landy's should be ok

[ciderman]

Mark WTF are you going on about , we are on about speed cameras and speed .

[Guest WALFY]

Jase read post 20 and please do keep up. .

Has James passed on the etiquette book yet

[muddy]

I wish they would make a seatbelt camera .

If i drive to college i have to go through about 12 speed cameras per day (30 and 40 limits on the A65 in leeds) I see no problem with them as it does keep the speed regulated and if your fit to drive then you have nothing to worry about IMHO.

Will.

[Guest WALFY]

I wish they would make a seatbelt camera .

If i drive to college i have to go through about 12 speed cameras per day (30 and 40 limits on the A65 in leeds) I see no problem with them as it does keep the speed regulated and if your fit to drive then you have nothing to worry about IMHO.

Will.

Or a mob phone camera. Hands free is so cheap and readily avail there is no excuse

[GBMUD]

If these average speed camera were everywhere, rather than single static cameras, it might have some interesting effects on traffic.

No longer would you get a ticket for a single moment of inattentiveness.

Traffic speeds on motorways might be more erratic as drivers try to get their average speed right before the next camera.

Lorries would have to travel at 40mph on A-roads as the camera will be able to ID them as lorries - that would slow us all down.

Cops will be able to focus on other things - like seatbelts and mobile phones.

YouOne could do 50 through villages and 50 in between them and still make the right average speed.

Personally speaking, I generally stick to the limits (or less in the LR) but I do occasionally go faster to get clear of traffic, avoid an idiot etc. but as long as my average is OK I will not be affected.

I guess that Tomtom etc will start calculating average speeds and counting down with your required speed as you approach a known camera location...

Chris

[Anderzander]

A lot of people I know resent them because there is no discretion. There are times and places where exceeding the speed limit can be totally safe = just like their are instances where driving at the speed limit is totally irresponsible.

The speed limits are a way of dealing with carp drivers - it would perhaps be better if they were just better drivers.

[Guest WALFY]

When I worked in a previous posting I had dealings with various Police Forces around the country. 1 force had a set of 6 cameras along a stretch of road. It took your details at every camera and then worked out the average along the whole length. If you turned off before a camera it may no difference it also worked out you speed between cameras. So it's not just the end to end speed you need to worry about it's between every camera as well. So the only real solution is not to speed

[Ruuman]

speed camera's and id cards are two of my most hated things. speed camera's do nothing but cause panic braking, tailgating and lane hogging. The majority of accidents are caused by idiots not paying attention, as was the case today when I was almost killed twice on my bike by people looking the wrong way and pulling out into traffic.

I stick to speed limit's on regular roads and travel at motorway speeds (80-90) and I can safely say almost every accident I've witnessed was down to lack of attention and proper indication. These things are just here to make money. Also how many national limit's have been reduced to 40's in your area for no reason, far to many.

As for id cards, Walfy sure you've been bought up with them Germany, the problem with the UK implementation is their future plans for it, far to much power in the hands of the wrong people and once the tools are in place they can never be dismantled. Any government that even thinks that genetically profiling babies for criminal and social strains is already over stepping their mark. Let alone profiling the movements of a whole populous! I'll admit I'm an idiot, but that just isn't my cup of tea.

[Guest WALFY]

Didn't grow up with them, I only lived there for 5 1/2 yrs at the beginning of my career.

[newclear]

I am all for these new types of camera's, as they "automatically read number plates" so I guess they can be connected into the ANPR system, as with having my truck stolen recently (still a bit bitter ) the more places where the numberplate can be detected the better.

There are only so many Police Patrol cars around and nobody can expect them to detect every single Numberplate that goes past them, where as a camera can and will check them all. Maybe missing the odd one if it's obscured perhaps.

Cheers

Matt

[OilIT]

speed camera's and id cards are two of my most hated things. speed camera's do nothing but cause panic braking, tailgating and lane hogging. The majority of accidents are caused by idiots not paying attention, as was the case today when I was almost killed twice on my bike by people looking the wrong way and pulling out into traffic.

I stick to speed limit's on regular roads and travel at motorway speeds (80-90) and I can safely say almost every accident I've witnessed was down to lack of attention and proper indication. These things are just here to make money. Also how many national limit's have been reduced to 40's in your area for no reason, far to many.

As for id cards, Walfy sure you've been bought up with them Germany, the problem with the UK implementation is their future plans for it, far to much power in the hands of the wrong people and once the tools are in place they can never be dismantled. Any government that even thinks that genetically profiling babies for criminal and social strains is already over stepping their mark. Let alone profiling the movements of a whole populous! I'll admit I'm an idiot, but that just isn't my cup of tea.

Show me a camera that can do what a policeman can do and they will get my vote - until then they are kodak tax machines. (police in cars can detect cars driven erratically/dangerously/weaving due to too much drink / drugs etc).

Re ID cards, if the UK govnmt could be trusted not to leave the data in a lap dancing club i woudlnt mind - but they cant - so i do

[Guest WALFY]

A lot of plod cars have ANPR fited now and it scans every car that they pass and carry out an isurance/tax/wanted database. I'm also sure that the ANPR database is a stand alone system to prevent corruption from connected databases

EDIT

After a bit of research it seems that the speed camera database is seperate not the ANPR system. To stop plod taking peoples fines off the system, nt that I'd suggest they would do it of course

[T1G UP]

my thinking was that the visual deterrent of a very visible traffic car is more effective than a grey or yellow painted camera, how many drivers slow down on the motorway when they spot the police or highways traffic vehicle all highly visible in the battenburg liveries.

I agree. think this problem is endemic of yoof of today. loads of caeras on our streets yet violent street crime is up.a camera can only watch

Sometimes a warning would suffice rather than 3 points.

more bobbies on the beat please.

[Guest WALFY]

More bobbies yes. But they must have some gumption about them and not be frightened to carry out the law for fear of some scrotes human rights

[Guest diesel_jim]

A lot of people I know resent them because there is no discretion. There are times and places where exceeding the speed limit can be totally safe = just like their are instances where driving at the speed limit is totally irresponsible.

Totally safe, maybe for you (but maybe not for the nervous/old/demented/new driver you're about to overtake), but still illegal... speed limit is the law, whether it's a dead straight road in the dry.

[Anderzander]

Totally safe, maybe for you (but maybe not for the nervous/old/demented/new driver you're about to overtake), but still illegal... speed limit is the law, whether it's a dead straight road in the dry.

There are more instances of exceeding the speed limit than overtaking, empty roads for example.

People can be overtaken safely sometimes too. On a motorbike exceeding the speed limit is sometimes your only option to survive the negligence of another road user. I think there are lots of examples.

I wouldn't condone driving in such a way that intimidates anyone.

[Ruuman]

exactly! and how are the camera going to detect the idiot intimidating other road users or overtaking in a dangerous way? again another reason to scrap camera's and bring in more plod.

couldn't agree more about higher speeds on a motorbike being safer, just to many idiot's on the road.

Also the ANPR DB, whilst a nice idea is pretty useless for stolen and tax/insurance dodgers. How many of us no where to make up a number plate without id, I can think of a few places. then nip down to the local tesco's find a car that looks like yours and spoof the plate. Bingo free road tax, insurance, speeding tickets, etc. basically any criminally minded person with a slight bit of intelligence can circumnavigate these systems because there all reliant on one flimsy piece of evidence you can get from anywhere!

[landroversforever]

I am against speed cameras. Spend the money on more plod instead!

Mom is a prime example of bad driving near speed cameras that i see every day - driving along at any speed, almost always way under the limit, she always brakes before the speed camera alot of the time a sharp brake!

A camera can only do one thing - check speed. Plod patrolling can check for people without seatbelts, on the phone, driving dangerously whether speeding/drunk or just plin bad driving. a camera cannot do that.

[western]

Mom is a prime example of bad driving near speed cameras that i see every day - driving along at any speed, almost always way under the limit, she always brakes before the speed camera alot of the time a sharp brake!

if she's below the speed limit why is she braking before the camera, that's just really dangerous for following traffic even if they are a good distance behind.

tell her to stop doing it as there's no need to if under the limit.

[Anderzander]

You're right - but its something I see a lot.

The person does it as a reflex when they see the camera - either because they aren't aware of the speed they are at or they aren't aware of the speed limit at that point on the road.

There is a camera near me that is in a 50 limit on the edge of a town - most people see it and suddenly brake down to 30. Its very dangerous.

[ThreeSheds]

I motorcycle commute in Leeds and I would like to see more red light cameras. IMHO there is NEVER an excuse for going across a red light.

I am on a motorcycle, and I know the light sequences, so I can quite often filter up to the front of stationary traffic. In this position it is important to get away before the vehicles on either side and position yourself in one or other of the lanes. Here lies the problem since, when the lights change and you start to move, you will OFTEN (probably twice in each seven mile trip) find yourself facing a stream of tailgating morons who continue to follow each other across in front of you through their red light! There was one particular junction (changed now thankfully) where even buses would do this

Recently they have created a double lights sequence (40yards apart) where you can set off from the first and the second changes in good time so that you don't have to slow down and can cross ok on green - trouble is that this means you are crossing the actual junction at maybe 20mph instead of just pulling away and meanwhile people are coming across on red from the other direction at maybe 40mph or more. This junction has only been finished a couple of weeks, but IMHO (unless they sequence it a little better or fit red-light cameras) it's a disaster waiting to happen.

With regard to average speed cameras, I very much prefer them to normal ones since they effectively allow overtaking more safely, but I have big-brother concerns about what happens in 20 years when they are literally at every major junction. Of course I also prefer them because (at the moment) they don't work for motorcycles, and in my LR products I don't speed anyway...

[Guest diesel_jim]

You're right - but its something I see a lot.

The person does it as a reflex when they see the camera - either because they aren't aware of the speed they are at or they aren't aware of the speed limit at that point on the road.

There is a camera near me that is in a 50 limit on the edge of a town - most people see it and suddenly brake down to 30. Its very dangerous.

This shows the general rubbish driving style of most people doesn't it (me included sometimes...)..... i distinctly rememeber when being taught to drive, when you see the speed limit sign coming up, start to slow down so when you go past said sign, you're doing the limit.

tw@ts who drive aimlessly without looking past the end of their bonnets need to be re educated.

[landroversforever]

if she's below the speed limit why is she braking before the camera, that's just really dangerous for following traffic even if they are a good distance behind.

tell her to stop doing it as there's no need to if under the limit.

I've tried she just doesnt listen.

[Anderzander]

This shows the general rubbish driving style of most people doesn't it (me included sometimes...)..... i distinctly rememeber when being taught to drive, when you see the speed limit sign coming up, start to slow down so when you go past said sign, you're doing the limit.

tw@ts who drive aimlessly without looking past the end of their bonnets need to be re educated.

Absolutely.

Before speed cameras came in I believe this was the Police message to the government. ie camera's won't help much we need to re-educate drivers and improve the standard of the average driver.

The government, it seems, wanted to be seen to be doing something so went the easy camera route.

I think the whole thing came on the back of a massive Police survey of accidents. They recorded the reasons for all accidents over a long period of time. The results got reinterpreted to put speed at the top of the reasons chart - when it was lack of driver skill and awareness that they scored highest by quite a margin I believe.

iirc the one they jumped on was 'excessive speed for the situation', which of course isn't really the same as speeding and I believe the police initially pointed that out.

anyway!

I prefer trundling along green lanes these days - and my 90 is most comfortable at 50. 60 if I rev it a bit harder but still value my hearing in the long term. 65/70 only comes on a motorway with a big down hill.