Missing bolts?

[iron_city]

Hello, I was under our Defender today (I seem to be there a lot lately). I noticed some threaded holes that were devoid of what looks like should be bolts in there. One is at the bottom front of the engine just behind the pulley, and the second is near the front of the transmission and the third and forth and near the back of the transmission. I also have a pretty decent oil leak that seems to be coming from the oil pan and somewhere around the transmission. If someone has any thoughts if these holes should actually contain bolts, and by chance any thought on how best to mitigate the oil leaking would be really appreciated. Kind of hoping it might be as simple as a new oil pan gasket.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Mossberg]

A couple of those are for wading plugs, so only fitted if going through deep water or mud. The images where you have circled a single hole.

That is the bottom of the flywheel housing and on bottom of the timing case. They prevent oil build up in case of a leak but will also alow water in if its too deep. Easy enough to purchase off ebay or a parts supplier. Keep them in the vehicle in case of unexpected flooding. 

I don't know what the other pair are for.

If you are intending to go wading then it's worth getting someone who knows what they are talking about to give you advice as there is more to it than just fitting the plugs.

[Mossberg]

https://gwynlewis4x4.co.uk/product/200tdi-300tdi-wading-plugs/

[Mossberg]

I think it would be worth you giving your engine a good clean with gunk or similar as it's difficult to identify specifically where the leak is from if there is lots of dirt and oil everywhere. When you know the engine is clean, watch for leaks starting to show themselves and post a photo on here and the knowledgeable folk can give you a better idea of what it is. 

My sump was leaking so took it off and replaced it. I refitted mine using blue hylomar sealant, though I think you can get gaskets for them. Cleaning the bottom of the engine before refitting was a pain as it needs to be clean but not scored or scratched so be careful when doing it.

Also when refitting read the instructions for the sealant (if that's what you are using) as think you have to leave it to skin over before you fit the sump - but read the instructions as it's been a while since I dud mine. I also got myself some long bolts that allowed me to align the sump without it contacting the engine (obviously when the sump is fitted replace them with the correct ones 😉). And importantly remember it's sn alloy engine so don't over tighten the screws. I purchased a small torque wrench as I think these are right on the lower limit of my larger torque wrench. I am not good at judging torque, especially on smaller screws!

As you will be draining the oil to do that job, don't forget to purchase a sump plug washer. I believe the 300tdi can be fitted with two different size sump plugs but again more knowledgeable folk can confirm this - I don't think these are expensive so I ordered one of each to be sure 

It's worth noting that I am not a mechanic by any stretch of the imagination, so please check any advice I give and understand that the first mechanicing I have done was when I purchased my defender just over three years ago! Mine is a 1993 90 with a 300tdi fitted (not the original engine) but it looks be in a different position to yours and mine has the R380 gearbox.

My Defender is a  "bitsa" as over the years it has had parts replaced with different ones, so you can't rely on a vin number to order parts. 

I still have lots of bits to do on mine, but that will be an ongoing process as it's a used truck, not a project.

[iron_city]

thank you @Mossberg  🙏! I've never even heard of wading plugs before. I'm guessing those unplugged holes are not the source of the oil leak too?

[iron_city]

Got it, thanks again @Mossberg as I sent my first reply before I saw your last one. Good idea to give the engine and tranny a good cleaning to help identify where the leak is coming from.

[Mossberg]

14 minutes ago, iron_city said:

thank you @Mossberg  🙏! I've never even heard of wading plugs before. I'm guessing those unplugged holes are not the source of the oil leak too?

Whilst I wouldn't expect them to be your main oil leak, you may actually find oil coming from them which is worth identifying, especially on the timing case as you really don't want a contaminated timing belt.

I changed the timing belt on mine soon after I  got the truck as I didn't know the history of it and didn't want it snapping and the associated grief it would cause. Part of the process of changing the belt was replacing the seals around the crankshaft, though that had to be done twice as it didn't seat correctly the first time.

Worth a watch.

 

I believe the rear crank seal is an engine out job so I am dreading that one!!

I am watching this with interest incase I can learn from others giving you advice on identifying oil leaks. 

 

[Sigi_H]

First of all I recommend 5 (better 10) cans of brake cleaner and a hard brush and another session under the car. You will be really dirty. When all is oilfree you can start to locate a possible leak after a testdrive. Otherwise you will find it only by accident.

Wading plugs are allready mentioned and the holes at the gearboxes are for a holder to make mounting easier.

There seem to be no missing bolts.

If there is comming oil from the front wading plug: Front crank seal. Oil from the rear wading plug: Rear oil seal or clutch Slave cylinder (when clutch reservoir is running empty, looks like oil, but is clutch fluid)

Oil from between the gearboxes: LT230 Intermediate shaft

[steve b]

15 minutes ago, Sigi_H said:

Oil from between the gearboxes: LT230 Intermediate shaft

Usually the forward end of the inter shaft to case seal - an O ring that can harden and/or oval-ing of the casing hole.

Engine oil leak looks like sump to block - no gasket , just sump sealer . Elring OEM sump sealer is what I use.

Other culprits are fuel lift pump gasket, vac pump casing lid to body seal and the breather or cyclone to sump drain hose.

Steve

[fmmv]

Don't forget  Land Rovers like to mark their territory. Leaks may be from any or even all of the above points, don't assume there is only one.

[Jocklandjohn]

4 hours ago, fmmv said:

Don't forget  Land Rovers like to mark their territory. Leaks may be from any or even all of the above points, don't assume there is only one.

You have no idea. I had to go into a private hospital ( I paid for it myself as NHS was looong waiting list - knee op and I had a ski trip with disabled skiers I was tutoring so it was worth doing). Arrived in the evening, parked 110 at their front door asit was really quiet and went in.

Anyway they made a pigs ear of it at the anaesthesia stage which gave me and the nursing staff a fright (an issue I have which I warned them about and they ignored then carried on and did what they should not have done) and then I woke up in a ward *somewhere* alone with no nurse to check me, no access to anything and despite loads of bell ringing nobody came. After 45 mins I got my phone and called front desk "Where are you?" they asked "I have no idea, I woke up somewhere in your hospital". 15 minutes later an official person and nurse appeared and the nurse lied through her teeth that she'd checked me every few minutes and I was unconscious. Which was nonsense.

Anyway I was glad to get out so hobbled to exit next day and noticed a familiar smell. And red footprints on their carpet and annoyed looking people everywhere with expensive shoes.

ATF! Outside a river of red power steering fluid was running down the drive and everybody coming in was walking through it and taking it inside. I checked my reservoir, empty. Sigh. Called AA and a low loader came for me and blocked their drive as it tried to manoeuvre in to get me. Took me to garage, onto ramp and refilled reservoir and ran engine. No leaks from the pump or box. Waited for 30 mins steeering turned left/right/left/right and on and on and on and not a drop came out. That same box performed flawlessly for the next 15 years until I replaced it. I still have the same pump.

Land Rovers know, they just know.....

[Snagger]

As the others said, there are no missing bolts.  The two larger holes are drain holders for the timing case (and it’s rubber belt) and the clutch housing - you don’t want oil building up in either casing, so they are normally left open to drain but bungs should be fitted for wading.

The other two smaller bolt holes on the bracket lugs are for a rear gear mounting for the gear box - I forget which iteration, but an era of the Discovery and Range Rover had a mounting on there instead of the sides of the transmission, and the LT77 (and possibly its R380 descendant) would have used a mounting there for the numerous saloon cars it was fitted to.

It is hard to identify the source of the oil weep with all that muck present, but from the wet spot, I’d expect it to be from the front end of the LT230 intermediate cluster shaft - they have an o-ring which hardens and starts to weep out of the front between gear box and 4wd housing as yours appears to be, and that shaft can wear the bore in the aluminium casing oval.

[Peaklander]

I agree that it's hard to find the source amongst all that grime. From recent experience, even when everywhere is clean, it can still be hard. I was chasing a leak from my overdrive and it was only present when driving and self-cleaning in the airflow. The oil was deposited nowhere near the leak. Only when talcum powder was used to cover all potential sources, was the actual leak spotted.

[steve b]

31 minutes ago, Peaklander said:

I agree that it's hard to find the source amongst all that grime. From recent experience, even when everywhere is clean, it can still be hard. I was chasing a leak from my overdrive and it was only present when driving and self-cleaning in the airflow. The oil was deposited nowhere near the leak. Only when talcum powder was used to cover all potential sources, was the actual leak spotted.

That's a great tip with the talcum powder

Steve

[Sigi_H]

There are drillings with thread at the side of older LT77. The british engineer decided to drill through completely and tap it. A blind hole was to easy 😄

I had to close them with short bolts. No idea, whats normaly bolted there. Maybe some different leverage for Diff Lock and low range

 

Edited November 13, 2023 by Sigi_H

[western]

LT77 was fitted to various BL cars as well, so those holes could be related to a car fitment. 

[Bowie69]

And TVRs!

[Sigi_H]

That's what I suspected. The LT77 was even in the Jaguar E Type. Anyway it is weird not to construct blind holes at this place 😁