ballcock Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 (edited) Mine turned up on Saturday morning, excellent service. I haven't opened one yet as they are single use containers and I thought I would wait for your analysis. Edited January 18, 2021 by ballcock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkie Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 4 minutes ago, ballcock said: Mine turned up on Saturday morning, excellent service. I haven't opened one yet as they are single use containers and I thought I would wait for your analysis. I applied some gentle pressure with pliars around the red cap, enough to create a gap to get a small screwdriver in and pop out the cap. I could then replace the cap after having a look to keep dust and dirt out. They are coated in a light oil preservative. I will show a side by side comparison with the Eurocar parts supplied one when it arrives. Both in terms of the container and the actual nozzle assembly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballcock Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 2 minutes ago, monkie said: I applied some gentle pressure with pliars around the red cap, enough to create a gap to get a small screwdriver in and pop out the cap. I could then replace the cap after having a look to keep dust and dirt out. They are coated in a light oil preservative. I will show a side by side comparison with the Eurocar parts supplied one when it arrives. Both in terms of the container and the actual nozzle assembly. I am looking forward to your comparison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HampshireHog Posted January 19, 2021 Share Posted January 19, 2021 Monkie was the seller on eBay based in Cranleigh by any chance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkie Posted January 19, 2021 Share Posted January 19, 2021 40 minutes ago, HampshireHog said: Monkie was the seller on eBay based in Cranleigh by any chance Yes it was. I followed the ebay link that @Maverikposted a little while ago on this thread. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HampshireHog Posted January 19, 2021 Share Posted January 19, 2021 I tried to buy a set from them some time ago but failed , for some strange reason I wasn’t allowed to complete the purchase I suspect they were out of stock I also tried to find their premises as I was doing a job that way at the time but only came up with a domestic property. Here’s hoping they turn out to be the real deal , 10/10 for the effort your making monkie 👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkie Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 Okay, the moment you have all been waiting for. The excitement has reached its climax... I have in hand the Bosch nozzle DSLA145P208 from Bosch via Eurocar parts, their UK distributor for Joe public like me. It set me back a total of £84 with VAT and a £10 delivery charge from Bosch that usually would be not charged for but as this was a single order I agreed to pay it. So, first impressions... It looks packaged like the ebay nozzles But hang on, the plastic tube is bigger than the ebay nozzles. It also comes with a hologram that isn't on the ebay ones... Suspicious. The nozzle is also supplied with a top piece that isn't on the eBay ones but there are no copper washers with the Eurocar Parts supplied nozzle. Side by side with the ebay nozzle on the right and ebay needle to the right of the Eurocar parts supplied one; there are a few minor differences. Note the shoulder on the needle on the one on the left. The machining marks on the ebay nozzle are not present on the other. The markings on them are different although it's worth pointing out they both say they are made in Brazil (albeit in different places). The picture above shows how the Eurocar parts nozzle looks on its own. I look forward to what you all think from my pictures so I leave you with them side by side in their cases to draw your own conclusions... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reb78 Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 Hmmm, interesting.... @vulcan bombermight have some things to say given that he machines metal parts for a living (and for fun...) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkie Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 5 minutes ago, reb78 said: Hmmm, interesting.... @vulcan bombermight have some things to say given that he machines metal parts for a living (and for fun...) Indeed, I'm looking forward to what our panel of experts think. What are your impressions Richard? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reb78 Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 2 minutes ago, monkie said: Indeed, I'm looking forward to what our panel of experts think. What are your impressions Richard? I agree with your analysis Phil - there look to be visual differences between them in terms of machining, but I dont know if that makes a functional difference. I dont know how much difference is acceptable in the machining process though? I would have thought they should be identical? What is the additional part that comes with the Eurocarparts nozzle? Do the tips look the same profile close up? Earlier in the thread, the pics RRC200tdi posted showed a very obvious difference at the business end... I cant see that here so they may both be ok?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkie Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 The needle tips look identical and come to a nice point. They don't look like the ones the OP showed us of dubious origin. I'm just using my camera phone which is having a difficult job of focusing on the fine detail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkie Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 3 hours ago, reb78 said: What is the additional part that comes with the Eurocarparts nozzle? I don't really know, I guess it's some sort of spacer or check valve that sits between the nozzle and spindle in the injector body. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jocklandjohn Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 1 hour ago, monkie said: I don't really know, I guess it's some sort of spacer or check valve that sits between the nozzle and spindle in the injector body. 17mins in on this excellent video shows it and I think he explains it in the dismantling stage earlier: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkie Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 I think I missed him explaining what it was? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vulcan bomber Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 Without holding them in my hands then only difference I can see in the pictures is the Ebay one with the machining marks on the shoulder has had the attention of a cylindrical grinder, which is how the machining mark is produced like that. It's done with the side of the grinding wheel. Surface finish wont make any difference anywhere other than the point on the needle. The tolerances they would be working to will be minute and modern day Sliding head lathes will hold the tolerances with ease which is why the body of the genuine bosch one isnt ground. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jocklandjohn Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 2 hours ago, monkie said: I think I missed him explaining what it was? If he doesn't explain then it might have been another video I watched. Hmm. If I find it I'll post it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eightpot Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 The spray holes are in a different place on the ebay ones? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkie Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 2 minutes ago, Eightpot said: The spray holes are in a different place on the ebay ones? Yeah you're right. Just noticed that myself. It's an odd one. The ebay ones don't seem fake, just different. Maybe a variant? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reb78 Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 Just now, monkie said: Yeah you're right. Just noticed that myself. It's an odd one. The ebay ones don't seem fake, just different. Maybe a variant? Do they correspond with 300tdi ones do you think? As others have said they fit... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkie Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 24 minutes ago, reb78 said: Do they correspond with 300tdi ones do you think? As others have said they fit... I don't know, I did a quick search and found these (Bosch part number DLLA155P572) for a 300Tdi engine. I am beginning to doubt the ebay nozzles if i'm honest. If they are fake, they are bloody good, the differences are minor. What difference would having the holes in a slightly higher/lower place make? Would they test differently when put on the same injector? Coming back to the allogation of some people putting 300Tdi nozzles on a 200Tdi injector... well do you know what, at £15 a nozzle - let's add one of these to the comparison so see how it compares. I think I'm going to need to get hold of a better camera to show the differences clearer. I'm not finished here. I want to put them both, plus the 300 Tdi nozzle on exactly the same injector and have the spray patterns and opening pressures compared.... To be continued. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkie Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 56 minutes ago, Jocklandjohn said: If he doesn't explain then it might have been another video I watched. Hmm. If I find it I'll post it! It's an offset bushing... This is interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smallfry Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 Not a Tdi fan, but I always thought that Bosch DIESEL injection stuff had a part number beginning "04" but its been 20 odd years since I was in the Agri and Plant industry, so maybe that's changed. Could be the ground one highlighted by VB is an old stock item, and had a different manufacturing method now that machining has come on ? It has a different part number. Also might explain the lack of hologram, which didn't exist a few years ago. It certainly doesn't look crude, as a lot of non genuine stuff does. I would hazard a guess that it IS genuine, but old stock. You could grind the needles on a bench grinder and see how it feels, and how the sparks look. If its non gen it will most certainly not be made of the same material, or be hardened correctly, and it will show ! No ? Just a suggestion .......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkie Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 2 hours ago, smallfry said: Not a Tdi fan, but I always thought that Bosch DIESEL injection stuff had a part number beginning "04" but its been 20 odd years since I was in the Agri and Plant industry, so maybe that's changed. Could be the ground one highlighted by VB is an old stock item, and had a different manufacturing method now that machining has come on ? It has a different part number. Also might explain the lack of hologram, which didn't exist a few years ago. It certainly doesn't look crude, as a lot of non genuine stuff does. I would hazard a guess that it IS genuine, but old stock. You could grind the needles on a bench grinder and see how it feels, and how the sparks look. If its non gen it will most certainly not be made of the same material, or be hardened correctly, and it will show ! No ? Just a suggestion .......... You could well be right, but I ain't going to grind the nozzle that cost me £84! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vulcan bomber Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 12 hours ago, monkie said: You could well be right, but I ain't going to grind the nozzle that cost me £84! Wheres your sense of adventure!? Position of the injection holes will affect where they fire into the cylinder.. 200 and 300 nozzles are different because the injectors set at different angles. Also the pistons are different because of this. You can put a 300 head on a 200 block. But you need to fit 300 pistons in the 200 to do it properly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkie Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 Maybe I should ask Bosch to comment. They will either give a reason or say it hasn't changed thus throwing doubt on the ebay nozzles. Maybe the different positioning of the holes puts them in a different environment temperature-wise and makes them less prone to clogging up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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