sheathy Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 OK next thing to go wrong with my 1995 110 2.5 na is the glow plugs have stopped working. The light isn't coming on to say they are heating either. Where is the best place to start looking to diagnose the problem? Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jocklandjohn Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 Fuse? Or maybe the relay is gone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheathy Posted October 25, 2016 Author Share Posted October 25, 2016 Do the NA engined defenders have a relay? I thought it was just down to the 1st ignition position hold. Can't identify a fuse for the plugs annoyingly, any ideas which one it might be? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jocklandjohn Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 No idea. You'd need to locate a wiring diagram online I think to be sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkie Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 If it is the same as on the 19J (2.5TD) and I'm sure it is, then there is no fuse or relay, it is a very simple arrangement. The feed from the positive terminal on the starter motor goes to the ignition switch via a thick brown wire then out to the glow plugs via an equally thick brown wire with a red trace. I think there will be a smaller brown/red wire coming from this to light up the dash light. I would guess either the bulb in the dash is dead or the ingnition switch is dead. You'll need to get to the ignition switch to look at the wires. Check you've got 12v on the brown wire from the starter motor terminal. Then check for 12V on the thick red/brown wire while turning the switch to the cold start position. I would imagine you won't have 12v there. If so, I think the ignition switch will be dead. Be very careful not to earth the feed any of these wires on this circuit. I didn't notice one of the glowplug terminals was ever so slightly touching the head. It resulted in the main feed melting because there isn't a fuse to blow! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted October 25, 2016 Share Posted October 25, 2016 no relay or fuse on pre tdi diesel engine glowplugs, they take a direct feed from battery +ve to ignition switch & should energise with the dash light on as you hold the key to the heater plug position before going into the spring loaded part of ign switch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheathy Posted October 26, 2016 Author Share Posted October 26, 2016 Thanks for the replies, was working as described by you, Western until I brought it across France, now neither the glowplugs or the light are working so it does sound like an ignition switch issue. Annoyingly I have no voltmeter with me to test it but would it be safe to remove the wires from the switch and short them just briefly to test there is current? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevm Posted October 26, 2016 Share Posted October 26, 2016 Not a recommended procedure, have you not got a spare bulb you could test it with. I would check to see if there is power coming to the first plug at the back of the engine first, then check where the brown/red wire comes off the ign. switch. If no power there then new switch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkie Posted October 26, 2016 Share Posted October 26, 2016 I agree with the post above^^^. I don't think it's a good idea to short the wires while they are live. I guess it would be an okay idea providing you disconnect the positive terminial of the battery before bypassing the ignition switch, then just quickly put the positive lead back on the battery while someone confirms that the warning lamp lights up, as soon as it does, disonnect the battery again and put the wires back on the switch so you know where they go when you do replace the switch. Failing that I think given the simplicity of the circuit, I think the most likely problem is going to be the ignition switch and they are quite cheap, so it might be worth just getting the switch swapped and seeing if that fixes the problem. I think it will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheathy Posted October 26, 2016 Author Share Posted October 26, 2016 OK thanks for the advice guys. Just had an investigative look and gained access to the ignition switch. As I know next to nothing about electrics I think your idea is best monkey. I may try and get hold of a voltmeter in the first instance though as it seems like a useful thing to have for next time something goes wrong. Plus getting any parts shipped to where I now live in france is bloody costly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bodumatau Posted October 26, 2016 Share Posted October 26, 2016 just buy it online, I looked quickly on amazon.fr and found this https://www.amazon.fr/Etekcity®-Multimètre-Rétroéclairé-Résistance-Continuité/dp/B00S7J7L7Q/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1477495008&sr=8-1&keywords=multimetre+voltmetre I am sure the bay of many things also has them for cheaper I have been using a el-cheapo like that for years, works fine and have no qualms about throwing it into my toolbox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheathy Posted October 26, 2016 Author Share Posted October 26, 2016 Thanks- was just looking on the bay actually. Will get one ordered Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkie Posted October 26, 2016 Share Posted October 26, 2016 Here's the switch and they ship to France. - Maybe get 2 switches just incase! http://www.paddockspares.com/prc2735-starter-switch-diesel-2-5na-2-5td.html The switch is held into the metal housing by one (or two) extremely small screws and of course they are in the most awkward place to access. I'm sure you will get your money's worth from a voltmeter on your 110. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bodumatau Posted October 26, 2016 Share Posted October 26, 2016 yep, I use the above and they ship to germany for 5 quid, usually is there in 3-4 working days Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mo Murphy Posted October 26, 2016 Share Posted October 26, 2016 Sheath, I have a brand new genuine one here that I bought many years ago and never used. Yours for £20 plus the post if you need it. It should see your Landy to the end of its days ? Mo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mo Murphy Posted October 26, 2016 Share Posted October 26, 2016 Mo 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevm Posted October 26, 2016 Share Posted October 26, 2016 When I first read the thread title "glow plugs not working, where to start?" my first thought was South of France but if that's still to cold try Morocco. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mutley Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 Can't offer advice on fixing the problem, and appreciate you would like them sorted......But am i right in thinking that glow plugs are ineffective unless the temperature drops below -20° or something!?! So starting shouldn't be an issue, unless it's already -20° where you are??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkie Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 52 minutes ago, Mutley said: Can't offer advice on fixing the problem, and appreciate you would like them sorted......But am i right in thinking that glow plugs are ineffective unless the temperature drops below -20° or something!?! So starting shouldn't be an issue, unless it's already -20° where you are??? Not on old diesels, especially the pre-Tdi ones with indirect injection. In my experience they simply won't start easily with out a good 10-15 seconds of heat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 no outside temp sensing on any of the 4 cylinder diesel engine including 200 & 300tdi, they either work or don't work because of a wiring or switch fault. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mutley Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 Monkie, you could well be right as i have no idea, but think i read it somewhere in a thread on here some years ago??? Mine is a 300Tdi '95 and for a long time the glow plugs were not connected, and started trouble free upto -10° Thought all diesels started the same way so age would be irrelevant with regards for the need of glow plugs in extreme cold conditions? But always willing to be educated, as sometimes memory lets me down, yes i know it's an age thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted October 28, 2016 Share Posted October 28, 2016 TDIs are fine without, eaelier engines that are just TD are not... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheathy Posted November 4, 2016 Author Share Posted November 4, 2016 Hi all, thanks for all the input. Still waiting on ignition switch to arrive annoyingly- thanks for your kind offer mo murphy, annoyingly I had already ordered from paddock by the time i saw your post. I have very little chance of starting her without preheating the glowplugs it takes a dozen or so turns which is normally enough to put the battery in trouble. With glow plugs it starts instantly. Hopefully the part arrives soon as I it's only getting colder here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bowie69 Posted November 4, 2016 Share Posted November 4, 2016 Get a piece of heavy gauge wire, attach to glow plug rail, whap on to the battery positive for 10 seconds, remove and then crank it over. I will start then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheathy Posted November 4, 2016 Author Share Posted November 4, 2016 OK- problem not solved. New switch in place but no dice. Switch is working fine- but the lead for the lights in the position of the glow plug start and lights work. Glow plugs and respective wiring tested by attaching to first ignition position and all fine. Have had to put the battery on charge now pissing around for a few hours has drained it . Maybe a full battery is the answer... I have my doubts. So any ideas anyone? Tempting to wire in a high tolerance simple on off switch on a separate circuit and carry on as everything else is working. Voltmeter has just arrived as well but can't see that being helpful now as both switch and wiring is fine. I am confused. Many swear words. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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