yogibear47.lee Posted March 28, 2008 Share Posted March 28, 2008 is there any where what will do it just for a day insurance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted March 28, 2008 Share Posted March 28, 2008 if your going to a play day site or greenlaning your own vehicle insurance should cover it, certainly will on green lanes as they are classed as legal highways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LandyManLuke Posted March 28, 2008 Share Posted March 28, 2008 standard vehicle insurance won't cover you off-road. at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orgasmic Farmer Posted March 28, 2008 Share Posted March 28, 2008 As I see it your standard insurance will cover you third party wherever you are and whatever you do so that if, though your actions someone else or their property is damaged you will not be paying for it for the rest of your life. If someone is able to definitively say any different I will gladly listen. If you have fully comp insurance and expect a new bumper after damaging it at a pay and play site I think you may be out of luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101nut Posted March 28, 2008 Share Posted March 28, 2008 What is 'off road' in your case? Greenlanes that are not private ROWs are public highways and your normal insurance must cover you by law - don't believe the cr*p about 'we are doing you a special favour by covering you for greenlanes' - they do anyway. Off roading on a publicly accessible space will mean you are covered - this would be an area which is freely accessible to all members of the public but is not a normal highway for instance a supermarket car park or any other 'open' space. Off roading on a space for which you have to pay to enter, join a club or satisfy other specific conditions to gain entry is much more difficult. Technically the law regards the usual 'promotional permits' for events as granting an extension to the public highway which is why participating vehicles must be road legal. However because there are specific conditions of entry an insurance company usually attempts to deny liability with a 'not used for trials, competitions etc etc' type clause. This would be an interesting one to fight for anyone who has the cash. The organisers running the event should have insurance which will cover their third party liability only. Interestingly, as a driver if you take a passenger for a trip around a 'promotional event' off-road course and they are injured for whatever reason you are personally liable for any claim made, not your insurance ... If available, specific insurance for such off-road activity would necessarily attract a high premium as it would have a high risk of claim. AndyG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reads90 Posted March 29, 2008 Share Posted March 29, 2008 Have looked into this in great detail a couple of years ago for a club i was in . Insurance companies (as Orgasmic Farmer said) will cover you for third party off road at a site or green lane day. They have to by law. But will not cover your car. Just the people or car you hit. On this there is some arguemnet about the car you hit but definatley the people you hit with get paid out by your insurance companies. Which is why most site days ask for road taxed cars only and no trailered cars. A road taxed car should be MOTed and Insured. And if it has insuracne then people it hits on the site is covered by their insurance as liabilty insurance is no use when a car is involved.If You trip on a site and fall over a log then liablity covers you. You get hit by a car moving at 1mph then you are not covered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FridgeFreezer Posted March 29, 2008 Share Posted March 29, 2008 You get hit by a car moving at 1mph then you are not covered. You've also been eating too many pies if you can't avoid a car at 1mph Despite what insurance companies may want you to think, legally third party insurance goes everywhere with you - otherwise you wouldn't be covered if you damaged someone in a private car park, on your driveway, work car park, garage forecourt... However, insurance against damaging your vehicle is harder to find and probably not worth it, if you can't afford the damage you probably need to be more careful or not take it off-road in the first place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmgemini Posted March 29, 2008 Share Posted March 29, 2008 Let me throw this in..... You will not get any cover for off road at all. The site/land owner is the one who has the third party cover. You take your vehicle there at your risk. Competing is different. I still doubt if you will get cover. However you could get a copy of Autosport. Look at the insurance adverts. Then be sitting down when you ask for the quote. If you can insure parts of a racing car. You can insure most things. Again when competing it's the club through the MSA who have the third party cover. Well thy should have. Private car parks, including council ones, are different again. It comes under access from a highway. So as long as there's access then you are insured. mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reads90 Posted March 29, 2008 Share Posted March 29, 2008 The site/land owner is the one who has the third party cover. You take your vehicle there at your risk. Yeah thats called Liability insurance and you are not covered if a motor vehicle is involved in the incident. so for off roading it is bloody useless Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yogibear47.lee Posted March 29, 2008 Author Share Posted March 29, 2008 well my insurance say cant use for an 4x4 event and i want to go to korc this sunday so i turned it down because off my insurance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmgemini Posted March 29, 2008 Share Posted March 29, 2008 Yeah thats called Liability insurance and you are not covered if a motor vehicle is involved in the incident. so for off roading it is bloody useless Yes that's what I've said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reads90 Posted March 29, 2008 Share Posted March 29, 2008 well my insurance say cant use for an 4x4 event and i want to go to korc this sunday so i turned it down because off my insurance No what i am saying is that if a car hits you while you are walking along on a event. You can't claim on the farmers/ event holders insurance as the car made it null and void. Same for roll overs and all that sort of thing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmgemini Posted March 29, 2008 Share Posted March 29, 2008 No what i am saying is that if a car hits you while you are walking along on a event. You can't claim on the farmers/ event holders insurance as the car made it null and void. Same for roll overs and all that sort of thing Sorry but any land owner/organiser MUST have public liability insurance to cover that kind of thing. The vehicle isn't insured at all but members of the public are. Well should be. mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reads90 Posted March 29, 2008 Share Posted March 29, 2008 Sorry but any land owner/organiser MUST have public liability insurance to cover that kind of thing.The vehicle isn't insured at all but members of the public are. Well should be. mike But that is what i am saying. Public liability cover does not cover you / the land owner or anyone when a vehicle is involved in the accendent . So if some poor bloke is hit by a idiot in a car then the person will not be will not be covered by the public liability insurance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orgasmic Farmer Posted March 29, 2008 Share Posted March 29, 2008 The whole issue of liability is great isn't it. Kind of ultimately boils down to how good your lawyer is/how bothered your insurer is to fight it. However, for liability to be proven then some form of negligence has to be displayed. An example might be you go to a pay and play site and it has a route marked EASY, suitable for beginners, and on the first hill someone rolls and injures themselves, or "shallow water, suitable for V8s", and it comes over the bonnet and hydrualics your motor. In these cases the site owners might be made to be liable due to proven negligence and have to pay for damage to persons and property (new truck) from their public liability cover. If however, someone slides down a slippery slope into the side of another vehicle there is no way that the site owner could be held responsible for the actions of the driver. In that case it will be down to the vehicle owners to sort out liability. If both vehicles have minimum third party cover then whoever is held responsible will have to pay (via their insurance) the third parties damage. It is irrelevant that it is a private site. However, the responsible person will have a very hard time convincing their insurer to repair their own damage under a normal comprehensive policy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
najw Posted March 29, 2008 Share Posted March 29, 2008 well my insurance say cant use for an 4x4 event and i want to go to korc this sunday so i turned it down because off my insurance I guess the point is what do you want insurance against? Damaging your own motor or occupants of your own motor - highly unlikely you'll get this as its probably a very high risk Damaging someone elses motor - same applies Accidentally injuring a member of the public or KORC staff - its possible KORC may have insurance in place At the end of the day if you are reluctant to go to an established pay and play site due to insurance queries then off-roading is probably not the hobby for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Sparkes Posted March 29, 2008 Share Posted March 29, 2008 Does anyone recall the incident, within the last couple of years, of a car being recovered from an 'off-road' course at an event sponsored by a Land Rover magazine? Due to an allegedly (better have that word in) piece of inept driving by the recovery vehicle driver, more than one car was pulled into a post, causing a significant amout of damage to the car being recovered. I understood, perhaps incorrectly, that an attempt to claim against either the event organiser, or the recovery driver, was not effective. Failure of an appropriate 'duty of care' by the recovery driver may have been a basis for action, but it would have taken more money than the cost of damage repair to prove the point. I may not have heard the final word on that case, which is why I ask "Does anyone recall ...", as this might give 'real world' experience. As others have said, you can insure race cars while they are competing in races, so you can probably approach the same brokers to get insurance while taking an active role on a Pay and Play site, but I suspect most people take the risk on their own wallet. The premiums give you an comparison to say, after the event, whether it was a good deal of not. Actually I did the same trick when I bought my 38A back in 1999. I decided I could buy from a Dealer, with warranty (insurance), which was the magazine recommended option, or I could buy privately, for less money, keeping the saving (insurance fee) in the bank. It would only be if all that was spent on repairs in the first 12 months that I'd be out of pocket. I backed my own judgement, bought privately, and although I spent some time and money on repars in that first year, I felt I was quids in after 12 months. Ironically, I'd make a different decision wrt Pay and Play, although with a slight distinction, based on if I wanted to develop some basic experience driving on un-metalled roads. If I was being offered a 'Learn what your Land Rover can do' event, perhaps sponsored by a Dealer, or perhaps a National Magazine, then I'd attend, pay the fee, sign the disclaimer, and take the chance. I'd expect to be accompanied by an experienced driver for all or most of my time on circuit. I've done this twice, driving my own vehicle. I would NEVER accept an invitation to come to a Pay and Play site just to 'mess around', on the basis that I'd 'learn what my Land Rover could do'. Red Mist attends such events, and as a beginner it is very difficult to distinguish between those who are genuinely giving you confidence to attempt something you have a 75% chance of succeding in, against those who think it's a real giggle to see someone suffer mis-fortune. Red Mist can also affect the drivers judgement as well, irrespective of the value of any advice given. Yogi, I think you have placed yourself, in another post, in the 'beginners' class, and that is where the invitation to a KORC day came from. I don't know the KORC site, the KORC peope, or who you were going with, so I can't comment specifically on their approach, but you see how I view the situation. If you have been invited, then my 'safe' advice is to attend, but only go round the course as a passenger in the experienced persons car. After that person has explained what is going on, the pros and cons of different actions, and you have experienced the results, do you have some information and experience to make a decision on whether it's what you want to do. The bottom line is that you will be insuring yourself, I'd say for anything up to £500.00. The recovery home and repair might be less, especially if you do mechanical work yourself, or you can live with dented bodywork, so won't go for a showroom standard repair. But you have to have the CASH available. By available I most CERTAINLY DO NOT MEAN by using a Credit or Loan facility. HTH. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yogibear47.lee Posted March 29, 2008 Author Share Posted March 29, 2008 so ur saying i can stall go to a play and pay site even my insurance so i can do 4x4 events Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest diesel_jim Posted March 29, 2008 Share Posted March 29, 2008 so ur saying i can stall go to a play and pay site even my insurance so i can do 4x4 events it's your car, you can go wherever you like with it..... however,it pretty much boils down to "you bend it, you mend it" you're better off going to a P&P site with the mental attitude of "this is private land, and thus my insurance won't be valid, therefore i'd better be careful" as opposed to "i'm gonna drive it like i stole it, then ring the accident helpline on monday morning and ask for a new gearbox/wing/roof etc" If you're really keen on pay & play sites and really want to "play", my suggestion is to buy a cheap old banger, and trash it. use your daily driver to tow it there on a trailer, job done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Sparkes Posted March 29, 2008 Share Posted March 29, 2008 I agree with what Diesel_Jim has just said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madcowz Posted March 29, 2008 Share Posted March 29, 2008 My insurance (NFU) covers me fully comp while driving off road anywhere (public or private) as long as it is not in a competition. I double checked with them that this includes pay sites. Will dig out the docs later just to check though... /mad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
western Posted March 29, 2008 Share Posted March 29, 2008 I'm with NFU too & have the same as you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yogibear47.lee Posted March 30, 2008 Author Share Posted March 30, 2008 that alright then its 2 late to go today i will have 2 go to next months cheers for the info Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GBMUD Posted March 31, 2008 Share Posted March 31, 2008 NFU too. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sotal Posted March 31, 2008 Share Posted March 31, 2008 Lancaster were offering free non competitive off road cover with your policy when I took a policy with them - not sure if they still do though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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