Changing Oils.

[tweetyduck]

Is there any special way of filling up the diffs, gearbox and trans ?

So the diff is the main thing.

Whats the interval and what do YOU use to fill it up again. You obviously can't get in there with an oil can. Or can you ?

I saw mike had a funnel with some hosepipe attached. Surely theres a better way. Links or pictures welcomed.

Gear box and trans.

same questions. Interval, how and with what ?

I did these before when i had them out (floor out etc) but now they are under the car its a bit more difficult. Any tips ?

[lawrence]

I got my diff oil in a 1 litre bottle from halfords it comes with its own built in little funnel that you pull out the top of the bottle. Really easy to use and no mess.

[tweetyduck]

Ah, i know what you mean. I might be buying one bottle which i'll refill.

I think 12 months / 12000 miles is the norm. That sound about right ?

[Quagmire]

Same as Lawrence- buy a one litre bottle then keep it to refill from a bigger, cheaper bottle and use again.

[crclifford]

I changed mine with Difflock Evoultion oils. supposedly these will last longer than normal oil.

To fill them up i use a grease gun/syringe style tool that i use to get to the trans and the gbox, but with the front and rear diff a bottle with a built in funnel can be used fairly easily.

[Jeff Young]

I do the diffs every 2 years and the tranny every 3. It's not a daily driver, though, covering only about a thousand miles a year.

I've got a pump but it's a pain to use cause it doesn't screw into the top of a container, so you've got too many things to try and juggle.

Jeff.

EDIT: I misread the original post; I thought he meant the drain and refill interval. I agree that the levels should be checked and topped-up MUCH more frequently.

Edited February 1, 2011 by Jeff Young

[landroversforever]

For the diffs I collect my oil in 2 litre coke bottles. I have a pipe which fits nicely onto the end of this, with a little adapter on the end to get small enough to go into the diff.

[TJN]

Neill,

Buy a workshop manual. This will tell you the correct intervals.

Buy a small 1 litre pump bottle to take on the trip with you. I also use a Hozelock pump to use in the garage for oils.

TJ

Yes I understand you will not want to do any of the above as it means spending money and reading technical documentation, rather than being spoon feed.

[FridgeFreezer]

Since your truck is (potentially) used for expeditions then the answer to all of them is DAILY. Same for greasing and all other maintenance checks (the LR manuals agree too).

I use a 5L garden sprayer with the spray tip taken off, point and squirt, saves a lot of rolling round on the floor.

Time spent under the car daily with a grease gun / oil bottle is time very well spent, it allows you to spot small problems while they're still small problems (loose nuts, rubbing hoses, leaks, damage) rather than when something falls off unexpectedly.

Same applies after every off-road outing, check everything & preferably re-grease.

[tweetyduck]

@TJN

Thanks but if you all you can offer is sarcasm then don't bother.

You can only dream of spending as much time i have in the last 15 months reading the technical documentation. In the first 6 months alone this amounted to over 40 hours a week doing reasearch. I still spend about 4 hours a night trip planning an preparation. EVERY night. I spend at least 10 hours every weekend on preparation. The correct intervals in the manual are not whats usually done. You should know that. As for tips on how people get to the filler holes you can't find that in any manual.

Thanks Fridge. I presume thats whats meant by Hozelock. I already go round the UJs and stuff with the gun every couple of months and will do it more frequently on the trip.

[FridgeFreezer]

TJN was making the same point I was, albeit in his own style (which, to be fair, is often similar to my style )

It's in your owner's handbook:

I'll see if I can scan in the Series green bible version, that actually gives full service charts for operating in harsh conditions or when used as a stationary powerplant (hours running).

[tweetyduck]

I think the concensus among many a fellow is the changing of oils at 6000 or less is prefered on overland. This i can manage. I think if it were every 2000 miles i'd be doing it every other month at least. Not only is this not possible its completely in-pratical.

There has been other threads on here where 6000 certainly seems to be the norm. If i recall you were a contributor to that thread. I wonder what Brendon did and does he ever post here any longer.

[FridgeFreezer]

Are you talking oil change intervals or maintenance routine checking/topping up?

For most of them I'd be checking daily, topping up if required and then changing based on appearance. It's usually obvious if its been contaminated, for example with water after wading. The rest of the time, it should all be fresh when you set off so you always know how long it's taken to change colour from Day 1.

Also take opportunities when they present themselves - when you hit civilisation & find a shop that sells oil, then is the time to do an oil change, rather than in the middle of nowhere. That way, if you make a mistake and need more oil / a new sump washer or whatever, you can nip back to the shop. It boosts the local economy too, in some places selling a couple of gallons of Mobil is a major pay-day compared to the locals buying individual carburettor springs. We always end up buying loads of random stuff from Rusky car shops - spare nuts, bolts, seals, etc., anything that looks like it'd be useful for bodging repairs, and carp car accessories that make us laugh.

2000 miles isn't an unreasonable time to do a change under harsh conditions if the opportunity presents itself.

[tweetyduck]

The reason for the post was mainly to get the changes as easy as possible and so the request for tips on filling and emptying the oils. If its a 30min job its more likely to get done and if i don't end up covered in oil then more likely still. The difflock drain plug looks nice but its damn expensive for what it is !

I was more meaning the full changes at 6000 but you've answered that. I have two full service sets here, one to do a change before i go and one set of filters and oils to do when i'm there hopefully to use just before i return. Plus about £1000 in spares. I've even got a new PAS box as mine is leaking. I've just not got round to doing it yet so i'm going to take it to morocco just incase. Only thing i haven't got is a starter which i've toyed with getting.

As for checking i'm going to start that once a week on the trip and once i get off road much more frequently. My 110 leaks very little so i shouldn't be using much normally. Its just contamination i'm bothered about and making sure i do the regular changes more often than road intervals. My wading kit isn't fitted yet as thats schedueld for the 19th....I have to book my own time as the list is that long.

Are you saying just get a standard Hozelock sprayer which i can leave full of EP80/90 for the diffs etc. I can manage pouring engine oil in the top

The main gearbox is about 3 litres IIRC. Would you say thats at the same interval as the diffs but obviously not EP90 ? OR would you say longer and no need to take more than a top up for that?

So i think i need about this to change the lot

c.6 litre of EP80/90 , Diffs, Trans

c.7 litre of IID, PAS and Gear

c.6 litre 15W/40 Engine

and take top ups of EP80/90 and IID and 15W/40 on the trip, and as you say get the rest locally for the schedueled changes. I would imagine IID is just as common elsewhere as it is here.

[FridgeFreezer]

I've even got a new PAS box as mine is leaking. I've just not got round to doing it yet so i'm going to take it to morocco just incase.

F***ING NO!

Change the bl**dy PAS box before you go, don't carry a big heavy lump of metal round morocco just-in-case and don't go off on an expedition with known faults like that.

Sorry, but listen to what you're saying - "I'm going to take up a load of precious cargo space and weight capacity with a major assembly because my current one is so knackered it may fail and leave us stranded, but I'd rather change it laying in the dirt by the side of the road than at home in my garage with a cuppa".

Are you taking a spare PAS pump & belt for when it dumps all the PAS fluid out and seizes the pump at 70mph? New seat covers for when you reach the next corner?

Only thing i haven't got is a starter which i've toyed with getting.

Starter being quite critical to vehicle operation (can you & the missus push-start a laden 110 on sand?) if it's at all in doubt buy a new one & fit it, the old one can always live on the shelf at home for a rebuild on a rainy day.

My 110 leaks very little so i shouldn't be using much normally.

Ideally it shouldn't be leaking at all - what leaks, why, can it be fixed before you go?

Are you saying just get a standard Hozelock sprayer which i can leave full of EP80/90 for the diffs etc. I can manage pouring engine oil in the top

Don't mix oils (eg re-use the sprayer). For expeditioning, I'd be tempted to either use a small (3L) one or just work out the simple method with a squeezy bottle topped up from a gallon can, may be a bit of a faff but it's basic and compact. Be aware pressurised containers will leak/weep, especially if they get hot.

Since oil is available in most places throughout the world (usually wherever there's petrol) you probably don't need to carry full amounts of everything - engines need the correct oil, but everything else can live on the wrong stuff if needs must - a gearbox or axle would rather have engine oil than no oil, but can be driven either way with mechanical sympathy. I've run my clutch on ATF before now. As long as you've got a bit to keep things topped up you should only need to buy gallons of gear oil or IID if something's gone wrong and you've nursed it to the next garage/shop/petrol station for proper repairs.

I'd go for a full engine's worth of oil, then just a 1L squirty bottle of EP / IID and maybe 500ml of brake fluid for topping uppings. If you feel the need to do a gear oil change, buy the full amount over there rather than tow it round for thousands of miles just in case.

Don't assume IID, or even EP90 is available everywhere, or that it's called the same thing everywhere. I'd make a note of the alternatives listed in the handbook/RAVE, and note the technical specs (usually small print on the back of the bottle) so you can search them out when it's all in foreign and is between the bread rolls and the dirty mags on the shelf.

[Cat_J]

I would agree with the PAS box. The thing is a pain to change in your garage, forget doing it in a sand storm. Also you would have to carry all the fluids to change the box too. And what if you find the ball joint is cacked too. Plus it has to weigh at least 15kgs.

[Jamaican Defender]

I have found a handheld pump that is used for fill outboard marine engine gearcases with oil, found it a a marine store. It has a hose on the end of it and is useful to get the diffs filled, especiall the front diff with swivel housing.

[tweetyduck]

I typed a huge post which it lost....

Thanks for the guidance but i think I misrepresented the scale of leak....all Land Rovers leak do they not ?

Trans box. 2 drops lost per day

Sump 1 drop lost per day

PAS c.100ml lost in 12 months (It leaks slightly from the bottom seal, don't they all do that !)

The PAS box i've got is new. The reason i got it was i'm going to change it like i have changed almost everything else bar the engine. Even though it might not need doing.

I will not mix oils. It was actully crossing my mind what would happen if you mixed IID and EP80/90 in even small quantities if i used the pump for both.

I have plenty of room for the PAS but i wouldn't want to change it as you say and likely won't be carrying 3.5litres of IID....although now i might.

I'm gonna get a starter you've convinced me. It wouldn't have taken much as i nearly got one yesterday. Oils and names in foreign place...putting it in "the book" right now.

[Retroanaconda]

Thanks for the guidance but i think I misrepresented the scale of leak....all Land Rovers leak do they not ?

(...)

(It leaks slightly from the bottom seal, don't they all do that !)

No they don't. They only leak if people aren't maintaining them.

This is the problem with Land Rovers, people are willing to accept faulty parts on the premise of it being a standard affair when all they need do is fix the bloody thing. Change the seals, clear the breathers, change the flanges if necessary, and it won't leak.

Not specifically aimed at you, but at the general population of Land Rover enthusiasts who don't maintain their vehicles and then blame Solihull for not building it properly when it fails.

[Jamaican Defender]

Attached is a picture of a pump unsed in the marine industry to fill outboard eninge lower units, it can get the job done for those tricky places.

[wicko]

Well Anaconda I bought a reco PAS box from a reputable dealer and its been fitted and it is also leaking now.. more than the one I took out that had been kitted with new seals.

I too am under the impression that landy's leak for a pass time!!

If it can be maintained please indulge me with the required info

[Retroanaconda]

So it's faulty then...?

New parts shouldn't leak.

[reb78]

For getting oils into tricky places like the gearbox, you could use a syringes, some tube and a 3 way tap. Its a bit fiddly to do litres of fluid like this, but the gear will hardly take up any room on your trip. The biggest syringe you are realistically going to get is 50-60ml. You need two bits of tube per syringe - one runs into the pot of oil and the other into the thing you are filling. The three way tap is like a T - the tubes fit to each port at the top of the T and the syringe fits to the bottom part in the middle. With the tap one way you fill the syringe by sucking fluid into it and the other way you pass fluid out. I know it will take 40 pumps of a 50ml syringe to move 2 litres of fluid, but its easy, wouldnt take that long really, wont take up much storage space and you can actually measure how much you are adding (thus calculate how much you are losing) if topping up.

[fozsug]

I use an old cattle drench gun, 300ml ,for doing swivels, axles ,gearboxes and transferboxes. Can get a good squeeze on it for ep90

similar to this

Cheers

Tony

[tweetyduck]

Attached is a picture of a pump unsed in the marine industry to fill outboard eninge lower units, it can get the job done for those tricky places.

Nice one. Off to the boat store.

Thats sort of like Rebs idea of the syringe but will be much quicker. Failing that the other solutions are getting consideration.

Thanks all ,even the ones who believe i never listen and that I do everything wrong