Series swb 5 Speed Conversion - Help

[AV8R]

On 2-10-2017 at 10:11 AM, Bandog said:

The lt77 is the desperately needed strengthener in the weak drivechain for turbodiesel conversions, as the series transfer box is vertually nukeproof. The beauty of this set up is that you can get real economy when the conversion is done, and its so much less heartache than the lt230 setup. In classic landys you retain the coloured (colored) shifters in cab.

My LT230 has all the Series-correct levers and knobs and they all work the corresponding function. LT230 has a part time 4WD kit installed. Push the yellow knob for 4WD. Pull red lever for neutral and low range. Only thing different is you need to pull the yellow knob up to disengage 4WD. If you look closely, you can spot the skinny front propshaft.

Edited October 3, 2017 by AV8R

[Bandog]

That awful, dreadful gearbox out of the arc is no good for a practical, powerful 200tdi daily runner, I apologise for my bluntness.

Mine runs 20 psi boost through a very large intercooler and tuned pump, open pipe and large capacity air filter with rolled radius flared flange. Mid range torque is truly spectacular when overtaking, when I want it on the loud pedal, on tap. When I dont need it, the vehicle returns around 37-42 mpg partly because of the 2wd option.

The rover 4 speed can not do this reliably. Its my personal preferance and I think its great, cheers.

[Bandog]

yes i am thick i can now see its an lt77, humble apols

[FridgeFreezer]

AV8R - Do you have any more pics of your linkages, I really like that! My best effort was screwing the yellow knob onto the LT230's hi-lo lever

[Bowie69]

@discomikey did the same.. he did a write up about it:

@ejparrott Also shows his off in there  

 

 

[Cliffordtdi]

18 hours ago, AV8R said:

My LT230 has all the Series-correct levers and knobs and they all work the corresponding function. LT230 has a part time 4WD kit installed. Push the yellow knob for 4WD. Pull red lever for neutral and low range. Only thing different is you need to pull the yellow knob up to disengage 4WD. If you look closely, you can spot the skinny front propshaft.

Does anyone happen to know the part number of that skinny prop? I was thinking of using a double cardon with a small spacer to try and dodge cutting the crossmember for my front prop from the LT77 / Series Transfer. . . If anyone knows something that works on it without modding the chassis please shout :-)

 

[Jon W]

I like the idea of this, but do you think it will fit behind a rover v8 without pushing the engine any further forward. Series gearbox currently sitting on standard mount and V8 mounts welded in to suit

 

Thanks 

 

Jon 

[Bandog]

21 hours ago, AV8R said:

My LT230 has all the Series-correct levers and knobs and they all work the corresponding function. LT230 has a part time 4WD kit installed. Push the yellow knob for 4WD. Pull red lever for neutral and low range. Only thing different is you need to pull the yellow knob up to disengage 4WD. If you look closely, you can spot the skinny front propshaft.

Neat job, very nice indeed. What about all that c.v. joints and one shot grease malarky though? Where is the lt230 part time conversion kit from may I ask? cheers

[FridgeFreezer]

16 minutes ago, Bandog said:

Neat job, very nice indeed. What about all that c.v. joints and one shot grease malarky though? Where is the lt230 part time conversion kit from may I ask? cheers

What have CV joints or one-shot grease got to do with anything?

[Bandog]

I don't rightly know fridge. Explain it to me like I am a 3 year old please, cheers.

[AV8R]

2 hours ago, Bandog said:

Neat job, very nice indeed. What about all that c.v. joints and one shot grease malarky though? Where is the lt230 part time conversion kit from may I ask? cheers

Part time kit is through Ashcroft, like DiscoMikey's. I ran the LT230 as fulltime 4WD for a while but you could feel the U-joints in the swivelhousings through the steering wheel in tight corners ! Surely a Stage 1 front axle would solve that with it 's CV joints but these are quite hard to get. The 2/4WD conversion is rather simple but requires some care in adjusting the clearance is the former center diff.

In the first pic you see the new needle bearing for the front output shaft, the new "counter spider"gear, adjustment shims and a regular spider gear.

Second pic shows the "counter spider" on the diff cross shafts. Regular spider gear goes on top. Rear output shaft splines straight into the spider gear as usual but the "counter spider" makes it immobile from the diff cage by locking said spider to the cross shafts. Front output shaft is locked in the regular LT230 way for 4WD.

[AV8R]

8 hours ago, FridgeFreezer said:

AV8R - Do you have any more pics of your linkages, I really like that! My best effort was screwing the yellow knob onto the LT230's hi-lo lever

DiscoMikey solved it all a bit easier with cutting and welding. I've done quite a bit of machining but like DM it took me some time to figure out lever lenghts, angles, ranges and what not. Think I made 7 rough prototypes before I made something to my liking.

Tried to upload more pics but it seems I've reached my 10 MB limit :-(

[Bowie69]

It's only 10mb per post...

[Bandog]

o.k. lets get down to the nits and bolts men, so whats the deficit between the lt230 and the series job in sterling terms?

To be honest, I did not know about this option. Already having the series transfer box swayed my decision anyway I suppose. I was always under the impression that the choice could only be lt230 with permanent 4wd. Hence my statement about one **** grease etc. cheers men ta 

[AV8R]

For me the choice for the LT230 was availability and the ability to change ratio's.

My 88 still has 4,7:1 diff's for a very low speed in low range. At idle it runs about 2 Km/hr in 1st gear low. 5th gear low can still give 60 Km/hr.

The 1,003: 1 high ratio gives me 100 Km/hr @ 2500 RPM in 5th.

Picture shows Hi range, 4WD selected. The brown pipe running at an angle is the RH cylinder bank exhaust pipe. Second pic shows some of the prototype levers and rods I made for the 2/4 WD selector. Yeah, that bonnet could do with a bit of paint but I want to finish all mechanical stuff before I do the paint back to it´s original Sand colour.

[FridgeFreezer]

Quite a few people have fitted LT230 without the 2WD conversion on a Series with no issues, it's only a nicety that CV joints make it feel smooth when turning sharply whereas UJ's feel a bit more notchy.

[Bandog]

Fridge I was going on the nicks land rover thread, and I did not know this lt230 part time job was available. Stands to reason if you have expensive diffs and need to play with gearing.

Belting good neat professional job by the way, very jealous that mans skills surpass those of mine! cheers

[ejparrott]

I bet all the photo's of mine have vanished thanks to photosuckit....

[Bowie69]

@ejparrott, I can see them OK, weirdly: https://forums.lr4x4.com/topic/94798-discomikeys-lt77-lt230-into-88-series-thread/?page=3

Or is that my photosuckit browser hack I am using?

I like the youtube of it as well:

 

 

[ejparrott]

The worlds shakiest video!

Edit:yeah I can't see them...I'll have to edit it some time

[twodoorgaz]

On 2 October 2017 at 8:07 PM, Bandog said:

You also have to scallop the cross member where the bell housing meets the flywheel housing, because there is only about 1 mm clearance on the sticky out bit of the clutch housing. This touches its vibration city, cheers

Bandog - re: the 1mm clearance - is this on a SII/IIA chassis or a SIII? I realise there's a difference in the clutches and the gearbox cossmember webbing between the two.

A pic of the potential clash would be massive useful.

 

I've collected the ashcroft kit, a stumpy R380 and a skinny front prop ready to do the conversion but would love to see where the potential clash lies.

 

Thank you.

 

[Bandog]

Its a series III chassis I think. I will sort it and post it asap mate. Also worth remembering is the same cross member is smack bang where your flywheel housing is, so unless you drill a big hole, or other mod, you will not be able to get the flywheel locking tool/wading plug in for love or money when the vehicle is built. (cam belt job)

I will post pics of my modification of this too for you, bear with, cheers.

Edited October 6, 2017 by Bandog
its a series III chassis I think

[Cliffordtdi]

Is the skinny prop a disco 1 3.9 v8 with cat front prop? And does that clear a standard flywheel crossmember with an LT77 and series transfer box?

[discomikey]

Thanks for the link @Bowie69 i'm more than happy to offer advice/what went well and not so well if anyone needs it

[twodoorgaz]

5 hours ago, Cliffordtdi said:

Is the skinny prop a disco 1 3.9 v8 with cat front prop? And does that clear a standard flywheel crossmember with an LT77 and series transfer box?

Yes - also fitted to the RRC of the same vintage - they come up on ebay quite often, usually about £30-£40.

This is the search term I had saved while waiting for a cheap one (paste into eBay and scan through till you see one that looks right): 

(disco,discovery,rrc,rangerover,range) (prop,propshaft) -td5 -tdi -tdv6 -2.7 -sport -p38 -l322 -l405

There is one listed, but its very expensive and in the Netherlands:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Range-Rover-Classic-propshaft-with-catalyst-/311956754784?hash=item48a2125160:g:O3cAAOSwC6dZs-vp

I've just bought one for £30, though will need to have it extended (stumpy R380 with bell housing face in same position as 4-speed, series transfer box moved back 4" to compensate for longer box - just having Richards weld on a 2nd set of bolt-up xrossmember brackets 4" back without touching/cutting the rest of the chassis).

Seen a few in this configuration where the standard prop cleared the gearbox crossmember - even on parabolics. But it was noticeably tighter than stock, so a skinny prop should return the clearance to an acceptable level.