TD5toV8110 Posted August 29, 2023 Share Posted August 29, 2023 So, Sally is obviously more than Banjo, but how much does each weigh? 🙃 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD5toV8110 Posted August 29, 2023 Author Share Posted August 29, 2023 Disc to disc with oil etc... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daan Posted August 30, 2023 Share Posted August 30, 2023 From googling: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD5toV8110 Posted August 31, 2023 Author Share Posted August 31, 2023 (edited) Yeah, I did Google first. Saw the above. Still no definitive answer. I have Sals. I don't need the strength. I can sell the Sals (with discs) to a Perentie owner. I will need to source a "good" Disco banjo for reasonable money. Is it worth the hassle? (and unknowns for used banjo) How much weight will I save? (the only advantage) Oh and ground clearance... Edited August 31, 2023 by TD5toV8110 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snagger Posted September 2, 2023 Share Posted September 2, 2023 If you have a 110, as your tag and the current fit of a Salisbury suggest, then fitting a Rover rear axle in its place is going be a really daft idea, especially with a V8 or TD5. Yes, you can fit uprated aftermarket diffs and shafts, but the axle tube is still not rated for a laden 110. You will have no end of recurring failures unless you fit reinforcing trusses, heavy duty gears, uprated special alloy shafts and a much tougher diff, where the standard Salisbury has all of that strength in spades already. Even then, in Aus, you will run into legal issues with the authorities, who seem to be exceptionally punitive and restrictive. Yes, you could fit a late short-nose rear axle from a late TD5 or TDCI 110, but they have been shown to be puny compared to the Salisbury too, especially by Australian owners. No weight saving or marginal ground clearance is worth the swap away from a Salisbury unless you are going for fairly extreme axles like portals. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD5toV8110 Posted September 2, 2023 Author Share Posted September 2, 2023 Rodger.... My build is a "mall cruiser" 😁 I do not need the might of the Sals. A std D1 rear end will be more than adequate. TD5 110 chassis, Disco 1 V8. ZF auto Bobtailed ass end. Series 2/3 single cab (no rear end yet.) cab to be extended 100mm ish) Tyres are 225 95 16.... New std height Range Rover Classic front springs (early blue stripe). Rear end has P38 front bags. Missing Radiator and other random bits for now... Drivers floor panel is currently 720mm off the ground... All reactions: 11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD5toV8110 Posted September 2, 2023 Author Share Posted September 2, 2023 The whole build is being/has to be engineered. (expensive legality down here.....)🙃 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stellaghost Posted September 2, 2023 Share Posted September 2, 2023 Ahh come on Dave your not playing the game... We need a build thread and pictures.....lots of pictures regards Stephen 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD5toV8110 Posted September 2, 2023 Author Share Posted September 2, 2023 I'm gathering knowledge "before" I release pix....🤪 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stellaghost Posted September 3, 2023 Share Posted September 3, 2023 Ha, thats cheating........ I did'nt have the knowledge before I started my Mog axle thread, which is why I joined this forum....... Got to have a few teaser pics available....... Regards Stephen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD5toV8110 Posted September 3, 2023 Author Share Posted September 3, 2023 I'll polish my old box brownie....🙃 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snagger Posted September 3, 2023 Share Posted September 3, 2023 Your choice, but I see no benefit at all in replacing the Salisbury axle with a Rover type. If it’s a mall cruiser, then you don’t need the extra inch or so of ground clearance. If you can sell it for a lot of cash to pay for other things, then I can at least see that temptation, but the list of mods doesn’t suggest you are struggling for the budget. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD5toV8110 Posted September 3, 2023 Author Share Posted September 3, 2023 On the contrary, this build is well in the black so far... Buying at the right price, selling what I don't need... The TD5 was a bargain. Non runner, rotten bulkhead, no body (donated it to a Perentie conversion) Got the engine running (leaky fuel cooler allowed water in the fuel) Sold engine/box for more than the whole car! Repaired the bulkhead. Chassis is mint. It came with the Perentie tub. Sold it for a Grand. Swapped the alloys for 130 wide steelies plus $250 my way. Got 5 brand new Bridgestone Duelers 225 95 16 for $400! (factory fit on Toyota Troopies, people drive their new car straight to the tyre shop for new 35's so 225's always cropping up cheap) Bought a clean D1 with dodgey brakes, pulled the engine and 'box and sold the rest for $500 more than I paid! Had to buy a job lot of 4 Series Rovers, S2, 2 S3's and a Stage 1. Already well in profit after selling the Stagey and some bits. After harvesting the bits I need will sell/scrap what's left. Front springs $100 but I did 2 hours work for them. Rear bags $160, air switches and fittings etc $100. Can sell the Sals for $1000 to a Perentie owner, $200 should buy a D1 axle. I'll do a big shop with one of the UK specialists when I finalize the shopping list! I will start a build thread one day soon.....🤪 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uninformed Posted September 8, 2023 Share Posted September 8, 2023 Other than the diff itself, what does the Sals really offer over the Rover? They share the same size axle shafts, stub axles, wheel bearings, brakes, etc. And while the big cast centre section is stronger than the centre of the Rover housing, where the tubes meet the cast centre in the Sals has proven to be a problem sometimes regarding the 110 version. Its tubes are a touch thinner than the Rover housing, the axle flanges are definitely thinner than the Rover type. Its much harder to properly strengthen a Sals housing, and you have a larger weight deficit to start with. A friend of mine has run built Rover diffs in the rear of his own vehicles for MANY decades. These vehicles not being particularly light, especially his latest. Regardless of choice, shafts are same, either free with housing or both wanting upgrade. Yes the Rover should have a HD hemisphere of choice, but the Rover stuff to buy second hand is a fair bit cheaper too. Ill try and weigh a fully braced modified Rover housing I built later today. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted September 9, 2023 Share Posted September 9, 2023 The salisbury is a DANA 60 USA Truck axle, massively strong, with the exception of the half shafts as LR cut costs and didn't buy the massive DANA 35 spline drive side gears and half shafts, instead using LR shafts , ... The 110 are then Homolgated to be a true 3.5 Ton tow truck, swapping axles over would mean its now not strictly "Legal" ....you call. The "Short Nose" differential axle / fitted to late 110s is a horrible unit : https://youtu.be/wZBUpViYyGI 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uninformed Posted September 9, 2023 Share Posted September 9, 2023 Dana 60s were offered in various configurations, with various size/spline axle shafts. It seems that the housing spec falls short on most. NO Dana 60 was made with 5.8mm tubes like the Sals 110. Modified Rover rear housing 43Kg. Rear back brace is 5mm plate, Gwyn Lewis diff pan, 8mm strap under banjo. Rover cast 3rd member with carrier bearing caps NO hemisphere, CW&P etc 12.1Kg 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snagger Posted September 10, 2023 Share Posted September 10, 2023 The 110 Salisbury axle can fail at the diff housing joints - Roamingyak has suffered exactly that last year and has been investigating options on this forum. I have seen a handful of other instances of it, too, but it is rare enough not be be a major concern unless heavy corrosion is noticed or the car is going to be particularly overladen on some especially tough routes. TD5toV8110 has made clear that this 110 will neither be overladen nor attempting the Canning Stock Road, so a standard 110 axle will be ample. However, the Rover axles were found to be too weak, unlike the Salisburys, for MoD use without significant bracing. Yes, the Salisbury may share the same shafts as a Rover rear axle (they look a fair bit sturdier to me on the drum braked version, to be honest), but the rest of the axle is considerably stronger than a standard Rover axle. While a Rover axle can be modified to have sufficient strength for a 110, the cost of doing so would be more than the 7-800AUD difference in standard axle values, so would cost more than the benefit of selling the Salisbury to even the most enthusiastic Perentie owner. A custom length prop shaft would probably cost the bulk of that margin, before diff and shaft upgrades were even considered or axle reinforcing braces bought. That still doesn’t deal with homologation and legality issues in the pernicious state of Oz, nor does it help the next owner of the vehicle, so value would take a huge hit. It just isn’t worth the swap. There are no benefits, but many big problems in changing that plan. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uninformed Posted September 10, 2023 Share Posted September 10, 2023 The reason the P38 rear axle exists in 110/130s is because the Sals was failing in MOD. Of course we are talking the housing. The Sals hemisphere and CW&P are excellent, and the point is more proven by the horrible diff the P38 is, only a 4 pinion hemisphere it’s saving grace. It has been proven that a Rover diff of equivalent hemisphere is stronger than the P38 type. The Sals was first introduced into series due to rear diff failures, housings not so much. They never offered a Rover 4 pin back then. It was a classic case of poor engineering from LR. One of the key elements of good engineering is balance. The Sals is an example of poor balance, an extremely strong diff let down by an average housing and small axle shafts. The Dana 44 would have been a better choice given there was no way LR were going to give us bigger axles. The D44 CW&P are similar in size to the Rover but a superior design that would still exceed the strength of ever 4340 300m 24 spline axles. It would weigh less and have better clearance….. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snagger Posted September 10, 2023 Share Posted September 10, 2023 Internal sleeving of the 110 axle, like the 130, would have been a far better solution than those awful late 110 axles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD5toV8110 Posted September 10, 2023 Author Share Posted September 10, 2023 Perentie people want the axle for the disc brakes. I am going custom tail shaft regardless as the engine/'box is being moved to a non-standard position. My vehicle is being engineered. The certificate stays with the car when sold.... Plenty of mildly modified D1's getting about on stock axles/shafts/diffs... They tend to fail with bigger tyres and abuse... I might be getting a D1 axle tomorrow as part of a trade with the Defender doors. So another $1000 in the pot when I sell the Sals! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snagger Posted September 11, 2023 Share Posted September 11, 2023 Well, good luck with it, and please post up pictures of your progress. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discomikey Posted September 27, 2023 Share Posted September 27, 2023 If you're serious about it you can go " a bit overkill" This one we made for a customer as a one off includes true 35 spline half shafts, and as a result, larger 300M stub axles, larger hub bearings and modified hubs. and of course the ford 9in diff. The A frame was also ditched in favour of Parallel 4 link and panhard rod If you're Weight conscious though I would highly recommend upgrading to Nissan Y61 patrol axles, they're not a great deal heavier than Rover banjo axles and are a damn sight stronger even in standard form. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uninformed Posted September 29, 2023 Share Posted September 29, 2023 While the Ford 9” is strong and especially for its size, I’m not a fan of its large hypoid offset, large thrust loads, and the pinion bearings are essentially back to back. Fortunately it has huge aftermarket support as the factory bits are not much chop. that looks like some nice work there but can’t think why anyone would want to run a panhard if they didn’t have to… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fmmv Posted September 30, 2023 Share Posted September 30, 2023 This might be a stupid question; if so please forgive me. Could someone explain why it is Ok to swap axles, eg the Nissan Patrol suggestion or Mog portals, but not Ok to swap from Sals to Disco? Is it just the weight rating, if so could you not just reduce the gvw? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snagger Posted October 1, 2023 Share Posted October 1, 2023 19 hours ago, fmmv said: This might be a stupid question; if so please forgive me. Could someone explain why it is Ok to swap axles, eg the Nissan Patrol suggestion or Mog portals, but not Ok to swap from Sals to Disco? Is it just the weight rating, if so could you not just reduce the gvw? It’s just the strength of those other axles compared to that of the Discovery/90 axle. The latter will bolt straight on with only the need for a longer prop shaft. But there was good reason that LR didn’t use the RR/Discovery/90 rear axle on the 110, despite the increased costs for having to build two different types for the same suspension and transmission systems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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