bishbosh Posted October 25, 2009 Share Posted October 25, 2009 Whilst I had the front axle off this weekend I thought it was as good a time as any to rebush the axle end of the radius arms. The previous owner of the 90 had used red polybushes of some type or other and they were past their best (although did pass an MOT not many weeks ago). Anyhow, on removing the bushes this is what I found: Close up of rear bush location: It was a bit odd, as the front bush location wasn't anywhere near as bad (although still corroded). So, this left me with a bit of an issue - no serviceable hockey sticks . A quick ring around found me 2 1/2 sets courtesy of Mark90 and Ciderman (thanks gents, most appreciated ) and I was invited to take the best two. So, I pressed out the genuine bushes from the arms ( I am fitting Superpro) and this is what I found: Absolutely sparklingly clean! Bearing in mind that the arms are all about the same vintage, and in fact the ones with genuine bushes in looked far scabbier on the surface than the ones on my 90, it does beg the question if polybushes are a good thing or not from a lifespan of your hockey sticks point of view. Has anyone else encountered similar issues? The bushes that came out were two piece "top hat" style whereas the Superpro bushes are a one piece "cotton reel" style so that may help?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
white90 Posted October 25, 2009 Share Posted October 25, 2009 Charles was that abrasion marks or damage from old bush removal in the past? Luckily I have a nice set of hockey sticks with superpros fitted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishbosh Posted October 25, 2009 Author Share Posted October 25, 2009 It is significant levels of corrosion Tony - looks like a bit of steel that has been in the sea for a long time! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLASH Posted October 25, 2009 Share Posted October 25, 2009 I was advised by gwyn lewis to use standard bushes when I rebuilt mine as this can be a common problem with polybush's Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted October 25, 2009 Share Posted October 25, 2009 Aye, HAd this on one of mine, a mate uses polybushes He calls them "Dog Chews" ......and his 3 swear by them I've gone back to Genuines after my short time with them Very disappointed, caused me no end of problems inc the one above Ended up giving them away - as "Dog Chews" Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jules Posted October 25, 2009 Share Posted October 25, 2009 I've been using polybush's for years well since I could drive and always heard of the problems but never suffered from the problems myself on any of my trucks even the racers. I always thought it was the Iron man bush's that coursed all the problems. It could be were I don't leave stuff alone for long which is why I have not suffered from corrosion you guys have Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reads90 Posted October 25, 2009 Share Posted October 25, 2009 I have always use Blue polybush polybushes and never had that problem. Although i have caused a mess like that in the past by trying to get old gen bushes out Since moving to Aus i now use Superpro bushes, but that is only because they made around the corner from me and half the cost of Polybush ploybushes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David_LLAMA4x4 Posted October 25, 2009 Share Posted October 25, 2009 I bought my first set of ( in those days ) urethane bushes in the late 80's and they were pants. Since that day I have tried most makes of poly bushings and jave found them all to be pants!! Danage to the arms themselves is very common as is ovalling of the holes that the bolts go through especial;y on the rear axle tabs. In other words any component near to or directly affected by the poly bushing gets damages whereas when proper bushes are used they will sacrifice themselves for the greater good of the car, hence they don't always lasr long but at least you only neeed to change the bushnot the rest of the suspension. In a previous life I was involved in mobile crane hire and we owned a 45 ton capacity crane. On the jib head was IIRC 6 nylon pulleys running on a 4"ish steel bar. We had to buy a new steel bar every 18 months but never needed a new plastic pulley! What used to happen was general road ( or site ) crud used to get into the grease / gaps on the shaft. These bits would embed themselves into the softer plastic thus doing no more damage to the plastic than a small dent. They would then run on and rub and scour into the steel shaft wearing nasty grooves into it. The same will apply to a poly bush in a LR. The carp will get into the joint , embed into the softer material and them 'emery cloth' away at the metal birs Over the years I have actually seen radius arms so worn that a metalastic type bush will fall straight through without a press. Poly bushes seem to be one of those products that have built up a great reputation for a carp product - but then what would I have learned over the last 30 tears of LR using compared to someone who drives a Merc but has 4 pages of adverts Sricj to OE bushes for both articulation and ( long term ) longevity of your car. David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajh Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 I just galvanized the radius and trailing arms, now it should not be an issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveturnbull Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 Yep, seen this before on a comp safari racer. Our theory is that because the polybush doesn't have the outer metal sleeve, under load a gap will open up between the bush and it's housing, thus letting in mud and small stones. Some of the bushes are so flippin' hard that the aforementioned carp will erode the metal rather than the rubber bush, enlarging the housing. On the plus side, if you catch it early on, the arms are still ok and it makes changing the bushes a damn sight easier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David_LLAMA4x4 Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 I just galvanized the radius and trailing arms, now it should not be an issue. Corrosion isn't the problem, abrasion is the culprit so your galvanising will not help you All the poly ( emery ) bushed will do is remove all the galv first before setting about the arms.... David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GBMUD Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 I bought my first set of ( in those days ) urethane bushes in the late 80's and they were pants. Since that day I have tried most makes of poly bushings and jave found them all to be pants!! Danage to the arms themselves is very common as is ovalling of the holes that the bolts go through especial;y on the rear axle tabs. In other words any component near to or directly affected by the poly bushing gets damages whereas when proper bushes are used they will sacrifice themselves for the greater good of the car, hence they don't always lasr long but at least you only neeed to change the bushnot the rest of the suspension. In a previous life I was involved in mobile crane hire and we owned a 45 ton capacity crane. On the jib head was IIRC 6 nylon pulleys running on a 4"ish steel bar. We had to buy a new steel bar every 18 months but never needed a new plastic pulley! What used to happen was general road ( or site ) crud used to get into the grease / gaps on the shaft. These bits would embed themselves into the softer plastic thus doing no more damage to the plastic than a small dent. They would then run on and rub and scour into the steel shaft wearing nasty grooves into it. The same will apply to a poly bush in a LR. The carp will get into the joint , embed into the softer material and them 'emery cloth' away at the metal birs Over the years I have actually seen radius arms so worn that a metalastic type bush will fall straight through without a press. Poly bushes seem to be one of those products that have built up a great reputation for a carp product - but then what would I have learned over the last 30 tears of LR using compared to someone who drives a Merc but has 4 pages of adverts Sricj to OE bushes for both articulation and ( long term ) longevity of your car. David I fitted blue Polybushes (capital P on purpose!) into the front hockey sticks of my old 90. Within 6 months I had to remove them and replace with genuine Landrover ones for ecactly the reason David suggests above. My conclusion was, as David suggests, that the crud was getting into the PE and acting as an abrasive. I think they are still here somewhere as 'show and tell' items if anyone wants me to photograph them. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 I'm sure i've seen some bushes (Superpro perhaps?) that come with a metal sleeve just like the OEM ones. Can anyone confirm that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOA 93 Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 Yes. I can confirm that. They can be bought seperately, or they come in the Tomcat kit. And yes they are expensive, I think I paid £90 for a set of four from the SuperPro stand at the Indoor show. They were designed for the Safari comp crowd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reads90 Posted October 26, 2009 Share Posted October 26, 2009 Yes. I can confirm that. They can be bought seperately, or they come in the Tomcat kit. And yes they are expensive, I think I paid £90 for a set of four from the SuperPro stand at the Indoor show. They were designed for the Safari comp crowd. You can buy them from the fulcrum factory . They will sell them to you seperately. Last lot i bought was a set of rear radius arm bushes, Chassis and axles ones. Cost me $55 or about £25 (used to be the conversion untill the value fell out of the pound ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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