Overhead / Gantry / Travelling / Bridge Crane

[Astro_Al]

I'm looking to put in an overhead crane - the type that rolls along a rigid/fixed I-beam framework.

I don't mean a gantry frame on wheels, I mean a trolley running on I-beams, like this:

Has anyone done this?

Anyone know a source for the various bits - heavy duty runners and such?

Oh, and who has a shed load of I-beam they don't need?

Any ideas / advice welcome!

Cheers, Al.

[Night Train]

I think you can buy most of the bits on Ebay. They are fairly simple things but the wall mounted beams need to be both level and parallel. In your photo the beams are held up on legs, some I have seen are on corbels set into the wall.

The winch cradle/hanger needs to run on tapered rollers to match the webs on the RSJ. Some of these are just rollers and others have a chain runner that drives the rig along the RSJ. These are available at Machine Mart as well as Ebay.

If you have a mains lead to the winch then you can make some giant curtain rings around the RSJ and then cable tie the flex to the rings so that it is near full stretch at one extreme of travel and nicely bundled up at the other, like opening and closing curtains.

[Astro_Al]

Thanks Nighttrain.

I think I may have hit upon a prob... I was trying to see if one 'device' could cover an area roughly 20m x 20m. Anyone know the maximum length of an RSJ???

Cheers, Al.

[Guest WALFY]

20m RSJ . That would have to be of a massive X section to be able to lift anything of use. You should be able to get I beams in any length but I think that long is hoping a bit

A bit of research says that beams come in 15.3m lengths.

Universal Beams

BS EN 10025 Fe/430B / S275JR

Also available in grade 50: BS EN 10025 Fe510 / S355

depth

width

web

flange

root radius

Size (mm) kg/m Lengths Available (metres) D mm B mm t mm T mm r mm 127 x 76 13 (8.0) (9.5) (11.0) (12.2) (14.0) (15.3) 127.0 76.0 4.0 7.6 7.6 152 x 89 16 (8.0) (11.0) (12.2) (14.0) (15.3) 152.4 88.7 4.5 7.7 7.6 178 x 102 19 (8.0) (11.0) (12.2) (14.0) (15.3) 177.8 101.2 4.7 7.9 7.6 203 x 102 23 (8.0) (9.5) (11.0) (12.2) (14.0) (15.3) 203.2 101.8 5.4 9.3 7.6 203 x 133 25 (8.0) (11.0) (12.2) (14.0) (15.3) 203.2 133.2 5.8 7.8 7.6 30 (8.0) (11.0) (12.2) (14.0) (15.3) 206.8 133.8 6.3 9.6 7.6 254 x 102 22 (8.0) (11.0) (12.2) (14.0) (15.3) 254.0 101.6 5.8 6.8 7.6 25 (8.0) (11.0) (12.2) (14.0) (15.3) 257.2 101.9 6.1 8.4 7.6 28 (8.0) (11.0) (12.2) (14.0) (15.3) 260.4 102.1 6.4 10.0 7.6 254 x 146 31 (9.5) (12.2) (15.3) 251.4 146.1 6.1 8.6 7.6 37 (9.5) (12.2) (15.3) 256.0 146.4 6.4 10.9 7.6 43 (12.2) (15.3) 259.6 147.3 7.3 12.7 7.6 305 x 102 25 (12.2) (15.3) 305.1 101.6 5.8 7.0 7.6 28 (12.2) (15.3) 308.7 101.8 6.1 8.9 7.6 33 (12.2) (15.3) 312.7 102.4 6.6 10.8 7.6 305 x 127 37 (12.2) (15.3) 304.4 123.4 7.2 10.7 8.9 42 (12.2) (15.3) 307.2 124.3 8.0 12.1 8.9 48 (12.2) (15.3) 311.0 125.2 8.9 14.0 8.9 305 x 165 40 (8.0) (9.5) (11.0) (12.2) (14.0) (15.3) 303.4 165.1 6.1 10.2 8.9 46 (8.0) (9.5) (11.0) (12.2) (14.0) (15.3) 306.6 165.7 6.7 11.8 8.9 54 (8.0) (11.0) (12.2) (14.0) (15.3) 310.4 166.8 7.9 13.7 8.9 356 x 127 33 (12.2) (15.3) 349.0 125.4 5.9 8.5 10.2 39 (12.2) (15.3) 353.4 126.0 6.6 10.7 10.2 356 x 171 45 (8.0) (11.0) (12.2) (14.0) (15.3) 351.4 171.0 6.9 9.7 10.2 51 (8.0) (11.0) (12.2) (14.0) (15.3) 355.0 171.5 7.3 11.5 10.2 57 (8.0) (11.0) (12.2) (14.0) (15.3) 358.0 172.1 8.0 13.0 10.2 67 (8.0) (11.0) (12.2) (14.0) (15.3) 363.4 173.2 9.1 15.7 10.2 406 x 140 39 (12.2) (15.3) 398.0 141.8 6.3 8.6 10.2 46 (12.2) (15.3) 403.2 142.4 6.9 11.2 10.2 406 x 178 54 (8.0) (11.0) (12.2) (14.0) (15.3) 402.6 177.6 7.6 10.9 10.2 60 (8.0) (11.0) (12.2) (14.0) (15.3) 406.4 177.8 7.8 12.8 10.2 67 (8.0) (11.0) (12.2) (14.0) (15.3) 409.4 178.8 8.8 14.3 10.2 74 (12.2) (15.3) 412.8 179.7 9.7 16.0 10.2 457 x 152 52 (12.2) (15.3) 449.8 152.4 7.6 10.9 10.2 60 (12.2) (15.3) 454.7 152.9 8.0 13.3 10.2 67 (12.2) (15.3) 458.0 153.8 9.0 15.0 10.2 74 (12.2) (15.3) 462.0 154.5 9.6 17.0 10.2 82 (12.2) (15.3) 465.8 155.3 10.5 18.9 10.2 457 x 191 67 (12.2) (15.3) 453.4 189.9 8.5 12.7 10.2 74 (12.2) (15.3) 457.0 190.5 9.1 14.5 10.2 82 (12.2) (15.3) 460.0 191.3 9.9 16.0 10.2 89 (12.2) (15.3) 463.6 192.0 10.6 17.7 10.2 98 (12.2) (15.3) 467.2 192.8 11.4 19.6 10.2 533 x 210 82 (12.2) (15.3) 528.3 208.7 9.6 13.2 12.7 92 (12.2) (15.3) 533.1 209.3 10.2 15.6 12.7 101 (12.2) (15.3) 536.7 210.1 10.9 17.4 12.7 109 (12.2) (15.3) 539.5 210.7 11.6 18.8 12.7 122 (12.2) (15.3) 544.6 211.9 12.8 21.3 12.7 610 x 229 101 (12.2) (15.3) 602.2 227.6 10.6 14.8 12.7 113 (12.2) (15.3) 607.6 228.2 11.2 17.3 12.7 125 (12.2) (15.3) 612.2 229.0 11.9 19.6 12.7 140 (12.2) (15.3) 617.2 230.2 13.1 22.1 12.7 610 x 305 149 (12.2) (15.3) 612.4 304.8 11.8 19.7 16.5 179 (12.2) (15.3) 620.2 307.1 14.1 23.6 16.5 238 (12.2) (15.3) 635.8 311.4 18.4 31.4 16.5 For further details please contact the Steel Shop orderline on 01509 556677

[LandyManLuke]

I think I may have hit upon a prob... I was trying to see if one 'device' could cover an area roughly 20m x 20m.

Having seen quite a few similar cranes in steel warehouses etc, covering maybe 20m x 100m, the 20m unsupported beam was a good 500mm tall, I'm guessing that'd cut down on ceiling/head clearance, unless you've a particulary tall building.

As said, the hangers/rollers/chain hosts regularly turn up on ebay, with test certs, for not too much money.

[Turbocharger]

Al, really - have you thought of building a vehicle?

My dear father put an overhead crane in our barn at home - think 'rustic aesthetic'. It was two rolled C-section beams which had a lip on both sides - this is bolted facing downwards with two bearings on a carriage which sit inside the beam and rest on the rolled lips. These two suspend a box section beam on two bolts, and this had a wraparound carriage which carries a WW2 bomb hoist. It's a bit Heath Robinson, but it's installed five engines and several gearboxes.

[Steve Hiatt]

Thanks Nighttrain.

I think I may have hit upon a prob... I was trying to see if one 'device' could cover an area roughly 20m x 20m.

Yeah, it's called a forklift

[unclebill1]

Yeah, it's called a forklift

Very definately a forklift.

I drive a gantry crane at work and to get a half decent load capacity over 20m you are talking a deep section beam, structural engineer will do figures.

I used to install overhead handling systems for various machinery, forklifts parts, engines etc and generally a beam to carry a reasonable load has to be supported every five metres, therefore it would become fixed.

If you are determined to go this route have a look at a company called Lindaptor, they have some very useful fittings for clamping steel beams.

Oh and let us know where it'll be, that way I can avoid walking under it??????????

Bill

[muddy]

A decent old forklift can be had for 500-1000 al, this would mean you can start using pallets aswell as being able to unload in a yard and will be able to take it with you if you ever move premises.

We have a yard forklift and a telehandler, with a flyjib for the tele and a basic I beam jib for the forklift i have taken out a few engines and gearboxs this way and its very easy.

Will.

[smo]

You could do it Al, in 2 sections tho 10m for each, the beams the cross beam runs on can be supported properly without intruding too much, with some clever engineering you could support a central beam @ 10m (thus dividing the workshop in 2) from above.

[Astro_Al]

Thanks for all the great replies.

I had thought about a forklift, but I have a few reservations. Its easier to manipulate something with the crane (rotate, jog left/right etc), plus a forklift is another vehicle to maintain, and is probably slightly more risky as I'm there alone, also you don't get such a flexible viewpoint and awkward shape/large loads are less easy to handle. Also, its probably easier to make a crane to take decent weight than find a forklift to take the same amount. (I haven't decided on a target capacity yet, but ideally milling machines etc would be within capacity).

The obvious advantages are zero 'installation' hassle and it can be driven outside etc, but then I have a big roller shutter door anyway, so stuff can always be driven inside.

Hmmm.

Muddy - its a good point, but I don't I anticipate moving on for a while. I'll never find something this big/cheap/well located. Plus I have to invest in concrete and leccy installation, so that'll make me reluctant to move.

I could certainly live with a 15m span, travelling 20 m across the workshop. I can find lots of things to put in the other 5m. Thanks for the specs Walfy - at least I know it exists now!

Looks like I'd need one killer beam to do the 15m span, and the two parallel tracks running the other way could be far more modest with plenty of space for supports (blockwork pillars???).

Regarding the hoist - anyone know if you can just use a leccy winch vertically?

Smo - yeah, I was trying to avoid having to swap between 'lifting devices' and have the whole area covered by 1 thing. I don't want to lose the big central space, so pillars mid-way are no good, though there is plenty of height for poncy structures above it (and a very tall beam, Luke).

Turbo - vehicles are quite far down the list right now! Come on then - lets see a piccy.

The next question is - how do I lift the crane into place?!?

I shall keep thinking! Ta so far.

Al.

[FridgeFreezer]

Al, for the money and hassle I'd vote for a forklift - you can get them big enough to lift a loaded shipping container so I think capacity-wise you should be OK. A standard pallet is up to 1 ton. Add a beam or something on the forks with some manipulation device and you've got all the control you'd have with an I-beam but much more portable, and re-sellable if you ever do move. I don't think an old fork lift would take much maintenance, especially with occasional use - they work 24/7 in warehouses for years.

There's also the options of old telehandlers, or even an excavator - they can lift a fair bit with the arm, and what a cool toy to have kicking about

The other alternative is just buy a Hiab and stick it on your Unimog - then you have a vehicle that can collect, move, and install heavy stuff in one. Of course, that would mean you'd have to get the Mog going first...

Once you've got a gantry in that workshop it's only going to be coming out again as scrap metal.

[bishbosh]

Al,

Take a look at the Corus Blue Book HERE.

It gives buckling capacities for beams based on effective length (your span).

Note, these capacities are for static loads, not the dynamic loads you would experience with a crane.

Note also that the safety factors used in determining these capacities are based on building design, not crane design.

To determine your design moment, use M = P x L / 4

Where P is your desired crane load in kilo Newtons and L is the span in metres.

One metric tonne = 9.81kN.

You will also have to check shear, and combined bending and shear, but you'll have to get your pencil out for those. The tables will at least give you an idea of the size of beam you will need.

I have deliberately avoided suggesting any safety factors to use as I think that is up to you.

Good luck, and here's hoping you buy a fork lift!

[freeagent]

our Gantry crane at work has around a 15m span, the main beam is around 800mm high and weighs tonnes... (although ours has a 15T SWL, so is a bit of a beast anyway)

It was lifted into place by a HUGE truck mounted Hiab crane, and i seem to remember we had to remove some of the roof to get it in..

I'd give it a swerve... you'll get a reasonable old forklift for a grand, and a usable old Tele-handler for 2.5k, they are so much more use than a gantry crane, and easy to shift on if you need cash/ want something bigger/ smaller.

[LandyManLuke]

If you've got the height, and can come a bit thinner (10-15?) to get the size of the beam down, I'd say go for it.

the next problem to solve, as i see it, is powering the 10-15m gantry, I don't know what sort of money you're looking at for a couple of motors/gearboxes etc to move it along in a parallel motion - maybe that's where your budget will meet/exceed the cost of a forklift?

Fwiw, I can definitely see the advantage of a gantry crane once you've got a workshop full of finished vehicles tools, access/manouvering space that you'd have to allow for with a fork lift wouldn't be an issue.

Afaik, you won't be allowed (h&s etc) to use a pulling winch for lifting, it'll need to be a proper lifting winch with a cable stop etc.

[Guest WALFY]

H & S. Only applies when you have 5 or more people in your employment on a specific site. I know that I don't need a H & S policy for any site I'm working on if I have less than 5 blokes

[muddy]

Al our small yard forklift was 700 IIRC it has an isuzu 4 pot and we all know how relaible they are, it has a full free lift, sideshift and lifts 3 tons easily up to about 4m you really dont need much space due to the excellent lock (turning within its own length).

Although a HIAB sounds cool:)

Could you have one or two swinging jib cranes like they had on docks and railway stations orperating in crossing arcs?

A telehandler aint much cop in a building as you dont get much headroom vs actual lifted height due to the design of the boom not to mention that a telehandler is carp for laterel placement once it gets a bit tight due to it being twice as wide as the pallets etc. (can you tell i operate both in a confined area )

a 360 would be no use it will chew your floor up and a midi on rubbers wont lift, a backhoe is ok but are a pain to get in and out of for checking positions, IMHO a small forklift with an I beam on a pivot and ram so it can slew side to side (no more than 30-40 degres past the centerline due to stability options) would be cool, also you can lift a vehicle onto stands with the forklift and then remove the axles as they rest on the forks, try doing that with a gantry.

Will.

[sheltie50]

Im ASNT level 2 with many years on lifting equipment---

Walfy has a point but how would he feel if the lift gear failed !!

What you require must be designed correctly by people who can be held liable, expect cost to be high, if you intend to install this into an existing building cand the structure support such a device?

PULL WINCHES ARE NOT THE SAME AS LIFT WINCHES, might look alike but beware.

We use a mobile crane which can lift 2 Tons, it can go anywhere and even lift from the side of any vehicle.

Major question-- do you require insurance on said item if so do not consider self build !!!

Be sure of any items you build in the crazy world we have built !!!!