sweety Posted December 27, 2009 Share Posted December 27, 2009 Hi guy's wondering if you could give me some advise. I developed a tappet noise on my D2 V8 last month. Took it to a LR specialist who have replaced the tappets & 10 cam followers as they had wear on them. The next day when I started it up the tappet noise was back again so am stumped what it could be. It go's off after a few miles once the engine has warmed up but tonight i'm sure I could just hear it after a 7 mile round trip (engine was switched of for 1/2 whilst out) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragorn Posted December 27, 2009 Share Posted December 27, 2009 New tappets fitted to an old (ie worn) camshaft isnt recommended on these engines, and can result in premature failure of the new tappets and/or camshaft. As for the noise, i doubt the new tappets could have failed that quickly, so its more likely theres an oil pressure issue stopping them pressurising properly, or some other issue that sounds like tappets but isnt, like a blowing exhaust manifold gasket or something? Can you perhaps try and isolate the tapping noise to a particular area of the engine, using a long metal screwdriver or similar to carry the noise? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BogMonster Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 Mine is 7 years old and has been making a faint noise since about a year old that sounds like a tappet but probably isn't - it isn't there on cold start, appears after about 30 sec and then quietens down as the engine gets hot but is always audible with the windows down. I gave up worrying about it probably 5 years ago! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThreeSheds Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 I had a steadily worsening tappet noise on start-up which would go away after a few tens of seconds, sometimes a minute or so, but since it was an old knackered engine I wasn't unduly worried. After a long period without running the engine during extensive bodywork repairs, I decided to flush the system: I used a double dose of Forte motor flush with a cheap (£4.99) 20w50 and then changed the oil and filter again. WOW! Two things are apparent, firstly that the tappet noise disappears much quicker (maybe 2 seconds) and doesn't come back when hot, and secondly that the Forte flush stuff REALLY works! You should have seen the cr@p that came out of the sump 3000 miles later when I drained the oil due to a head gasket failure it was still lovely and clean! Anyway - all that dribble above is a preamble to saying that it might be worth trying a flush and oil change... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweety Posted December 28, 2009 Author Share Posted December 28, 2009 Thanks will give a flush a try & I want to change the oil anyway just to be sure incase the service history isn't quiet right. What is the best grade of oil to used in these engines 10W40 or something thiner like 5W30 ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BogMonster Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 The D2 V8s are supposed to run on 5w30 synthetic according to the book, but I run mine on 15w40 mineral oil with no problems, largely because it is 1/4 of the price and worked fine in the old V8s so I see no reason why it won't work in the Thor engine which is basically the same thing from the neck down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bull Bar Cowboy Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 Hi guy's wondering if you could give me some advise. I developed a tappet noise on my D2 V8 last month. Took it to a LR specialist who have replaced the tappets & 10 cam followers as they had wear on them. The next day when I started it up the tappet noise was back again so am stumped what it could be. It go's off after a few miles once the engine has warmed up but tonight i'm sure I could just hear it after a 7 mile round trip (engine was switched of for 1/2 whilst out) This engine does not have tappets and cam followers ……… it has hydraulic lifters which do the same job. Either your specialist is very incompetent or full of Bullsh!t ……………on most engines that use this cam arrangement, the lifters should never be changed without the cam ….. i.e. they are changed as a pair, so the grease monkeys should have changed the cam and all 16 lifters ………….I would fully expect the replaced lifters to wear very badly in the next 20 - 30K (the lifter face will ‘dish’) Are you really sure its lifter noise ? ………. A leaking exhaust manifold gasket sounds exactly the same as a tapping lifter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missingsid Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 How loud is the noise? Mine started as a light tappet noise then became a load CLACK like a hammer blow from inside the engine. I doubt yours is that loud or you would have stopped using it. But mine is a stuck valve. Marc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweety Posted December 28, 2009 Author Share Posted December 28, 2009 The sound is a rattly tappet noise the exhaust manifold gaskets etc have all been changed when the followers were replaced so was the head gaskets due to the drivers side one leaking at the back of the engine. Another thing that happened on xmas day & has just happened again tonight is when I started the engine up it sounded as if it had a misfire but cleared once the revs got up & this has only happened since the head gaskets & cam followers have been replaced Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybrid_From_Hell Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 This engine does not have tappets and cam followers ……… it has hydraulic lifters which do the same job. Either your specialist is very incompetent or full of Bullsh!t ……………on most engines that use this cam arrangement, the lifters should never be changed without the cam ….. i.e. they are changed as a pair, so the grease monkeys should have changed the cam and all 16 lifters ………….I would fully expect the replaced lifters to wear very badly in the next 20 - 30K (the lifter face will ‘dish’) Are you really sure its lifter noise ? ………. A leaking exhaust manifold gasket sounds exactly the same as a tapping lifter. ^^^ Just read this and BBC is 101% right also what oil is in the engine ? Make and spec Nige Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missingsid Posted December 28, 2009 Share Posted December 28, 2009 The sound is a rattly tappet noise the exhaust manifold gaskets etc have all been changed when the followers were replaced so was the head gaskets due to the drivers side one leaking at the back of the engine. Another thing that happened on xmas day & has just happened again tonight is when I started the engine up it sounded as if it had a misfire but cleared once the revs got up & this has only happened since the head gaskets & cam followers have been replaced That is also how mine started. The valve was staying open then when warm would close OK. Finally it took too long to close and the misfire was permanent. Marc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweety Posted December 28, 2009 Author Share Posted December 28, 2009 Only had it just over 2 months & in that time it spent 2 weeks in the garage getting fix or not as the case is, so don't know what oil is in the engine & it wasn't changed when the work was done on the lifters or head gaskets as they said it looked ok so am going to change it to be sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bull Bar Cowboy Posted December 29, 2009 Share Posted December 29, 2009 Only had it just over 2 months & in that time it spent 2 weeks in the garage getting fix or not as the case is, so don't know what oil is in the engine & it wasn't changed when the work was done on the lifters or head gaskets as they said it looked ok so am going to change it to be sure. To help you, much more info is needed …………………….. So far we know that you have had the car 2 months and ‘a garage’ has spent 2 weeks trying to sort out the engine issues. Do you buy from a garage or private ? ………. If it came from a garage then its up to them to sort it out. The head gasket issue brings a whole new dimension to the engine problems. You say it was leaking at the back of the head ………. Exactly what was leaking ? Does the engine lose any coolant ? ……….. does the top hose pressurise to bulging point when the engine is hot ? To change a head gasket & do work in the valley (lifters) without doing an oil change is extremely shoddy workmanship ……….. doing those jobs, both coolant and other carp will have gone into the sump, regardless of how careful you are. Before you do an engine flush other things have to be considered ……… what is the mileage ? …….. If the mileage is quite high then a ‘forte’ engine flush maybe not such a good idea as it releases much of the hardened carp in the engine and often this finds its way into the lifters…………. Also if the mileage is high does the oil pressure light flicker on idle ? Do the service records show any evidence of previous headgasket / overheating issues ? The misfire you describe is typical of a wet plug due to coolant condensation after the engine has cooled. This indicates that either the headgasket is leaking or there is a cylinder liner issue . The liner issue is reasonably common and often a reason why people sell their car on. If the engine has reasonable miles on it then the oil to use will be a good quality 15 – 40 ………….. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vougese39 Posted December 29, 2009 Share Posted December 29, 2009 very coman on the d2 v8 is the slipped linner problem done 5 engines so far stripoped and top hat linners cures the fault with the heads off look at the linners if they are level with the block ok if it has dropped slightly then it is the problem though usualy it chomps though the head gasket as well. on a point of caution there is a very poor quality rocker arms and followers coming out of land rover at the moment due to britpart now being them main parts supplier to lr so quality at a al time low! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweety Posted December 29, 2009 Author Share Posted December 29, 2009 It has 74K on the clock & from the full service history there hasn't been any thing reported in the book. I bought the D2 from a garage & tried to get the repairs done under warranty but the warranty company has said it's all wear & tear The leak was from the head gasket & it's not using any water from what I can tell but am keeping a close eye on it just incase. The garage did say keep an eye on the coolant lever as there next point of call would be a cracked block but I would have thought they would have been able to notice this or a slipped liner when they removed the heads Oh forgot to say no the oil light never flickers. To day after being out in the D2 on a 20 mile round trip a couple of hours I had to pop out & it started up fine nice & quiet then started tapping as normal & the developed this misfire for about a minute then it cleared not sure if that helps any but the tapping noise went on for about a mile before it eased off & the engine was nice & warn. The only oil flush I seem to be able to get around here is the Wynn's oil flush is this any good ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bull Bar Cowboy Posted December 29, 2009 Share Posted December 29, 2009 OK ….. The term slipped liner is often a misconception and often not visible……. The term cracked block is true and describes the situation very well as the block cracks behind the liner. This can be permanently repaired by an engine rebuild and fitting top hat liners, however, this is expensive if done by a garage as it is labour intensive. You can also use ceramic K seal but this is very hit ‘n’ miss …….. The best engine flush to use is this one http://www.forteuk.co.uk/Advanced_formula.htm Wynns is not in the same league ! The problems you have are NOT fair wear and tear and I would be expecting the seller to sort it out. I would be inclined to take it back and demand they sort it out ………… If you are going to fix it yourself then the correct way will be first to change the cam and lifters …….then try to work out what the other issues are …….. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pw8757 Posted December 29, 2009 Share Posted December 29, 2009 "the warranty company has said it's all wear & tear" Many "warranties" are simply an insurance policy which the purchaser takes out at the time of the transaction. They really do vary in terms of what is covered and what isn't. One thing is for sure - the salesman will wax lyrical about the comprehensive nature of the warranty. The service department will have a different view. I once had the sort of response you have received from a Ford dealership. Fortunately, I was able to go to another dealership, where they test drove the car, told me it needed a new clutch and then I mentioned the warranty, by which time they had to sort it. Generally, reading the document will reveal: What event is covered - ie engine, transmission final drive failure The time period covered The mileage covered What the purchaser must do to keep the warranty valid - very common terms in here are that the vehicle must be serviced at a main dealer (new car warranties) or a "VAT Registered Garage" may also be mentioned. It would be most unusual for the warranty not to cover the type of fault you are describing. "Wear & Tear" should not be the reason given if the fault is a failed gasket or cylinder block/liners. There are truly excellent people who make up the vast majority of the motor trade - let down by those who don't look after their customers........................................... It seems a foot needs to be put down...............! Good luck!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweety Posted December 29, 2009 Author Share Posted December 29, 2009 Contacted the warranty company again about the head gaskets & got told wear & tear also includes degeneration which is what they are saying about the gaskets I also contacted the garage I bought it from & explained what has went on with it since I got it & got told well it's a 9 year old car not a new one so you will have wear & basically don't want to know, so it looks like i'm now stuck with a motor that I can't afford to fix as blown all my savings on getting a so called specialist to fix it & the warranty states it don't cover cracked or porous bores & can't raise another 1.4K plus Thanks guy's you've been a great help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweety Posted December 29, 2009 Author Share Posted December 29, 2009 Sorry to bug you guy's but this is puzzling me. I had no misfire when the gaskets were leaking & before the lifters were replaced, also the tappet noise is now louder after this work has been done but all go's quiet after the engine is up to temp & after a good run. From what i've read the liner prob only knocks away when the engine is warm & not cold Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRecklessEngineer Posted December 29, 2009 Share Posted December 29, 2009 This sounds like a case for the small claims court. It most certainly isn't wear and tear. Should the block be porous/slipper liner then that would make the vehicle unroadworthy - you should be able to get your money back from the seller despite any warranty policy. Where are you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweety Posted December 29, 2009 Author Share Posted December 29, 2009 I'm in Northumberland & bought the D2 from a car dealer in Sunderland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vougese39 Posted December 30, 2009 Share Posted December 30, 2009 firstly go back to the repairer and explain they have not cured the fault and it is worse than before and see what they are going to do Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.