steve b Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 There are several people on here using MM hydro winchs on here I think, and as I'm installing my rear MM on my 109sw now its made me think about making a longer drum/ driveshaft. Have any of you done this and if so how did you mod the drive shaft? Another question that I have is do the plastic drum bearings last ok or has anyone replaced (with some machining) these with roller/ball bearings? Finally is it worth fitting a grease nipple to the gearbox or does it not need replenishing regularly? and what sort of grease? waterproof might be good but what sort of wt? cheers Steveb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watson Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 hi steve how are you??? rear winch sounds good!!! is the front winch hydro or pto are you going to run them off the same pump??? josh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve b Posted October 30, 2007 Author Share Posted October 30, 2007 Hi Josh, Yep I'm fine ta , the rear will be off the pto pump and valveblock that powers the front one , switched through a change over valve , so should work well . Having read through the tech archive on here I will also need an overcentre valve to lock the winch in the event of a hose failure. see you sunday cheers Steveb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LandyManLuke Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 why not use two spool valves, then you can use both winches together, if you need to. Are you worried about not being able to have the pump in gear when in reverse? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiWhite Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 I looked at lengthening the drum on my MM when I was rebuilding it and the conclusion I came to was that it wouldn't be worth the bother. Drum lengthening is no problem, but the drive shaft is quite a bit of kit and would cost a lot to have made. Interested to hear your thoughts about using a switchover valve as opposed to a twin lever spool valve. I've got a switchover valve here and am trying to decide whether to use that or a twinstick spool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve b Posted October 30, 2007 Author Share Posted October 30, 2007 Are you worried about not being able to have the pump in gear when in reverse? Not with this install on the 109sw as this is my daily drive , when I put the MM's on the 90 it will be a crank driven pump, more suited to challenge/ raid use. The 109 is only used for marshalling playdays and greenlaning/ overland travel(hopefully).... although having said that I'm hoping to enter tourist on next year's Ladoga with it As for twin lever vs change over Si & Luke , I've gone for changeover as I've already got a remote cable operated in/out valve under the floor and felt again because of the overall package a 12v leccy c/o valve would work ok. The 90 will be twin lever for comp use though...aahh I love the smell of a vapour build in the evening . Also & not least this way is relatively cheap to get it up and running to try it out, can always come back to it with an upgrade later. Steveb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
portal pete Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 Hi steve, modified my MM a few months ago. Drum is now twice the width, taller and will hold just over 200ft of 12mm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve b Posted October 30, 2007 Author Share Posted October 30, 2007 Hi Pete, Thats what I've had in mind, how did you deal with the shaft ? my conclusion was similar to Siwhites , make a new shaft, which is not out of the question. did you use solid bar for the drum and gun drill it or thick wall CDS tube? looks nice Pete however you've done it. What motor is that? cheers Steveb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orgasmic Farmer Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 Is anyone using a joystick control like a JCB or a front-end loader to control 2 winches simultaneously. Would take a little bit of getting used to but would be good when mastered for those awkward manoeuvre's when taking in or out on both at the same time! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LandyManLuke Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 Hi steve, modified my MM a few months ago. Drum is now twice the width, taller and will hold just over 200ft of 12mm. That's a rather tasty drum Is anyone using a joystick control like a JCB or a front-end loader to control 2 winches simultaneously. I'm planning on just having three spool valves, with relatively short levers, so it'd be possible to use two at a time, though i think the chance of using them simultanously would be slim, i think my brain, and co driver, would struggle to keep up. the third spool will be for a PTO type setup, so possibly a hydraulic ram/jack, or a remote slave set of valves, for a log splitter perhaps (not for comps , multi-functional use of hydraulics ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
portal pete Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 The winch is the H12 with the type R motor, i used 12mm wall CDS machined down to 6mm at the ends to allow it to slide inside the original tube upto the end plates. I drilled the original tube at 8 points each end, puddle welded through and two main welds in the middle. The shafts we made from scratch. I had alot of trouble drilling the original tube, not sure what grade it is but its very tough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Spot Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 I use a two spool set up for my front & rear winches, the price of the twin spool was no more than buying a diverter valve set up. If you had a problem with a spool or motor hose you can just swap the pipes and use the other spool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kkk2 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 Why not use electric solenoids? we use these and have only a normal switch on the dash/front of the truck to operate the winch (just like the electric boys) , does away with levers and cables, and is pretty bulletproof too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LandyManLuke Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 and only gives you on/off control. I quite fancy the full proportional control a spool valve gives. Also, it's less complicated components in the system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orgasmic Farmer Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 The joystick controls in my JCB digger are electrical but allow full proportional control. Such a setup would allow extremely finely controlled movements in all possible combinations i.e., in-in, in-out, out-in and out-out (as well as individual control of course). You could even have a rocker switch on the top for a 3rd service that could control a central winch for those real hard to get punches . The more I think about it the more I reckon it would be a goer (albeit a rather expensive one!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve b Posted October 31, 2007 Author Share Posted October 31, 2007 The winch is the H12 with the type R motor, i used 12mm wall CDS machined down to 6mm at the ends to allow it to slide inside the original tube upto the end plates. I drilled the original tube at 8 points each end, puddle welded through and two main welds in the middle. The shafts we made from scratch. I had alot of trouble drilling the original tube, not sure what grade it is but its very tough. Thanks for the replies all , did you heat treat the new shaft Pete? any pics of the shaft before building it in? also did you increase the dia at all to reduce any risk of whip/increase torsional rigidity over the extra length? Orgasmic Farmer - a joy stick control- now I hadn't considered that , that is now on the list of options for the 90 would take a bit of practice getting used to it but would be very effective I think KKK2 as Luke said I prefer the manual control for proportional control, its what I've been used to for years...maybe I should try someone's truck with leccy valves to see how it feels Old spot going slightly OT what class did you enter on the Ladoga this year, and with what vehicle? Are you hoping to enter next year? thanks again for all the replies , keep it coming cheers Steveb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollythelw Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 Alans got a leccy solenoid block that allows front and rear winches to be controlled at the same time, Ive got the old style in or out and a changeover valve (always found it simple enough to use) - the reason I went solenoid was twofold 1) multiple control points around the vehicle without routing belden cables 2) easier for me to house the valve block remotely (kinda short of real estate) The lack of proportional control has never actually proved a hinderence in practice, speed control for me is simply a question of how hard I press on the loud pedal (its a fine enough control to pull dents and straighten bodywork out of friends cars) I wouldnt bother with a gearbox grease nipple - the gearbox gets a clean out once every blue moon and filled with a good snot full of axle grease. The main bearing is worth keeping new, the more scratched up they get the more drag they cause, pay attention to the grade of grease on this - thinner grease equals less drag. I hone the casing and bed a new one in before it goes out to play. I think its EN32 Pete - I cant see MM splashing out on 36 really nice work by the way Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve b Posted October 31, 2007 Author Share Posted October 31, 2007 Hi Jez, Hope all is well with you and Protoprincess, are your drums wider on Petals winchs? and what do you think about the mainshaft being heat treated? or possibly even forged on the std winch , it is certainly chunky . I can see your point about leccy valves and remote control on Petal for what you do with her , and as you say its very controllable on the loud pedal , is your pump drive 1:1 off the crank with the flailing chains of death ? Cheers Steveb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LandyManLuke Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 The lack of proportional control has never actually proved a hinderence in practice, speed control for me is simply a question of how hard I press on the loud pedal (its a fine enough control to pull dents and straighten bodywork out of friends cars) Interesting, i wonder how price compares. the one big downer of spools was the lack of multiple operating points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewis Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 The joystick controls in my JCB digger are electrical but allow full proportional control. Mark, are you sure its not a hydraulic servo control as opposed to electrical? What model is the machine? if you dont mind my asking Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollythelw Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 Hi Steve, to date yep - 1:1 crank to pump, flailing chains of death, no probs whatsoever, Petals drums are deep dish flavour which makes the whole setup sit neatly within the rails of a landy. With the sheer physical size of a MM mainshaft IMO EN32 or 36 isnt going to notice the torque output of the motor, HT and tempering is never going to be a bad thing to do new toy next season though more speed, more power, easier to use, less space. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewis Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 new toy next season though more speed, more power, easier to use, less space. Are you planning to sell the Milemarker setup once you have fitted your new system? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollythelw Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 yep Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lewis Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 You have a price in mind? And will you be starting the refusals que soon? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dollythelw Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 if it goes then it goes with Petal its not a done deal yet though, if she does come back to the UK then I'll break the front winch off and we can go from there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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