifted back into high it stayed in 4wd instead of disconnecting automatically as it should when all the shafts are lubed and free to move. Bill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sotal Posted November 9, 2007 Author Share Posted November 9, 2007 The engine didn't stall in first or second but in third in started to struggle as the clutch was let out but a few more revs kept it running. In first and second I had the clutch all the way out without stalling and without any noises or smells. There was no smell of burning from the clutch that was why I thought it would be something to do with the clutch and not the handbrake, I think it was the shock of dropping the clutch with a good few revs on which freed whatever it was up. It's one of the last series 3 boxes from a 1984 series 3, afaik it was the last suffix model that they did. Does that help answer it?? Hope its not a broken rear axle although I do have a spare in the shed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted November 9, 2007 Share Posted November 9, 2007 gut reaction was a siezed clutch release fork...... I reckon Bill has hit the nail on the head. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TripTrick Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 This part is a little confusing. Did the engine stall in 1st gear ? or was it revving away without the vehicle moving ? If it didn't stall then I would hazard a guess that the clutch thrust bearing carrier had stuck on its slide with mud or condensation build up and by trying the various gears it eventually freed up, and that it was just a coincidence that it freed upwhen you put it in low range. This of course is assuming your gearbox is series 3 or later.My other suggestion is a long shot, and that is you have a broken rear axle and your 4 wheel drive selector shafts inside the transfercase are sticking. By selecting low range you may have engaged 4wd, and when you shifted back into high it stayed in 4wd instead of disconnecting automatically as it should when all the shafts are lubed and free to move. Bill. Please HELP!! I have the same issue! I was just picking up my new Roof Rack today and the guy at the Landy Shop wanter to take my Landy around the Farm to see/hear what I was complaining about the Shudder from the front /prop or axle... He gound the 4High was engaged although it looked like it had popped out. After this the Shudder was gone but I was still in Free on the Hubs. Anyway he changed the Overdrive from In to Out and went around again to test. All seemed Fine. I loaded my Roof Rack and off I went.. .About 3Km up trhe road I heard a Grinding Noise from Below me in the centre (GearBox / OVer Drive sort of area) I stopped imediately on the side of the road.... I checked that all gears etc were engaged.. (Over Drive, High Low etc...) All Seemed OK. As per this thread, I can select all the gears and it does not stall. However it does make a noise as if something is in Neutral and just on the edge of the gears so makes a slight grating noise... So I had to get towed back home. Now I have No Gears! Oh and mine does not work in Low range either. same issue. I replaced the Clutch Last Week. Had the Pressure Plate Skimmed aswell. Could it be any of these? Although I have driven about 300km since and all seemed fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 Please HELP!!I have the same issue! I was just picking up my new Roof Rack today and the guy at the Landy Shop wanter to take my Landy around the Farm to see/hear what I was complaining about the Shudder from the front /prop or axle... He gound the 4High was engaged although it looked like it had popped out. After this the Shudder was gone but I was still in Free on the Hubs. Anyway he changed the Overdrive from In to Out and went around again to test. All seemed Fine. I loaded my Roof Rack and off I went.. .About 3Km up trhe road I heard a Grinding Noise from Below me in the centre (GearBox / OVer Drive sort of area) I stopped imediately on the side of the road.... I checked that all gears etc were engaged.. (Over Drive, High Low etc...) All Seemed OK. As per this thread, I can select all the gears and it does not stall. However it does make a noise as if something is in Neutral and just on the edge of the gears so makes a slight grating noise... So I had to get towed back home. Now I have No Gears! Oh and mine does not work in Low range either. same issue. I replaced the Clutch Last Week. Had the Pressure Plate Skimmed aswell. Could it be any of these? Although I have driven about 300km since and all seemed fine. Sounds like. The overdrive input shaft splines and /or the splines on the coupler gear on the back of the gearbox mainshaft, ( the bit that replaces the standard transfercase mainshaft gear) have worn fretted away. A very common problem with overdrives. Solution is a replacement overdrive or just fit a standard mainshaft gear and livewithout an overdrive. Bill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBorges Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 I have the same problem long time ago and the problem is the transfer case lever, is slack... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TripTrick Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 Sounds like.The overdrive input shaft splines and /or the splines on the coupler gear on the back of the gearbox mainshaft, ( the bit that replaces the standard transfercase mainshaft gear) have worn fretted away. A very common problem with overdrives. Solution is a replacement overdrive or just fit a standard mainshaft gear and livewithout an overdrive. Bill. Hi There, Thanks for this info. Based on this and other info I have heard and read... I removed the OverDrive tonight. Not much of a hassle at all really. And there it was... A Broken off piece (Main Shaft?) in the Overdrive output shaft I think is the correct terminology based on the manual. The question is, What is this broken off piece stuck in the Overdrive... Is (Was) it part of the main GearBox? If so, I am hoping one can get these second hand or something so that I can try and replace it if possible. Is this even possible? or does a Gearbox Shop need to do this? Any suggestions on what to do now? Remove entire Gearbox from Landy and try remove the broken shaft from the front of the Box? Any advise and guidance would be greatly appreciated... Thanks Alot. ~Geez and I thought the 2a box was unbreakable? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted December 7, 2007 Share Posted December 7, 2007 Hi There,Thanks for this info. Based on this and other info I have heard and read... I removed the OverDrive tonight. Not much of a hassle at all really. And there it was... A Broken off piece (Main Shaft?) in the Overdrive output shaft I think is the correct terminology based on the manual. The question is, What is this broken off piece stuck in the Overdrive... Is (Was) it part of the main GearBox? If so, I am hoping one can get these second hand or something so that I can try and replace it if possible. Is this even possible? or does a Gearbox Shop need to do this? Any suggestions on what to do now? Remove entire Gearbox from Landy and try remove the broken shaft from the front of the Box? Any advise and guidance would be greatly appreciated... Thanks Alot. ~Geez and I thought the 2a box was unbreakable? The broken off piece I would guess is the threaded section of the back of the gearbox mainshaft. Unusual for that to break when an overdrive is fitted unless the overdrive bearings have disappeared. Unfortunately when a mainshaft breaks in this location it usually causes damage to the 3rd 4th synchro hub and sometimes 2nd/3rd gears because the shaft and gears slam forward on coast. You'd be better off trying to track down a complete replacement gearbox rather than attempt to repair your one. I always nearly throw up when I read in the Landrover comics about the '' very strong series 2a gearboxes'' when they are comparing series 2's to series 3's. For the record there is no such animal as a strong series gearbox. series 1, 2 and 2a gearboxes have weak layshafts and mainshafts. series 3 gearboxes except for suffix D models have weak synchro hubs. All have weak mainshafts. A modified series 3 layshaft can be fitted into a series 1,2 or 2a gearbox to cure the layshaft breakage problem without having the troublesome series three 1s/t 2nd synchros, but then the manshaft becomes the weak link. bill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TripTrick Posted December 9, 2007 Share Posted December 9, 2007 The broken off piece I would guess is the threaded section of the back of the gearbox mainshaft. Unusual for that to break when an overdrive is fitted unless the overdrive bearings have disappeared. Unfortunately when a mainshaft breaks in this location it usually causes damage to the 3rd 4th synchro hub and sometimes 2nd/3rd gears because the shaft and gears slam forward on coast. You'd be better off trying to track down a complete replacement gearbox rather than attempt to repair your one.I always nearly throw up when I read in the Landrover comics about the '' very strong series 2a gearboxes'' when they are comparing series 2's to series 3's. For the record there is no such animal as a strong series gearbox. series 1, 2 and 2a gearboxes have weak layshafts and mainshafts. series 3 gearboxes except for suffix D models have weak synchro hubs. All have weak mainshafts. A modified series 3 layshaft can be fitted into a series 1,2 or 2a gearbox to cure the layshaft breakage problem without having the troublesome series three 1s/t 2nd synchros, but then the manshaft becomes the weak link. bill. Thanks, I have the box out, Cleaned and stripped. I found, what looks like the remains of a Roller Bearing in the bottom of the gearbox. ?? I have reassembled the new Main Shaft with all the gears and goodies from the broken one. Only thing is I am not sure where this destroyed bearing comes from. Does anyone have a pic from a manuel on the exploded view of the Main shaft for me perhaps? So I can look see what is missing? Much appreciated. My Good Wife assisting me on the Landy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TripTrick Posted December 9, 2007 Share Posted December 9, 2007 My Landy before she broke the gearbox mainshaft and the bits found in the gearbox.. (Destroyed roller bearing?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill van snorkle Posted December 9, 2007 Share Posted December 9, 2007 Those damaged rollers apper to be from the front of the mainshaft where it enters the gearbox input shaft.It's one of the usual casualties when a mainshaft breaks or the rear nut comes loose.I think the bearingsurface on the input shaft will look abit ugly. Are you certain that the 3rd 4th synchro hub isn't twisted or otherwise damaged ? Bill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThreeSheds Posted December 9, 2007 Share Posted December 9, 2007 My Landy before she broke the gearbox mainshaft and the bits found in the gearbox.. (Destroyed roller bearing?) This looks a bit like a drill-bit to me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Hancock Posted December 9, 2007 Share Posted December 9, 2007 Bill tell us more about putting a S3 layshaft into a 2a box please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TripTrick Posted December 9, 2007 Share Posted December 9, 2007 The Syncro Hub Looks a little wierd as there seems to be a missing pin piece on one side where the other two are in place... see pic... but other than that it looks ok to my eye. Please see pics below and see if all looks ok? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gareth Dickens Posted December 9, 2007 Share Posted December 9, 2007 This looks a bit like a drill-bit to me I have a complete but buggered S3 gearbox and xfer case for u. Maybe u can build one box from the two. I stripped the first gear so maybe the shafts are bent. Otherwise I will dump it at Rob Leimer's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Hancock Posted December 9, 2007 Share Posted December 9, 2007 Thats a definitely scrap syncro without a doubt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TripTrick Posted December 9, 2007 Share Posted December 9, 2007 Thats a definitely scrap syncro without a doubt. Do I need a whole new one or can the pins be replaced... Sorry for the question but I am now too mechanically minded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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