matthew74 Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 Hello Peeps, Have any budding engineers out there looked into how easy it would be to do a centre seat iso fix conversion? As far as i can tell it works by having 2 d rings that a seat base/seat clips onto. I'm thinking a bracket that bolts onto the existing seat belt points and probably to the rear bulkhead. Would it be legal? Is it just a matter of the MOT tester being happy with it or would it need testing in at a higher level? Maybe it's something Simonr would be interested in! X-iso fix. (we can work out my percentage later!!) Please discuss, Matthew74 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshsurferdude Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 I too would like to know this as i have a kid on the way! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickeyw Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 A friend has done this in his D90. He lives abroad where child seats are not a legal requirement, but to visit UK he fabbed some brackets to take an ISOfix child seat. They bolted to the centre seat belt mountings, and having seen them I'd say they looked perfectly strong. However they have not been type approved by any authorative body, so could not be classed as legal. I think at the end of the day I would want to be VERY confident of any child seat fixing I had fitted to my vehicle. I doubt Simon would be interested, as the liabilty issues are huge. If you want to mount a centre child seat, there are already centre lap-belt fixings on a Defender, so how about fitting a 3 point retracting belt using those points and one other, whether it be mounted to the bulkhead or part of a roll cage? Most child seats can be secured with a standard 3-point belt. Disclaimer: I am not recommending you do the above. If you choose to follow such ideas, I accept no responsibility, it is entirely at your own risk. Companies like Securon specialise in making seat belt equipment, or there are other companies that fit belts to minibuses and coaches. I would expect such firms to be able to supply equipment that met legal requirements. Worth a look in that direction I reckon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew74 Posted August 30, 2012 Author Share Posted August 30, 2012 Cheers Mickeyw. I don't have a centre seat so the three point idea isn't really the road i'd like to go down. The idea would be to safely fix an isofix seat base so it sat on the tunnel cover, making it a few inches lower than if it was sat on a centre seat and hopefully so that it'd be still possible to change gears with a rear facing baby seat, then when the brat gets older buying a forward facing seat that fits into the same base. In theory I could fit some square u bolts with spreader plates through the rear bulkhead so the base would clip onto them, but i'd prefer something a little more over engineered. Any more ideas are welcome. Ta, Matthew74. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simonr Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 As Mickey said - the potential liability of children flying through the windscreen does not even bear thinking about! It's not even something I would do personally. Dead kid versus buy different car? No brainer! Si Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UdderlyOffroad Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 Am I missing something here? Why not just use a seat secured by a 3-point belt in the passenger seat? Why does it have to be ISOFIX? Even a baby seat in the centre seat is liable to cause elbow room issues, a forward facing seat is liable to cause you to accidentally elbow your firstborn in the face! By comparison, the sleep-deprived mum in the centre seat will probably only get elbowed in the (sore) chest area! :-) Am guessing from your profile pic you have a van (hard top), so no rear seats/doors? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew74 Posted August 30, 2012 Author Share Posted August 30, 2012 Does that mean your out Si? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew74 Posted August 30, 2012 Author Share Posted August 30, 2012 Am I missing something here? Why not just use a seat secured by a 3-point belt in the passenger seat? Why does it have to be ISOFIX? Even a baby seat in the centre seat is liable to cause elbow room issues, a forward facing seat is liable to cause you to accidentally elbow your firstborn in the face! By comparison, the sleep-deprived mum in the centre seat will probably only get elbowed in the (sore) chest area! :-) Am guessing from your profile pic you have a van (hard top), so no rear seats/doors? Its a 90 hard top and i don't have a centre seat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UdderlyOffroad Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 Its a 90 hard top and i don't have a centre seat. Ok, so you need to accommodate both baby and additional passenger? Or just baby? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew74 Posted August 30, 2012 Author Share Posted August 30, 2012 Yes. Me, swmbo and a future little un. I don't think as an engineering problem it'd be difficult to overcome. Using existing secure fixing points where the centre seat was on the defender to utilise the isofix system, after all the isofix system as far as i can tell is only two square d shaped points fixed securely to the vehicle structure. I can imagine that there would be a hell of a lot of problems testing it for safety etc. But what would they be? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miketomcat Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 We have a 90csw child has front pas seat in a belt fit car seat and me or wife sit in the back on one of the four side facing seats. Plan to fit fwd facing rear seats shortly though then child will be relegated to back seat. Or we take my 110csw but I think those are your only options really. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big.Mike Posted August 30, 2012 Share Posted August 30, 2012 I'm not sure you can use the ISOFIX fixings, the middle seat on my Defender is 370mm(ish) wide and the ISOFIX loops on my Multipla are 360mm wide to the outside. I know that the ISOFIX seat base fits well outside these dims. I'm in the process of adding 3 point seatbelts in the front and back middle row of seats. Cheers, Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew74 Posted August 30, 2012 Author Share Posted August 30, 2012 How do you find the inward facing seats for comfort? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew74 Posted August 30, 2012 Author Share Posted August 30, 2012 Thanks Big.Mike, this is 1 of the problems that I imagined would scupper my idea. Which brand of seat is it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miketomcat Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 Inward seats are alright for short ish trips but if your 6'3" like me the headlining becomes an issue. This is why I'm fitting fwd facing rear seats soon having said that it's done us for over a year now. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big.Mike Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 Thanks Big.Mike, this is 1 of the problems that I imagined would scupper my idea. Which brand of seat is it? I'm using the Exmoor trim seatbelts:http://www.exmoortrim.co.uk/catalogue/detail/79-seat-belts/flypage/903-3-point-centre-seat-belt.html?sef=hcfp The specification around the ISO standard is so involved that I would shudder to think how hard it would be to get this to actually work. A brief outline of the standard can be found here: http://www.unece.org/fileadmin/DAM/trans/doc/2008/wp29grsp/CRS-03-04e.pdf I'd like to suggest that it would just be a case of grabbing a bracket of some other car seat and welding it in place. In reality you'd really want to buy a copy of ISO 13216-2. Cheers, Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biggles Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 I'm using the Exmoor trim seatbelts:http://www.exmoortri...t.html?sef=hcfp Cheers, Mike I was looking at this belt for my centre seat, that is untill i found out the price from exmoor, anyone know who else makes the same type of 3 point fixing, only a tad less than the 68 odd quid plus vat? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 Most likely a Securon belt, can just make out what is printed on the buckle in that link. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
biggles Posted August 31, 2012 Share Posted August 31, 2012 Thanks Western, will have a search for securon belts. ta Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronnie_rotten Posted September 1, 2012 Share Posted September 1, 2012 Just thought i'd add my experience here. The only way myself missus and sprog could ever fit in the hicap was with child seat in the main passenger seat and uncomfortable missus in the middle straddling the tunnel. Gearstick inoperable in any other setup. This was the case with first rear facing seat and 9kg+ recaro young sport. Hate to say it, but i think it's a fit a middle seat and earplugs, or buy a disco! And be careful, the first option only works until the second bundle comes on the scene, hence the sale of my hicap, and the hunt for a disco! Congrats, by the way! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big.Mike Posted September 1, 2012 Share Posted September 1, 2012 Thanks Western, will have a search for securon belts. ta They are Securon 254. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thingybox Posted September 4, 2012 Share Posted September 4, 2012 I think I might have a viable solution to all this... Fit a bulkhead removal bar (the tubular type not the type sold by MudStuff) and mount the seat slightly further back from the front seats, between the wheel arches in the tub. The advantages are that you'll maintain your elbow room and won't be elbowing mini-matthew74 but you still have access to him should he need feeding! Just a thought... Bob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keycare Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 Sorry to be resurrecting an old thread hear but I've been looking at the isofix fitting possibilities in a defender. I found a ford focus isofix mounting bracket on ebay which bolts to the chassis for ford's that don't already have them fitted at the factory. Surely these would be type approved as they are oem parts. Similarly, the aftermarket 3 or 4 point seat belts for the centre seats of a defender would be type approved (even if you have to drill thee fixing holes yourself). So if you were to bolt the ford focus isofix bracket to the same fixing points as the centre front seat, what makes this less safe than bolting it to the focus? Or even bolting the bracket to any point on the floor of any vehicle for that matter? Many cars use the same parts, many parts are interchangeable. What's the problem with having a ford isofix bracket in a landrover? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farmerfred Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 Before even considering fitting any centre or extra seat in a Defender you will need to know the legality of carrying a small child on the seat even if contained within an approved child seat. I was always under the impression that a child seat has to be rear facing and fitted in a forward facing fixed seat in the rear of a vehicle and is illegal to fit in the front. My advice would be to get rid of the Land Rover and get a vehicle so that you have seating that you can safely and legally carry your young child in in the proper manner, a centre seat in a Defender has very little use and makes driving rather dangerous if anyone's sitting in it anyway so to me it's a no-brainer, how, with the greatest of respect, can anyone even contemplate carrying a child in a vehicle without thinking about the wider picture, I shudder at what the consequences might be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big.Mike Posted July 19, 2013 Share Posted July 19, 2013 Before even considering fitting any centre or extra seat in a Defender you will need to know the legality of carrying a small child on the seat even if contained within an approved child seat. I was always under the impression that a child seat has to be rear facing and fitted in a forward facing fixed seat in the rear of a vehicle and is illegal to fit in the front. My advice would be to get rid of the Land Rover and get a vehicle so that you have seating that you can safely and legally carry your young child in in the proper manner, a centre seat in a Defender has very little use and makes driving rather dangerous if anyone's sitting in it anyway so to me it's a no-brainer, how, with the greatest of respect, can anyone even contemplate carrying a child in a vehicle without thinking about the wider picture, I shudder at what the consequences might be. No and no, it's not illegal to fit a child seat on a side facing dicky seat, nor is it illegal to fit a child seat in the front. It's also not illegal to swap seats out, put others in. I genuinely wouldn't recommend doing any of these things, but it's not illegal. I would steer clear of ISO fix completely... and get a 110 CSW if you want to cart a baby around. The centre seat of a defender is ideal for small children, particularly with the 4 point seat belt. just not ones in baby seats. Cheers, Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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