Rear Recovery point

[western]

I dont thinik they are a good idea and a nato tow hitch is certainly a big no no for recovery. They simply are not strong enough. We had it drilled into us with our recovery training in the Army, never to use a bumper or tow hitch for recovery as they are rated forno more than 2 tones (or somthing like that,I forget exactly). I find it hard to belive that the recovery point pictured is any stronger than a nato tow hitch too.

We were always advised to put a chain around part of the chassis or axle. We have had a vehicle so stuck badly that it was pulled off its axles (by a warrior AFV) becuase a chassis recovery point was used instead of the axle.

Each recovery situation is different so its all food for thought. But im my opinion you should avoide tow hooks and that styleof recovery point if you are ever going to be doing serious recovery.

A standard LR NATO pintle is rated by Dixon-Bate the maker @ 5 tonnes, so it's ideal for a steady recovery pull by rope or winch. chains round axles can damage brake pipes.

from Dixon-Bate's website

http://www.dixonbate.co.uk/towing/product....PartNo=FV987958

[JST]

Scotain - you a Rec mech?

[Scotian]

No I'm not a rece mech, just had enough time on the ground and training to see what works, doesnt work and what is dangerous. Those figures for the nato tow hook tell it all. You are right on the edge of its breaking point in many recovery situations.

Western, yes the is that danger with the break pipes but depending on the situation its a better option (rather than having some tit infantry man disapaer off over the horizon with your landrover on tow with his AFV having left the wheels in the mud). Thats a bit of a dramatisation but the vehicle was VOR for a few months from the damage.

[western]

The NATO pintle is a lot stronger than it's tow rateing.

[Bowie69]

I have the figure of 20 tons rating for a NATO hitch in my mind from somewhere...... granted the crossmember would give way WAAAAAY before this on a 90, but they are strong items....

[firemannotsam]

I have personally used a Nato Hitch on the back of a snatch vehicle (when thay were still 3.5V8's) to tow a bus with no tyres accross a road ( N.Ireland riot situation) - probbably 12 tonnes in all, In low range it needed a jolt to get it sliding ( i.e. a run up of about 6ft in low first!). in 8 years in the army driving various Landrovers Bedfords and other vehicles I have never seen or heard of a Nato hitch giving way - and as Military Chassis are Heavier duty and painted and coated so often i dont think there is ever much rust to weaken the crossmember.

thay are always designed to take much more than the rating stated just as shackles etc are and generally the rated limit is way below the actual limt.

firemannotsam

[BogMonster]

Those figures for the nato tow hook tell it all. You are right on the edge of its breaking point in many recovery situations.

I can't find it at the moment but somewhere I have seen a figure for the ultimate tensile strength of the NATO hitch and it was something like 22 tonnes! I think it may have been on the old DB website which has changed since I last looked at it.

If you manage to snap one in a straight pull with a Land Rover you would have to be doing something really, really stupid!!!

[gazelle]

£40!!!!!!!!!!!!11 Flinking Blip!!!

For a shaped piece of steel with a few holes and a bent bar attached.

And then the backing plate and then the bolts .......

Brought tears to my eyes, and my wallet!!! :o

[pux]

so why is it then in recovery training we are taught to use a straight bar and Nato hook, and i have personnely recovered a Challenger using CRAAV (recovery version of a Challenger) using a Nato hook, i know there bigger than a Landy one but i have not hear or will never see a Nato hook break!!! as long as there looked after and checked regularly then they are perfect for land rover recovery. Buy a Nato hook i say ok your fuel bill might go up a bit

[Diff]

What made you laugh. They simply are not rated for recovery weights. You could end up putting over 4 tones of pull through a recovery point if you are really stuck seriously or using a kinetic recovery rope. The tow hitch is made to pull a trailer that even when full laden on a bedford is a rolling weight of just a couple of tone.

Really. dont do it, you are dicing with death when you end up with a high velocity nato tow hitch comming at you when it brakes.

Scotian, although I respect your views, I believe that someone has inadvertently misled you on the suitability of NATO hitches for recovery.

The subject of rated load as opposed to breaking strength is often confusing. Some products are marked with a ‘safe working load’ (SWL) or ‘working load limit’ (WLL) others are marked with a ‘breaking strain’ or similar.

Anything that is ‘rated’ with a SWL or WLL has a breaking strain at least 4x the SWL or WLL. This is an accepted industry figure.

For ‘rated’ items used for lifting people, the breaking strain can be as much as 8x the SWL or WLL.

A standard (light duty) nato hook as fitted to Land Rovers is rated at just over 4 tons SWL which means it has a MINIMUM breaking strain of 16 tons. The reality of something specified for military use is that it has a much higher breaking strain, and over 20 tons is highly likely.

Even a standard UK type 2 bolt mount 50mm tow ball has a SWL of 3,500kg (3.5 tons), therefore has a breaking strain of 14 tons or more. This is precisely why it is accepted as a suitable recovery point by many off road clubs and the MSA. (Ideally it should be mounted in such a way that it is difficult for the rope to slip over the ball).

Regardless of the strength of the hitch, what it is attached to is much more important. It is much harder to calculate the ‘breaking strain’ of a crusty crossmember or bumper.

Towing a vehicle out by its axles does have its merits in certain situations and is more relevant for heavily bogged big vehicles. If you use too much force to recover anything, it is possible to damage anything. The appropriate technique needs to be used. A vehicle which is so heavily bogged that the axles have been torn off it has been recovered incorrectly. A vehicle that badly bogged needs to be lifted/dug out in part to reduce the recovery loads.

I would be interested to know what the SWL for the 4 bolt recovery eyes featured in this thread is. Does anyone know?

Regards,

Diff

[Scotian]

Thanks very much for such a constructive answer, the first one that is anywhere near to converting me.. I have taken all that on board as it makes sense so I will stop giving the advice that I was lead to belive.

It is going to be hard/impossible to bring my self to use a nato tow hitch though as its been drummed into me for the past 12 years not to use it.

As far as the broken axles... are you sitting comfortably.... then I shall begin It was a Series 3 with a trailer that tipped 5+ tones on the weighbridge. It was one of many specially modified ones full of sneaky beaky radio kit for the unit I was with. We since changed to Pinzguarers to take cope with the crazy amount of kit on board. We got it stuck on salisbury plane in deep mud from tank traffic (it managed to get up the hill but got stuck ont he way back down!!) We were about 100 meters from a dirt road and a friendly infantry guy offered to pull us out. He hitched it up to is 432 and drove off, all was well untill he turned left along the road and started to pull the landrover sideways. All the shouting in the world didnt help becuase his 43 was too noisy so we ended up with a very VOR Landy. When we got it recovered the rec mech went nuts for the meathod of recovery and why we didnt use the axle to recover from.