ciderman Posted August 19, 2009 Share Posted August 19, 2009 Can anyone confirm if the Defender 90 Hard top is classed as a car derived van or not ?? No speculations please just definate answers ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveG Posted August 19, 2009 Share Posted August 19, 2009 NO Too heavy I assume you want to know ref speed limits Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ciderman Posted August 19, 2009 Author Share Posted August 19, 2009 Cheers Steve , Yes that was the answer I was looking for , I wonder how many defender drivers actualy know the legal speed limits their vehicles are allowed to travel . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Top90 Posted August 19, 2009 Share Posted August 19, 2009 I doubt many do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoggyN Posted August 19, 2009 Share Posted August 19, 2009 If I remember correctly Land Rovers are classified as 'dual purpose vehicles' (possibly excepting the big 127s and 130s). Normal passenger car speed limits apply DUAL PURPOSE VEHICLE A vehicle constructed or adapted for the carriage of both passengers and of goods or burden of any description, being a vehicle of which the unladen weight does not exceed 2040 kg., and which either: (i) is so constructed or adapted that the driving power of the engine is, or by the appropriate use of the controls of the vehicle can be, transmitted to all the wheels of the vehicle; Or (ii) satisfies the following conditions as to construction, namely: (a) the vehicle must be permanently fitted with a rigid roof, with or without a sliding panel; (b) the area of the vehicle to the rear of the driver's seat must: (i) be permanently fitted with at least one row of transverse seats (fixed or folding) for two or more passengers and those seats must be properly sprung or cushioned and provided with upholstered back-rests, attached either to the seats or to a side or the floor of the vehicle; and (ii) be lit on each side and at the rear by a window or windows of glass or other transparent material having an area or aggregate area of not less than 1850 square centimetres on each side and not less than 770 square centimetres at the rear; and © the distance between the rearmost part of the steering wheel and the back-rests of the row of transverse seats satisfying the requirements specified in head (i) of sub- paragraph (b) (or, if there is more than one such row of seats, the distance between the rearmost part of the steering wheel and the back-rests of the rearmost such row) must, when the seats are ready for use, be not less than one-third of the distance between the rearmost part of the steering wheel and the rearmost part of the floor of the vehicle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruuman Posted August 20, 2009 Share Posted August 20, 2009 Cheers Steve , Yes that was the answer I was looking for , I wonder how many defender drivers actualy know the legal speed limits their vehicles are allowed to travel . as fast as it will go Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CURLY Posted August 20, 2009 Share Posted August 20, 2009 as fast as it will go 60's about top whack in my old 2.5 td, so i'll be ok! LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickeyw Posted August 20, 2009 Share Posted August 20, 2009 NO Too heavy I assume you want to know ref speed limits Steve Education time please... My 90 hard top says 'light van' on the log book. I have (maybe ignorantly) always assumed 70mph was the legal limit for such a vehicle on appropriate roads, m/ways etc. And 60 mph if towing downhill, and like Ruuman says if towing uphill It may have been known to go somewhat faster than this maybe once Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn Posted August 20, 2009 Share Posted August 20, 2009 panel vans, such as a ford transit, are allowed to do 70 on motorways, 60 on NSL dual carridgeways and 50 on NSL single carridgeways iirc. I'm really not sure how this applies to a landrover, because as said above, they often come under Dual Purpose Vehicles. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveG Posted August 20, 2009 Share Posted August 20, 2009 If I remember correctly Land Rovers are classified as 'dual purpose vehicles' (possibly excepting the big 127s and 130s). Normal passenger car speed limits apply Sorry but this statement is incorrect. I looked into all of this last year. You can read it here.. http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roadsafety/speedmanagement/vanspeedlimits Dual Purpose Vehicles have no exceptions for speed limits, just for MOT. By the way, Dual Purpose Vehicle definition is being removed by Dft at end of 2009 so MOT classes will change for a lot of Defenders. Cheers Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exmoor Beast Posted August 20, 2009 Share Posted August 20, 2009 Oh botheration, I take it mines a van then???? Not that I ever see a Police car or a camera around here anyway... Will Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazelle Posted August 20, 2009 Share Posted August 20, 2009 From my discussions with TFL about the Low Emissions zone, it would appear that Defender hard tops are classified as either a van or a car depending on how they left the factory. CSW, with factory fitted seats are classed as Cars; Hard tops with no seats are classed as Vans. The confusion with TFL was related to the fact that the defender is built on a commercial base - hence why it can get away with no air bags and minimal crumple zones. Hence they were (wrongly) classing all defenders as vans. I am happy to be proved wrong on this! Martin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LR90 Posted August 20, 2009 Share Posted August 20, 2009 So glad mine is clearly a three seater, aluminium bodied, turbo charged convertable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxtherotti Posted August 20, 2009 Share Posted August 20, 2009 Oh botheration, I take it mines a van then???? Not that I ever see a Police car or a camera around here anyway... Will slightly ot but i love that defender!!!!!!!! rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoggyN Posted August 20, 2009 Share Posted August 20, 2009 Sorry but this statement is incorrect. I looked into all of this last year. You can read it here.. http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roadsafety/speedmanagement/vanspeedlimits Dual Purpose Vehicles have no exceptions for speed limits, just for MOT. By the way, Dual Purpose Vehicle definition is being removed by Dft at end of 2009 so MOT classes will change for a lot of Defenders. Cheers Steve I disagree. That link was for vans, not dual purpose vehicles. If the exemptions for dual purpose vehicles applied to just MoTs and not speed limits, they would not be specifcally mentioned in Section 86 (1) and Schedule 6 of the Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984 which defines speed limits for certain classes of vehicle. See here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lrfarmer Posted August 20, 2009 Share Posted August 20, 2009 well all i can say is the my 90 is a van and dosen't get driven much faster than 50mph most of the time and 50mph when towing never happens Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 Hmm hoggys link is interesting... But confusing at the same time: A passenger vehicle, motor caravan or dual-purpose vehicle not drawing a trailer being a vehicle with an unladen weight exceeding 3·05 tonnes or adapted to carry more than 8 passengers: (i) if not exceeding 12 metres in overall length 70 60 50 Does that mean if its "dual-purpose" but over 3.05T then it comes under the lower speeds? It doesnt provide figures for normal passenger cars, or dual purpose vehicles under 3.05T though? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoggyN Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 Hmm hoggys link is interesting... But confusing at the same time: I agree. Apologies. Perhaps this link will clarify the situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoarebag Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 Hmm hoggys link is interesting... But confusing at the same time: A passenger vehicle, motor caravan or dual-purpose vehicle not drawing a trailer being a vehicle with an unladen weight NOT(?)exceeding 3·05 tonnes or adapted to carry more than 8 passengers: (i) if not exceeding 12 metres in overall length 70 60 50 I'd say that there's a not missing in there before exceeding... However my 110 van surely falls under this:- . (1) A goods vehicle having a maximum laden weight not exceeding 7·5 tonnes and which is not—(a) an articulated vehicle, or(b) drawing a trailer, or© a car-derived van 70 60 50 If it is a car derived van then it's still 70 60 50 anyhow so no problem as far as i can see. just have to remember to only do 50 on single caridgeway... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoggyN Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 Here's another link that would imply that light 4x4s are subject to the same speed limits as normal cars. Is my van a goods vehicle? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveG Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 Jase, it's not a car derived van - fact. The 90 hardtop is too heavy to be classed as one. Cheers Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveG Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 Here's another link that would imply that light 4x4s are subject to the same speed limits as normal cars. Is my van a goods vehicle? Sorry but that link doesn't imply anything. Show a Dft document that shows there is a speed limit exception for Dual Purpose Vehicles. Also as stated before, Dual Purpose Vehicle definition ceases on 1st January 2010. Have a read here on VOSA's latest newsletter, especially last paragraph .....VOSA August 2009 Another point to note is that all goods vehicles – even those classed as dual purpose vehicles– are subject to reduced speed limits on single and dual carriageways. So, irrespective of your arguments, they are no good come 2010, and in the meantime, unless you can provide proof from Dft, speed limits for all Defenders apart from Station Wagons are 50mph on single carriageway, 60 on Dual and 70 on motorways. Cheers Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bull Bar Cowboy Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 Sorry but that link doesn't imply anything. Show a Dft document that shows there is a speed limit exception for Dual Purpose Vehicles. Also as stated before, Dual Purpose Vehicle definition ceases on 1st January 2010. Have a read here on VOSA's latest newsletter, especially last paragraph .....VOSA August 2009 So, irrespective of your arguments, they are no good come 2010, and in the meantime, unless you can provide proof from Dft, speed limits for all Defenders apart from Station Wagons are 50mph on single carriageway, 60 on Dual and 70 on motorways. Cheers Steve Steve is absolutely right ........... certainly 90 van's and truck cabs are classed as light commercials (or LGV's) so are subject to the correct speed limits. I was very conscious of this and got pulled many times (usually by Somerset & Avon or Wiltshire) on the A303 when I was commuting from Devon to Hampshire, however, I always got off with a friendly warning and never once got a ticket, but of course there could be other reasons for that ............ ISTR there was some dispute over the 90 CSW being classed as a DPV due to the rear seats being side facing. Ian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 "LGV" is Large Goods Vehicle and encompasses most trucks over 7.5T including artics. A defender is not LGV. Its PLG, (Private and Light Goods) just like a transit van or a ford fiesta! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoggyN Posted August 21, 2009 Share Posted August 21, 2009 Have a read here on VOSA's latest newsletter, especially last paragraph .....VOSA August 2009 Interesting, but rather at odds with this... Ask the Police So, irrespective of your arguments, they are no good come 2010, Why? VOSA are only saying that the definition 'dual purpose vehicle' is going to be removed from the Motor Vehicles (Tests) Regulations. The confusion grows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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